View Poll Results: Which player would you rather have next summer?

Voters
22. You may not vote on this poll
  • Mo Williams

    9 40.91%
  • Jose Calderon

    13 59.09%
Page 3 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 42
  1. #21
    Senior Member NAOS's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Jazz Forum
    Posts
    16,005
    Mentioned
    86 Post(s)
    Total Rep Points
    29195
    Rep Adjustment Power
    100
    If Toronto moves Bargs, then we might be able to trade them Al for Jose. I'd support this all day.
    {size/HUGE} RUDY {/size}
    Pres. & CFO of Sefolosha Fan Club (PM for details)

  2. # ADS
    Circuit advertisement
    Join Date
    Always
    Location
    Advertising world
    Posts
    Many
     

  3. #22
    Senior Member infection's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Utah
    Posts
    4,129
    Mentioned
    3 Post(s)
    Total Rep Points
    12116
    Rep Adjustment Power
    68
    The most important thing a PG can do is distribute. The second most important thing they can do, almost as important as passing, is having the ability to shoot from the outside. Every decent PG we've ever had fit these two criteria (Stockton, Williams, Crotty, Eisley to a much lesser extent [not as much passing]). We've picked up a number of guys that are proficient passers but not shooters and it hasn't been all that great (Mark Jackson, Brevin Knight, Earl Watson, Jacque Vaughn), then we pick up a few guys that few guys that do neither (Price, Hart), then there are a couple that are more difficult to evaluate due to limited time (Arroyo, Lopez, Mo Williams to an extent).

    I think Calderon is a no brainer. Maybe he can't play defense, but if he can distribute and then just stand there and simply be a threat to hit from the outside.

  4. #23
    Senior Member NAOS's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Jazz Forum
    Posts
    16,005
    Mentioned
    86 Post(s)
    Total Rep Points
    29195
    Rep Adjustment Power
    100
    Quote Originally Posted by infection View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    The most important thing a PG can do is distribute. The second most important thing they can do, almost as important as passing, is having the ability to shoot from the outside. Every decent PG we've ever had fit these two criteria (Stockton, Williams, Crotty, Eisley to a much lesser extent [not as much passing]). We've picked up a number of guys that are proficient passers but not shooters and it hasn't been all that great (Mark Jackson, Brevin Knight, Earl Watson, Jacque Vaughn), then we pick up a few guys that few guys that do neither (Price, Hart), then there are a couple that are more difficult to evaluate due to limited time (Arroyo, Lopez, Mo Williams to an extent).

    I think Calderon is a no brainer. Maybe he can't play defense, but if he can distribute and then just stand there and simply be a threat to hit from the outside.
    the questions are these:

    1. what would the jazz give up this year to acquire him?
    2. what would it take to get him to SLC as a free agent?

    As per 1: IMO, the realistic list is limited to our own expiring contracts. Essentially, the teams agree to swap dudes that probably won't be on their teams next year. Millsap is more valuable and productive than Calderon, so that deal is off the table; TOR isn't giving more than Calderon to acquire Millsap because they most likely won't be able to retain him. As I've already said, I'd swap him and Al immediately; but the only way that goes down is if TOR moves Bargs or another big man, because they aren't in need at the moment.

    As per 2: Do the jazz have to give an extra year? Do we have to pay too much? I'd absolutely hate a 4-year deal. I'd hate a 3-year deal for the wrong price. Maybe he comes here for the right price at two years since he sees an opportunity to start for a competitive team, but that is a hard bargain.

    My only interest is an Al swap. That'll at least give him an audition before we were to negotiate our own contract.
    {size/HUGE} RUDY {/size}
    Pres. & CFO of Sefolosha Fan Club (PM for details)

  5. #24
    Senior Member infection's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Utah
    Posts
    4,129
    Mentioned
    3 Post(s)
    Total Rep Points
    12116
    Rep Adjustment Power
    68
    Quote Originally Posted by NAOS View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    the questions are these:

    1. what would the jazz give up this year to acquire him?
    2. what would it take to get him to SLC as a free agent?

    As per 1: IMO, the realistic list is limited to our own expiring contracts. Essentially, the teams agree to swap dudes that probably won't be on their teams next year. Millsap is more valuable and productive than Calderon, so that deal is off the table; TOR isn't giving more than Calderon to acquire Millsap because they most likely won't be able to retain him. As I've already said, I'd swap him and Al immediately; but the only way that goes down is if TOR moves Bargs or another big man, because they aren't in need at the moment.

    As per 2: Do the jazz have to give an extra year? Do we have to pay too much? I'd absolutely hate a 4-year deal. I'd hate a 3-year deal for the wrong price. Maybe he comes here for the right price at two years since he sees an opportunity to start for a competitive team, but that is a hard bargain.

    My only interest is an Al swap. That'll at least give him an audition before we were to negotiate our own contract.
    Don't really know or care. I'd just like to move Al to begin moving forward as it would free us up this year and force us not to resign.

  6. #25
    Premium Member fishonjazz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    K-TOWN
    Posts
    43,116
    Mentioned
    126 Post(s)
    Total Rep Points
    94945
    Rep Adjustment Power
    100
    Quote Originally Posted by NAOS View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    the questions are these:

    1. what would the jazz give up this year to acquire him?
    2. what would it take to get him to SLC as a free agent?

    As per 1: IMO, the realistic list is limited to our own expiring contracts. Essentially, the teams agree to swap dudes that probably won't be on their teams next year. Millsap is more valuable and productive than Calderon, so that deal is off the table; TOR isn't giving more than Calderon to acquire Millsap because they most likely won't be able to retain him. As I've already said, I'd swap him and Al immediately; but the only way that goes down is if TOR moves Bargs or another big man, because they aren't in need at the moment.

    As per 2: Do the jazz have to give an extra year? Do we have to pay too much? I'd absolutely hate a 4-year deal. I'd hate a 3-year deal for the wrong price. Maybe he comes here for the right price at two years since he sees an opportunity to start for a competitive team, but that is a hard bargain.

    My only interest is an Al swap. That'll at least give him an audition before we were to negotiate our own contract.
    Great post.
    I would add that there is already a need for toronto at the 4/5 position even if they keep bargnani.... Jonas is injured and not playing much anyways and jefferson is an upgrade (debateable) for toronto over davis, johnson, jonas, or gray and possibly even bargnani.

    However if that trade happened then the raptors would be starting john lucas III. (since lowry is hurt) Not sure they would want to do that.
    Maybe we have to throw in watson or tinsley too.

  7. #26
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Drinkin haterade, ridin the hate train through hateville
    Posts
    17,091
    Mentioned
    52 Post(s)
    Total Rep Points
    48516
    Rep Adjustment Power
    100
    Throw Watson in as player coach and they become a 10 win better team overnight.


    Put some respeck in my paycheck

  8. #27
    In pursuit of #9 Dr. Jones's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    62,121
    Mentioned
    171 Post(s)
    Total Rep Points
    96720
    Rep Adjustment Power
    100
    Quote Originally Posted by franklin View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Throw Watson in as player coach and they become a 10 win better team overnight.
    Haha, enjoyed it!
    Fortune and glory, kid. Fortune and glory.

  9. #28
    Senior Member NUMBERICA's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    15,524
    Mentioned
    4 Post(s)
    Total Rep Points
    21339
    Rep Adjustment Power
    100
    Quote Originally Posted by franklin View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Really? I'll take a biff on this, but isn't that a knock? What's with not scoring much for a guy with good 3 %?

    Literally any team in the league can have him today. Why no takers?
    You're assuming a lot. The Raptors have been trying to find a player to replace him for years (probably as step one in exploring an actual trade attempt) and regardless of who they try to bring in, Calderon always rises to the top. You can call it a coincidence that the Raptors suddenly look competent with Lowry out and Calderon having a sort of explosion, but I wouldn't.

    The guy is a good player. Offensively, the closest thing to prototypical PG in the league despite his poor D.
    "Adversity is opportunity in disguise."

  10. #29
    Senior Member NUMBERICA's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    15,524
    Mentioned
    4 Post(s)
    Total Rep Points
    21339
    Rep Adjustment Power
    100
    Quote Originally Posted by NAOS View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    So, what could be different about Tinsley that would bust your analogy?
    Tinsley can't shoot and is one of the worst defensive players in the league (way worse than Calderon). And quite a bit older. And can't impact the game with any kind of consistency (he'll look great [as great as he can, anyway] one night, then be invisible the next. This might have to do with his age and that his battery is poor).
    "Adversity is opportunity in disguise."

  11. #30
    Senior Member NAOS's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Jazz Forum
    Posts
    16,005
    Mentioned
    86 Post(s)
    Total Rep Points
    29195
    Rep Adjustment Power
    100
    So you're saying it was a broken comparison right from the get-go?

    Let's not even start the conversation about what it takes/took to acquire both players.

    Some brown stuff all over this.
    {size/HUGE} RUDY {/size}
    Pres. & CFO of Sefolosha Fan Club (PM for details)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
About Us
We are a community of Utah JazzFanz that are passionate about our team. We celebrate the highs that come with last second heroics and (some of us) cry in defeat. Welcome to our community. Be respectful of others and join in to the conversation...
Join us