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  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by franklin View Post
    Do you really blame them for taking that stance?
    I'm not big on blame. Howqever, I will say that your reasons are rationalizations. The primary reasons for wanting that land is a sense of entitlement with a religious source.

    Do you acknowledge Israel has helped create, and its policies continue to exacerbate, the conflict?
    http://lifetheuniverseandonebrow.blogspot.com/

    Isaiah 1:18 -- Come now, and let us reason together

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  2. #77
    Senior Member jazzyapma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stoked View Post
    So basically you are saying it was their land, they were forcibly removed and are now returning home to find someone living in their house?
    Pretty much. But after 2 millenia, do they have the right to claim the land for themselves? That's the debate.
    Last edited by jazzyapma; 11-21-2012 at 11:20 AM.
    Burke- Burks- Burked.

  3. #78
    Senior Member jazzyapma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Brow View Post
    concur: agree with
    conquer: to take over (usually with a military)
    My bad.
    Burke- Burks- Burked.

  4. #79
    Moderator Stoked's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Brow View Post
    I'm not big on blame. Howqever, I will say that your reasons are rationalizations. The primary reasons for wanting that land is a sense of entitlement with a religious source.

    Do you acknowledge Israel has helped create, and its policies continue to exacerbate, the conflict?
    Yes but not anymore than Hamas. I reject the popular trend of supporting Hamas and denouncing Israel. If I had to choose what wagon to hitch my horse to it would be Israel without a doubt.
    #BelieveInLindsey

  5. #80
    Moderator Stoked's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzyapma View Post
    Pretty much. But after 2 millenia, do the have the right to claim the land for themselves? That's the debate.
    Well if you agree with the premise that it is their house...
    #BelieveInLindsey

  6. #81
    Senior Member jazzyapma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stoked View Post
    Well if you agree with the premise that it is their house...
    Then the American Indians have every right to claim te US soil for themselves.
    Burke- Burks- Burked.

  7. #82
    Senior Member franklin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Brow View Post
    Howqever, I will say that your reasons are rationalizations. The primary reasons for wanting that land is a sense of entitlement with a religious source.
    & they've stated a willingness to give it up contingent on border changes accounting for new demographics and security concerns. Again, Palestinian attacks are the reason they took it over and now occupy it. Palestine deserved to lose the land they were initially given & now have an opportunity to gain some of it back by agreeing to peace.

    Quote Originally Posted by One Brow View Post
    Do you acknowledge Israel has helped create, and its policies continue to exacerbate, the conflict?
    Isn't that what politics almost always does?
    No Mediocrity

  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by franklin View Post
    & they've stated a willingness to give it up contingent on border changes accounting for new demographics and security concerns.
    You're conflating the Israeli publoic at large with the politically powerful group that are its religious conservatives.
    http://lifetheuniverseandonebrow.blogspot.com/

    Isaiah 1:18 -- Come now, and let us reason together

    Any habitual action, such as eating or dressing, may be performed on the appropriate occasion, without any need of thought, and the same seems to be true of a painfully large proportion of our talk. -- Bertrand Russell

  9. #84
    Senior Member franklin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Brow View Post
    You're conflating the Israeli publoic at large with the politically powerful group that are its religious conservatives.
    What solution do you propose?
    No Mediocrity

  10. #85
    Senior Member jazzyapma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by franklin View Post
    What solution do you propose?
    I propose Israel to leave Gazza.
    Burke- Burks- Burked.

  11. #86
    Senior Member addictionary's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzyapma View Post
    Let me tell you a story:

    Once there was a great empire and many slaves were obedient to the king. Then a man organized the slaves and left the kingdom with them, claim a land to their own, found a couple of cities. Another great empire came by force and conquered their land. They were homeless again, scattered around the world in the process. They learned that the economy is everything, so they sticked to the trade. They grew economically and became a force which cannot be conquered: pot of gold. Many diffrent people conquered their land and lived, they only had an idea when they would "buy" their land again. So when they think the time is right, they directed the biggest empires which became victorious from a world war, with their financial power to conquer their land for them. Many of the people come to their forefather's land, and since then, they are trying to kick out the people who live there for centuries after they left.
    everybody loves money. joo s just need to shoot it in the vein.


    David Locke: "Because what happens in this league is, people start shooting threes and they get soft and donít want contact and then they just stay out there all the time. Youíre not going to get soft, are you?"
    Enes Kanter: "I kind of live in the paint, man. Come on. I wonít get soft. Donít worry about that."

    4.17.14

  12. #87
    Moderator Stoked's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzyapma View Post
    Then the American Indians have every right to claim te US soil for themselves.
    They actually have large swaths of it (example: Navajo Nation) and can live anywhere they want on it.
    #BelieveInLindsey

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  14. #88
    Moderator Stoked's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzyapma View Post
    I propose Israel to leave Gazza.
    I propose that the palestinian people remove Hamas from power and expunge them from their society.
    #BelieveInLindsey

  15. #89
    Senior Member GVC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by franklin View Post
    I guess I don't get Palestine's angle at all. They have a chance for a UN recognized nation and peace but choose to continuous fighting instead.
    Uh huh, sure.
    http://jazzfanz.com/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=133&dateline=1317382587

  16. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by franklin View Post
    What solution do you propose?
    Solutions are nice and neat. There is no solution. All we can do is direct and reduce the conflict. However, that won't happen if we are kidding ourselves about its source.l
    http://lifetheuniverseandonebrow.blogspot.com/

    Isaiah 1:18 -- Come now, and let us reason together

    Any habitual action, such as eating or dressing, may be performed on the appropriate occasion, without any need of thought, and the same seems to be true of a painfully large proportion of our talk. -- Bertrand Russell

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