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Thread: Gun Control

  1. #676
    Senior Member Sneakers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stoked View Post
    But it is a very real possibility. Plus it is simply my right wether you like it or not.
    No, America suddenly becoming a Naziesque fascist state is not a very real possibility. That's called paranoia
    Long Live JYD

  2. #677
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sneakers View Post
    Ok then I'm not in favor of banning what you technically refer to assault rifles. I'm interested in banning weapons that meet the criteria I mentioned. It should be obvious we aren't talking about the same thing. Don't get lost in the details.
    The problem is that everything except muzzle-loaders, pump-action shotguns and bolt action rifles meets your criteria. So all revolvers, all pistols, many rifles legitimately used in hunting (as a little bit of a side note, AR-15s are regularly used to hunt coyotes, but semi-automatic rifles can and are used to hunt deer as well as semi-auto shotguns used to hunt birds).

    So you want to ban 90% or more of the guns people own today.

  3. #678
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sneakers View Post
    No, America suddenly becoming a Naziesque fascist state is not a very real possibility. That's called paranoia
    Says you. There are plenty of people who think it's far more likely to happen than getting killed in a mass shooting. And they (we) think your sudden urge to ban guns is the real paranoia.

  4. #679
    Senior Member Sneakers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gameface View Post
    The problem is that everything except muzzle-loaders, pump-action shotguns and bolt action rifles meets your criteria. So all revolvers, all pistols, many rifles legitimately used in hunting (as a little bit of a side note, AR-15s are regularly used to hunt coyotes, but semi-automatic rifles can and are used to hunt deer as well as semi-auto shotguns used to hunt birds).

    So you want to ban 90% or more of the guns people own today.
    I already said how naive my gun understanding is. Surely if I was enacting any sort of plan I would take a closer look and have all the information, like what you're providing, in front of me and cognizant in my mind. So don't try and snowball me.
    Long Live JYD

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    Senior Member Sneakers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SaltyDawg View Post
    Says you. There are plenty of people who think it's far more likely to happen than getting killed in a mass shooting. And they (we) think your sudden urge to ban guns is the real paranoia.
    You're right, there are plenty of irrationally paranoid people.

    A fascist uprising is more likely than another mass shooting? I like how you call it a sudden urge, as of it was brought on by absolutely nothing.
    Long Live JYD

  6. #681
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sneakers View Post
    I already said how naive my gun understanding is. Surely if I was enacting any sort of plan I would take a closer look and have all the information, like what you're providing, in front of me and cognizant in my mind. So don't try and snowball me.
    I'm not trying to snowball you. I'm providing information. I feel like we're on the verge of new and improved gun regulations that are based on Myths, half-truths and outright lies. I'd like to do my small part to inform the supporters of these new measures of the ineffective, illogical and damaging effects these measures will have.

  7. #682
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sneakers View Post
    You're right, there are plenty of irrationally paranoid people.

    A fascist uprising is more likely than another mass shooting? I like how you call it a sudden urge, as of it was brought on by absolutely nothing.
    A tyrannical government stripping away my rights and freedoms is FAR more likely than me getting killed in a mass shooting.

    Substitute "me" for "you" and it's equally true.

  8. #683
    Senior Member Sneakers's Avatar
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    Dude. You. Are. Paranoid.

    And yes while the odds of me, or you getting murdered in one of these massacres is statistically low. Replace the pronoun with "loved one" and the odds increase, albeit by very little. Replace "loved one" with "acquaintance" and the odds go up more. Replace acquaintance with "child" and now we're talking bigger odds here. Replace child with "innocent person" and I'd say that yes, definitively, the odds of an innocent person being murdered in a shooting massacre is higher than the US government suddenly trying to take over. This isn't just about protecting my own ass. It's the general principle.
    Long Live JYD

  9. #684
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sneakers View Post
    Dude. You. Are. Paranoid.

    And yes while the odds of me, or you getting murdered in one of these massacres is statistically low. Replace the pronoun with "loved one" and the odds increase, albeit by very little. Replace "loved one" with "acquaintance" and the odds go up more. Replace acquaintance with "child" and now we're talking bigger odds here. Replace child with "innocent person" and I'd say that yes, definitively, the odds of an innocent person being murdered in a shooting massacre is higher than the US government suddenly trying to take over. This isn't just about protecting my own ass. It's the general principle.
    Okay, so then you admit the chances that you, your loved ones, and anyone you've ever met, being shot in a mass shooting, are pretty minimal. Yet you're pushing this draconian regulation to strip people of their rights and freedoms, in order to supposedly reduce the already minimal chance of it happening.

    And you have the nerve to say I'm the paranoid one, lol.

    The government has been stripping away rights and freedoms for some time now. If you think it's unlikely to happen, while it's happening and been happening for years, you're much worse than paranoid.

    One could even make the argument that you're actually part of the problem, since you're here promoting the degradation and stripping of constitutional rights, and somehow acting like it's any of your business what products I keep in my own home.

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    hahahahaha
    OBEEZY is A commie

    or much worse hahahahahaha
    01-21-2013
    I, HeavenHarris, hereby pledge to my fellow JFC'rs that I will no longer give out neg-reps. All it does is cause negative things, like fights, drama, bitching, ill will, bad feelings, etc.
    Love, not hate, is the answer bros and moes.

    LOL Lol breaks his pledge 5 days later hahahaha

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  12. #686
    Senior Member Sneakers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SaltyDawg View Post
    Okay, so then you admit the chances that you, your loved ones, and anyone you've ever met, being shot in a mass shooting, are pretty minimal. Yet you're pushing this draconian regulation to strip people of their rights and freedoms, in order to supposedly reduce the already minimal chance of it happening.

    And you have the nerve to say I'm the paranoid one, lol.

    The government has been stripping away rights and freedoms for some time now. If you think it's unlikely to happen, while it's happening and been happening for years, you're much worse than paranoid.

    One could even make the argument that you're actually part of the problem, since you're here promoting the degradation and stripping of constitutional rights, and somehow acting like it's any of your business what products I keep in my own home.
    Yes man, and I'm sure I'm not alone in stressing the fact that being more wary of a hostile government take over by the US that has an exactly 0 chance of happening is more paranoid than being wary of another unneeded massacre. But let's move on from that. What are your guns supposed to do against government drones, tanks, missles, etc. anyway? Are you more upset about the idea gun regulation or at the idea of the government limiting what you can do in any capacity? What is this really about?

    There's a lot I don't like about the government, but I refuse to buy into these totalitarian nightmare delusions. I understand the need for checks and balances outside of the government system, but where I won't agree is that somehow mass and uninhibited gun ownership is the only way to do this.

    I also don't get is where you got this idea that you're allowed to do whatever you want regardless of how it impacts other people. So is it none of my business if you're keeping anthrax in your home? Or if you decide to purchase a wrecking-ball without any idea how to use one? Like it or not you're in a social contract with everyone else in society. It's like the person who bitches because they get fined for letting their yard grow out of control, like it or not the look of your yard affects other persons' property value. I get it, you're a strict libertarian, but there's rules to how this thing operates.

    I don't give a **** if you have a handgun. I don't care if you have a hunting rifle, a shotgun or a mother****ing crossbow. I do care if you didn't have to get thoroughly checked out before you were allowed to own those things, and if you have weapons with more capability then you'd ever hope of utilizing for any conceivable practical purpose. And this paranoid attitude that is rearing its ugly head more and more over the course of this debate has me concerned as well.

  13. #687
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sneakers View Post
    Yes man, and I'm sure I'm not alone in stressing the fact that being more wary of a hostile government take over by the US that has an exactly 0 chance of happening is more paranoid than being wary of another unneeded massacre. But let's move on from that. What are your guns supposed to do against government drones, tanks, missles, etc. anyway? Are you more upset about the idea gun regulation or at the idea of the government limiting what you can do in any capacity? What is this really about?

    There's a lot I don't like about the government, but I refuse to buy into these totalitarian nightmare delusions. I understand the need for checks and balances outside of the government system, but where I won't agree is that somehow mass and uninhibited gun ownership is the only way to do this.

    I also don't get is where you got this idea that you're allowed to do whatever you want regardless of how it impacts other people. So is it none of my business if you're keeping anthrax in your home? Or if you decide to purchase a wrecking-ball without any idea how to use one? Like it or not you're in a social contract with everyone else in society. It's like the person who bitches because they get fined for letting their yard grow out of control, like it or not the look of your yard affects other persons' property value. I get it, you're a strict libertarian, but there's rules to how this thing operates.

    I don't give a **** if you have a handgun. I don't care if you have a hunting rifle, a shotgun or a mother****ing crossbow. I do care if you didn't have to get thoroughly checked out before you were allowed to own those things, and if you have weapons with more capability then you'd ever hope of utilizing for any conceivable practical purpose. And this paranoid attitude that is rearing its ugly head more and more over the course of this debate has me concerned as well.
    You may think there is a 0 percent chance of this country becoming a police state, and there are probably plenty of people who agree with you, I don't argue against that. But trust me, there are plenty of people who share my views on this as well. And we're not all the right wing nut jobs that you apparently think we are. Funny, I was being called a liberal political hack on this site as recently as a few weeks ago.

    Yes, I think I should be allowed to buy drones, tanks, etc, if the police have them. As long as the police have them, I should be able to get them too. If the police aren't allowed to have them, then that's another story. But if the police have them, then I should absolutely be able to buy them too.

    You don't get why I think I should be able to do whatever I want as long as I'm not hurting anyone else? Um, should I welcome you to America? Lol, this is the land of the free, that's why I think we should be free.

    Yes, I absolutely should be able to purchase a wrecking ball, whether I know how to use it or not. If I damage your property with it, then I should obviously be liable for that. If I don't damage your property with it, then it's none of your business whether I own a wrecking ball or not.

    I'm torn on the lawn thing. Yes, I think I should be allowed to let my yard get as ugly as I want. However, if it causes my neighbor's property value to go down then I should probably be liable for that. Or maybe not, maybe they should be free to move away from me if they don't like it. I don't know about that one. It's not an issue in my neighborhood though, it's kind of a contest to have the nicest yard, so I haven't really thought about that too much.

    The yard thing is different than what I have hidden in my house, though. You can see my yard from my neighbor's house, you can't see the inside of my safe. What I have in that safe is none of your business. If I cause some harm to you with whatever I had in that safe, THEN it becomes your business.

    This is America, you can't seriously be attempting to punish me for a crime that will probably never be committed. And make no mistake, telling me I can no longer buy certain things that I like absolutely is a punishment.

    The capability of my weapons is none of your business. If I do something wrong with one of those weapons, then you might have a reason to restrict what weapons I can have. But until then, what I do, and what I own, is none of your business. That's not me being paranoid. Paranoid is you telling me that it's okay for you to be all up in my business, restricting my rights, in order to prevent a crime that even you admit is extremely unlikely to ever be committed by or against anyone that either of us will ever meet.

  14. #688
    Moderator Stoked's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sneakers View Post
    No, America suddenly becoming a Naziesque fascist state is not a very real possibility. That's called paranoia
    Have fun having your private cell phone conversations, emails and all other electronic forms of communication monitored without a court order.
    Have fun talking to police in case you buy to much fertilizer.
    Have fun being hit with a criminal record if you are a CC permit holder and take your gun to the wrong state.
    Have fun being an immigrant and being held indefinately.
    State and Federal police can now search a home or business without an order or even the owners knowledge that they are searching under certain conditions.
    Have fun having your financial records being searched thru without your knowledge or consent.

    All allowable under the law now and in clear violation of our rights. You want to talk about paranoid? Fine, but pull your damn head out of the sand first.

    No, I do not think that they will ban guns and when I wake up tomorrow I will see Brown Shirts in my town telling people when they can move about, how much food they can buy and who they can talk to. However I do think that you will continue to see a systematic and gradual reducing of our rights until the people stop it. We cans top it thru voting and opposing uncosntitutional measures thru the courts and having them repealed.
    #BelieveInLindsey

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    Quote Originally Posted by SaltyDawg View Post
    So should the police stop carrying guns then, like England? Good luck passing that.

    Or are you saying we should have a class based society where a few elites have all the guns? And we can be sure that nobody will ever steal them...
    I think you can have cycles of escalation and cycles of de-escalation. Stripping US police, today, of guns would be foolish. Over a few decades, we might reach the point where the guns weren't needed.
    http://lifetheuniverseandonebrow.blogspot.com/

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stoked View Post
    More mass shooting are with a rifle but the number of dead from handguns far exceeds the number of dead from the few mass shootings every year.
    I agree. However, based on constitutional law, even if I agreed there should be no personal guns (and I don't think that's currently feasible even without the SCOTUS ruling), making personal weapons illegal will not happen. So, I'd rather look at areas where a difference, however small, can be made.
    http://lifetheuniverseandonebrow.blogspot.com/

    Isaiah 1:18 -- Come now, and let us reason together

    Any habitual action, such as eating or dressing, may be performed on the appropriate occasion, without any need of thought, and the same seems to be true of a painfully large proportion of our talk. -- Bertrand Russell

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