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  1. #241
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stoked View Post
    To start with, racism is racism. The only thing that truly varies is the degree to which it may be praticed. You indicate that I only see racism as sever cases. Not true. It can be as simple as someone reffering to a racial group by using racial slurs. They do not have to actively oppose that group. It can be much more subtle than that.
    ...
    I stand here proudly and reject your notion that every member of mankind is racist. Why? because I know those that are not. I hope to be as good as them.
    I would consider the use of racial slurs to be an overt action. So, what I got from your post is that you see racism as consisting of overt actions, the intentional slurs, intentional decisions, etc. That's what I said your position was earlier. Perhaps I am still misunderstanding somehow. Now, if you take the position that racism requires overt actions and words, I would agree with you that it is rapidly becoming socially unacceptable, and is fading from our culture. When I talk about the racism prevalent in our culture, I don't mean an outright refusal to associate, deny admittance, etc. Of course we have made progress there. So, were I to limit racism in the manner you seem to, I would agree with you.

    AS for what I do mean, I've discussed several examples in this thread already. I'm not going to repeat them right now, but I'm willing to discuss them if you so choose. I do think they examplify racism, but not of the sort you seem to want to restrict that definition to.

    An interesting parable on the subject:
    http://thetyee.ca/Books/2012/09/15/Too-Asian-Allegory/
    http://lifetheuniverseandonebrow.blogspot.com/

    Isaiah 1:18 -- Come now, and let us reason together

    Any habitual action, such as eating or dressing, may be performed on the appropriate occasion, without any need of thought, and the same seems to be true of a painfully large proportion of our talk. -- Bertrand Russell

  2. #242
    Moderator Stoked's Avatar
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    I've also given examples of racist thoughts.

    You try so hard to paint the world in this negative light. I will never see the world thru such a negative lens. I refuse and to be honest it makes me sad that you do.

    I just deny your definition of racism. Pure and simple.
    #BelieveInLindsey

  3. #243
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkwing Duck View Post
    Racism, or irrational bias based on one particular phenotype that doesn't actually exist biologically, is based in biology. Humans are biologically inclined to trust, like, and associate with those most similar to them. Culture actually breaks humans from that bias, or it can help perpetuate it. Culture is not the root of racism.
    I'm having a little trouble putting your post together. Are you saying skiin color does not exist biologically or that is is not a biological phenotype? I would disagree, and it seems like the rest of your post would, also. I disagree that culture changes the preference of many (possibly most) people to associate with those most similar; I think culture can direct the traits that define what is most important to being similar. So, in one culture ear shape may be significant, in another it may be insignificant. In modern US culture, skin color is still considered significant in many respects. Thus, the culture teaches racism.
    http://lifetheuniverseandonebrow.blogspot.com/

    Isaiah 1:18 -- Come now, and let us reason together

    Any habitual action, such as eating or dressing, may be performed on the appropriate occasion, without any need of thought, and the same seems to be true of a painfully large proportion of our talk. -- Bertrand Russell

  4. #244
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    Quote Originally Posted by silesian View Post
    Onebrow, I can only comment on what you said, which is that people who study racism believe it to be an action, not a thought or opinion.
    Since when can actions be divorced from thoughts and opinions? You took what was meant to be inclusive, and made it dichotomous. I agree that there is little more to be discussed, which I attribute to your insistance on that dichotomy.
    http://lifetheuniverseandonebrow.blogspot.com/

    Isaiah 1:18 -- Come now, and let us reason together

    Any habitual action, such as eating or dressing, may be performed on the appropriate occasion, without any need of thought, and the same seems to be true of a painfully large proportion of our talk. -- Bertrand Russell

  5. #245
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Brow View Post
    Since when can actions be divorced from thoughts and opinions? You took what was meant to be inclusive, and made it dichotomous. I agree that there is little more to be discussed, which I attribute to your insistance on that dichotomy.
    Lol. Actions comes from thoughts and opinions. Thoughts and opinions do not always lead to action.

    I'm sorry that you insist that we are all racist. I deny you.

    I think at this point we can go back to making fun of each other in a good natured way. There is no way to bridge the gap on our views of racism.
    #BelieveInLindsey

  6. #246
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stoked View Post
    You try so hard to paint the world in this negative light. I will never see the world thru such a negative lens. I refuse and to be honest it makes me sad that you do.

    I just deny your definition of racism. Pure and simple.
    You have the priviledge not using my lens, and denying my definition. That's the potato.
    http://lifetheuniverseandonebrow.blogspot.com/

    Isaiah 1:18 -- Come now, and let us reason together

    Any habitual action, such as eating or dressing, may be performed on the appropriate occasion, without any need of thought, and the same seems to be true of a painfully large proportion of our talk. -- Bertrand Russell

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  8. #247
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stoked View Post
    Thoughts and opinions do not always lead to action.
    Not to intentional action, sure. How can your thoughts and opinons fail to inform your judgement?
    http://lifetheuniverseandonebrow.blogspot.com/

    Isaiah 1:18 -- Come now, and let us reason together

    Any habitual action, such as eating or dressing, may be performed on the appropriate occasion, without any need of thought, and the same seems to be true of a painfully large proportion of our talk. -- Bertrand Russell

  9. #248
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Brow View Post
    Not to intentional action, sure. How can your thoughts and opinons fail to inform your judgement?
    I am sure if you wanted to you would be able to think of numerous thoughts that you have had that you never acted on.
    #BelieveInLindsey

  10. #249
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stoked View Post
    I am sure if you wanted to you would be able to think of numerous thoughts that you have had that you never acted on.
    Yes, I agreed with that part.
    http://lifetheuniverseandonebrow.blogspot.com/

    Isaiah 1:18 -- Come now, and let us reason together

    Any habitual action, such as eating or dressing, may be performed on the appropriate occasion, without any need of thought, and the same seems to be true of a painfully large proportion of our talk. -- Bertrand Russell

  11. #250
    Senior Member Darkwing Duck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Brow View Post
    I'm having a little trouble putting your post together. Are you saying skiin color does not exist biologically or that is is not a biological phenotype? I would disagree, and it seems like the rest of your post would, also. I disagree that culture changes the preference of many (possibly most) people to associate with those most similar; I think culture can direct the traits that define what is most important to being similar. So, in one culture ear shape may be significant, in another it may be insignificant. In modern US culture, skin color is still considered significant in many respects. Thus, the culture teaches racism.
    Race does not exist biologically in humans. Percent of melanin content is way too arbitrary, and fairly unimportant anyway, in the genetic makeup of humans to be used as a defining categorization.

    The conclusion that skin color is significant in culture means the culture teaches racism is off target. Way too general a statement. I can make any statement based on that structure.

    In [random culture], this [categorical characteristic] is significant. Thus [pejorative stereotyping] is taught.

    Ridiculous.

    Race is a social construct. Not a biological one. Doesn't mean it's 100% pejorative.


    Quote Originally Posted by negative reputation giver
    youre inquires are tiresome

  12. #251
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Brow View Post
    You have the priviledge not using my lens, and denying my definition. That's the potato.
    Any person can look at the world thru any lens they want. You have that priveledge as well. You are responsible for the way that you view the world. Not society or anyone else. You.
    #BelieveInLindsey

  13. #252
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    I just wanted to give props to OB for the reverse trolling in this thread in honor of Sloanfeld.

    I'm guessing it's your ironical attempt to poke fun at the reverse racism title.
    TREYBOT

  14. #253
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    grammar tip for the day

    Quote Originally Posted by One Brow View Post
    Since when can actions be divorced from thoughts and opinions? You took what was meant to be inclusive, and made it dichotomous. I agree that there is little more to be discussed, which I attribute to your insistance on that dichotomy.
    "A not B" is the basic logical structure of a dichotomy, which is the structure used in your sentence.

    "And" is the conjunction used to express non-contrasting ideas

  15. #254
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkwing Duck View Post
    Race does not exist biologically in humans. Percent of melanin content is way too arbitrary, and fairly unimportant anyway, in the genetic makeup of humans to be used as a defining categorization.

    The conclusion that skin color is significant in culture means the culture teaches racism is off target. Way too general a statement. I can make any statement based on that structure.

    In [random culture], this [categorical characteristic] is significant. Thus [pejorative stereotyping] is taught.

    Ridiculous.

    Race is a social construct. Not a biological one. Doesn't mean it's 100% pejorative.
    I agree with the first paragraph, and thank you for expanding on what you meant. Skin collr is a biological phenotype, but not the sort that can be used to a sensible classification/categorizaiton.

    I agree the mere existence of consideration that a characteristic is significant does not, in adn of itself, mean discriminaiton occurs. I would not, and do not, claim that this is sufficient evidence for racism to be a part of US culture. It is necessary, but not sufficient.
    http://lifetheuniverseandonebrow.blogspot.com/

    Isaiah 1:18 -- Come now, and let us reason together

    Any habitual action, such as eating or dressing, may be performed on the appropriate occasion, without any need of thought, and the same seems to be true of a painfully large proportion of our talk. -- Bertrand Russell

  16. #255
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stoked View Post
    Any person can look at the world thru any lens they want. You have that priveledge as well. You are responsible for the way that you view the world. Not society or anyone else. You.
    Unfortunatlely, sometimes reality slaps you in the face when you are indiscreet in using that priviledge. When I say "you have the priviledge", that means you are much less likely to be slapped in the exercise thereof.
    http://lifetheuniverseandonebrow.blogspot.com/

    Isaiah 1:18 -- Come now, and let us reason together

    Any habitual action, such as eating or dressing, may be performed on the appropriate occasion, without any need of thought, and the same seems to be true of a painfully large proportion of our talk. -- Bertrand Russell

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