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campaignist said:
Well, they have Jerry West. There's no way the big names aren't considering that. Cap space and some good pieces
help too.

I dunno. The only superteams that have successfully formed via Free Agency were the Heatles and Durant.
And GS got lucky with the cap spike. I just wouldn't count on it happening. I'd just prepare to maximize the opportunity.
Beyond Kawhi, I'd target Harris as top priority, even with his price tag.
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I'd argue Pat Riley is better than West with recruiting etc... he hasn't done **** without Wade in that area. I think those names get you in the room. I also don't see Kawhi as a guy that would communicate to team up with other guys and that other guys would have a relationship with to have any sway. I think they have a real shot at Kawhi by himself.
 
LoPo said:
If Nico gets $25, he is immediately the next Ryan Anderson. I wouldn't pay that at all. An injury prone defensively limited PF shooter like Nico is not worth 24% of our cap.
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He's got a more diverse offensive game and does better on defense. He also isn't injury prone. Missed 17 games last year because a guy broke his face with a punch in practice. He's not an iron man but you could bank on the league average of around 70 games a year.

I think you can get better value for your money, but I'd rather have Niko at 25M than Terry at 20M.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
He's got a more diverse offensive game and does better on defense. He also isn't injury prone. Missed 17 games last year because a guy broke his face with a punch in practice. He's not an iron man but you could bank on the league average of around 70 games a year.

I think you can get better value for your money, but I'd rather have Niko at 25M than Terry at 20M.
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I like Mirotic, but $25 is a whole lot. Outside of his punch, I thought he missed something like 15 games each the two seasons before that. And he has been banged up this year a little and about to go out for a week or so.

He just seems like the type guy you regret having if you overpay. Is he going to become Chandler Parsons or Ryan Anderson if he gets $20+?

As for Rozier, I'm not really sure what his market is. Hard to tell.

If it was me, I would give Randle $25+ and not hesitate for a second. Tobias too.
 
Jingled said:
Land a bigger player next offseason? Like who? We have to remember this is still Utah we're talking about. The biggest fee agents we've landed are Boozer, Memo and Joe Johnson. Booz and Memo were still young, unproven players when we signed them and we had to overpay to get them to sign here. Lucky for us they developed extremely well and lived up to their contracts, and possibly even out performed them. As for Johnson, he was well past his prime when he signed here. Were he still in his prime we wouldn't of had a snowballs chance in hell at landing him.

Tobias is absolutely worth the max. Niko and Randle are not, but in order to land them or players at their level we are going to have to overpay and hope that it works out as well as it did with Boozer and Okur.
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I think people are selling the Mitch/Gobert and co duo short on their ability to recruit somebody. It's all about winning now, less about market.

^ You missed that part of the quote.
 
LoPo said:
I like Mirotic, but $25 is a whole lot. Outside of his punch, I thought he missed something like 15 games each the two seasons before that. And he has been banged up this year a little and about to go out for a week or so.

He just seems like the type guy you regret having if you overpay. Is he going to become Chandler Parsons or Ryan Anderson if he gets $20+?

As for Rozier, I'm not really sure what his market is. Hard to tell.

If it was me, I would give Randle $25+ and not hesitate for a second. Tobias too.
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So did a little digging... Niko missed 15 games his second year because he had to have an appendectomy. So he's missed like 45-50 games over his 5 year career and 30 of those were related to an appendectomy and getting punched in the face.

Not injury prone at all... the Parsons (serious... guy had a bunch of knee issues when he was signed) and Anderson comps are not fact based at all. If you don't like him that's fine, but let's not just throw out "injury prone" as the reason when it's not true at all.
 
LoPo said:
If we are talking about the summer, my PF priorities go as follows (and these are in the realm of reality so no KD, Kawhi, etc.):

#1 - Tobias - very unlikely, but possible
#2 - Randle - if we are willing to pay a bunch, we can be in the hunt. I have a bad feeling he is going to go to hometown Dallas and they are going to be really, really good soon.
#3 - Mirotic - I have my concerns, but I'd love to have him at Favors money or less.
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Randle great move. He's so good. But I don't think he's a good fit in quin's system. Especially if the resign Rubio which I'm pretty certain they will. Randle needs the ball in his hands to create
 
Shad said:
We all want Harris or Mirotic but we're the jazz. We need to lower our expectations to someone 2 keys below that player if anyone
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We can absolutely sign a Mirotic or Harris. It’s the LBJ’s Durant types we can’t sign. Get your head out of the 90’s
MDAV28 said:
Unless the Jazz really can't turn it around, which I doubt, I can't imagine they'd offer Niko, Randle, Tobias near max money. They'll pick up Favors option and try to land a bigger player next offseason, which is the absolute right move.

I think people are selling the Mitch/Gobert and co duo short on their ability to recruit somebody. It's all about winning now, less about market.
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Maybe I’m wrong, but isn’t Mitchell a free agent after next year. If we don’t spend money this year it all goes to mitchell the following year. We need to take advantage of DM’s rookie contract this year. If I’m right this might be the last chance to really build a contender unless we get lucky in the draft.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
I may already hate myself for this suggestion... but rumor is Houston want to offload Brandon Knight and a 1st for KCP. If it was a real first (not so heavily protected it will never convey) I'd consider it.

Brandon has lost the last two years (basically) to injury. He may never be the player he was before... but the idea of Brandon Knight is kind of what I'd put next to DM. He had some flaws, but showed some real promise on his rookie deal. He seems like an intelligent kid. His physical profile reminds me of George Hill.

He just made his G League injury start and looked solid. Numbers are just okay, but didn't look like a ton of rust.



There is significant risk that he can never stay healthy.
There is some risk he won't be what he was or develop further.

BUT..... He could have just been unlucky. He could be like Gallo pre-season where they likely would have given assets to get off his money and now he's healthy. $15M is the price of a first anyway... getting some production would be bonus.

We aren't the types to take that kind of gamble though... We won't give up our cap dreams for BK. This isn't a real idea in that sense... more of a what if. I'm still slightly intrigued by Brandon Knight... I also hate myself a little.
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You said Houston wants to offload Brandon Knight and a first for kcp.
But we don't have kcp so I don't see how we factor into Houston wanting to make that trade.

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Thee jazz fan said:
We can absolutely sign a Mirotic or Harris. It’s the LBJ’s Durant types we can’t sign. Get your head out of the 90’s


Maybe I’m wrong, but isn’t Mitchell a free agent after next year. If we don’t spend money this year it all goes to mitchell the following year. We need to take advantage of DM’s rookie contract this year. If I’m right this might be the last chance to really build a contender unless we get lucky in the draft.
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You're exactly right except that we have this offseason AND next offseason before Mitch is off his rookie deal. This is why I think the Jazz swing big, but have also protected themselves in case of strike out with the Favors option. And if Rubio comes back I would imagine it would be on a similar deal Faves got to maintain flexibility for 2020.
 
MDAV28 said:
Sure but guys like Tobias didn't eat up the majority of the cap space allowing them to fill roster out better top to bottom.
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Still. You said you want to follow the Spurs model. To do that you have to draft the best big in the NBA (or second best cause shaq) who is also a top 3 guy in the league, then draft a top 4 point guard, then draft the best 6th man in the NBA and maybe the best of all time, and have popovich.

I see all that as extremely unlikely.

I think it's more likely that we can add Harris and he plays at an all star level next to the best defensive player in the league who also plays efficient offense and makes the all Star team, along with all star DM, and Joe Ingles playing as one of the best role playing glue guys in the league, and a solid bench unit.

Having a big three, but not necessarily all time greats with solid role players and some ok depth seems more likely than what the Spurs did.

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fishonjazz said:
Still. You said you want to follow the Spurs model. To do that you have to draft the best big in the NBA (or second best cause shaq) who is also a top 3 guy in the league, then draft a top 4 point guard, then draft the best 6th man in the NBA and maybe the best of all time, and have popovich.

I see all that as extremely unlikely.

I think it's more likely that we can add Harris and he plays at an all star level next to the best defensive player in the league who also plays efficient offense and makes the all Star team, along with all star DM, and Joe Ingles playing as one of the best role playing glue guys in the league, and a solid bench unit.

Having a big three, but not necessarily all time greats with solid role players and some ok depth seems more likely than what the Spurs did.

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I should have clarified the Spurs model of being solid top to bottom. I realize the top is a very hard bar to reach, I was more speaking to the 7-12 roster spots.

I think you lose a lot of the solid role players when you pay Harris is the problem with this plan.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
So did a little digging... Niko missed 15 games his second year because he had to have an appendectomy. So he's missed like 45-50 games over his 5 year career and 30 of those were related to an appendectomy and getting punched in the face.

Not injury prone at all... the Parsons (serious... guy had a bunch of knee issues when he was signed) and Anderson comps are not fact based at all. If you don't like him that's fine, but let's not just throw out "injury prone" as the reason when it's not true at all.
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I stand corrected. I knew he missed time and I know he is banged up now. Thanks for clearing it up.

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I just ran some numbers and it IS possible for the Jazz to sign a Tobias to a 25M per and still have considerable cap space in 2020 (28-30M) if they were to keep with the one-year guarantees in the 2019 offseason. After that though, they will be absolutely strapped after Mitchell's extension.

I could see a scenario where the Jazz sign a Middleton/Harris to 25M per, possibly resign Rubio to a similar deal to Faves (1+1 team controlled) and then fill out the roster with more expirings.
 
fishonjazz said:
You said Houston wants to offload Brandon Knight and a first for kcp.
But we don't have kcp so I don't see how we factor into Houston wanting to make that trade.

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Sorry... the rumor stated that Houston would want KCP in the Ariza to LA deal but they need a third team with expirings or parts Phoenix would want. They are looking for a team to take BK with a first and give back expirings.
 
MDAV28 said:
I just ran some numbers and it IS possible for the Jazz to sign a Tobias to a 25M per and still have considerable cap space in 2020 (28-30M) if they were to keep with the one-year guarantees in the 2019 offseason. After that though, they will be absolutely strapped after Mitchell's extension.

I could see a scenario where the Jazz sign a Middleton/Harris to 25M per, possibly resign Rubio to a similar deal to Faves (1+1 team controlled) and then fill out the roster with more expirings.
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Unless there is an injury both those guys will get the max... so 32M.

Too many teams with space... not enough FAs will change hands. The upper tiers gonna make serious money.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Unless there is an injury both those guys will get the max... so 32M.

Too many teams with space... not enough FAs will change hands. The upper tiers gonna make serious money.
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Yeah that would make the money A LOT tighter. We'd have to say goodbye to most of our roster.

There are a lot of FAs as well though so while teams are panicking to get the top of the class, some good players could be had on team friendly deals.
 
the word is Clippers are going to go hard for Kawhi and Durant Swiping Harris while they do that would be awesome

Anyone who pays Mirotic 25 mil is a lunatic
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Unless there is an injury both those guys will get the max... so 32M.

Too many teams with space... not enough FAs will change hands. The upper tiers gonna make serious money.
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Harris at 32 >> Mirotic at 25.

Actually, I don't want Mirotic at 25m at all.

Not that we'll get either.
 
Alfalfa said:
Harris at 32 >> Mirotic at 25.

Actually, I don't want Mirotic at 25m at all.

Not that we'll get either.
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I agree somewhat. I think I'd rather have Niko at 25M than just roll status quo. I'd be nervous as hell about it and there isn't tremendous value.

I don't know that he gets that much... he's cooled after his opening hot streak. I'd be somewhat shocked if he got anything less than $20m per though.
 
MDAV28 said:
Yeah that would make the money A LOT tighter. We'd have to say goodbye to most of our roster.

There are a lot of FAs as well though so while teams are panicking to get the top of the class, some good players could be had on team friendly deals.
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Kind of why I've advocated getting guys in now on deals that seem kind of bad. OP Jr., Tim Hardaway, Gallo if the price was only expirings.

There are like 10-12ish teams that have max space... some will have 2 max slots. If Toronto/GS/Mil/Clips retain their guys all of a sudden there is slim pickings. Sacramento and BKN both have like $50M in space... which means no young guy with potential will go for an "under-market value deal". FAs will have a ton of leverage.

I think there will be some value in the MLE type market... but we could play in that market without cap space.
 
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