2020 Presidential Election

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by White Chocolate, Jul 20, 2019.

  1. Stoked

    Stoked Well-Known Member Contributor 2018 Award Winner

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    So basically your answer is fear. You’re afraid they’ll make the same mistakes. You’re afraid they’ll do things poorly.

    Under the ACA there were multitude of plans. Drs were refusing ACA coverages and were still making tons of money through traditional insurances. that’s not a possibility if we have single payer or all Drs are required to take all insurances...
     
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  2. JazzyFresh

    JazzyFresh Well-Known Member

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    A) where is the money coming from to implement all of this?

    B) Canada's already waiting over a month for basic services. They have 291 million less people.

    C) I dont buy it. Not all people are insured just image when every single human is insured.
     
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  3. Stoked

    Stoked Well-Known Member Contributor 2018 Award Winner

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    Personally I say we should make everyone eligible for Medicare but can opt out if they choose. Having another health insurance being a requirement to do so.

    I’d spend our money on that before a lot of other things.
     
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  4. JazzyFresh

    JazzyFresh Well-Known Member

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    Somewhat but there's also the fact that it shouldn't be my responsibility to insure every single person. I love my current plan. I have zero issues with it and don't need the government to treat me like a child and regulate me.
     
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  5. JazzyFresh

    JazzyFresh Well-Known Member

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    I'm fine with this just let me opt out of the tax hike as well. Problem with this is that no doctors would opt in to make government mandated money.
     
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  6. Stoked

    Stoked Well-Known Member Contributor 2018 Award Winner

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    Make it so all Drs have to take all insurances. Problem solved
     
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  7. JazzyFresh

    JazzyFresh Well-Known Member

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    Sounds a little communistic but that seems to be where were heading anyways.
     
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  8. Zombie

    Zombie Well-Known Member

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    It's coming from the money we are currently paying for Healthcare, along with savings via better negotiating power with providers and lower administrative costs.

    The US spends $3.5 Trillion dollars per year in Healthcare costs (and growing), most of that coming out of the pockets of our employers and ourselves.

    Canada has waiting lists for some things it's true, it's not for things that are life threatening, like emergency surgery or cancer treatment, but for things like hip replacements, etc. I'd argue waiting is better than not being able to afford it at all. You'll notice they aren't exactly falling all over themselves to dismantle their current system and the let free market step in to "solve the problem."

    Canada's population is also far less concentrated than our own, which leads to a lot of their problems.
     
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  9. Zombie

    Zombie Well-Known Member

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    Do you have any idea what communism is?

    (Hint- what Stoked described is not communism, like, at all)
     
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  10. The Thriller

    The Thriller Well-Known Member

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    We pay about 19 percent of our GDP for health care.

    The next closest country is Germany, at about 12 percent.

    The UK and Canada are between 8-10 percent GDP.

    If we want to cut costs then a single payer system where Medicare for all or the British National Healthcare System is a now brainer.

    What some posters are doing is taking a page from what republicans did in 2010 when they attempted to scare low information voters about the long-term costs of the ACA. They claimed it would cost trillions of dollars. Which was true. But what they neglected to say was the cost of the status quo, which was trillions more than the ACA.

    Will Medicare for all cost trillions? Absolutely. But it’ll save money in the long-term when compared to the trillions more we’re already spending with our dysfunctional “free market” system.
     
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  11. Stoked

    Stoked Well-Known Member Contributor 2018 Award Winner

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    Taking all the big ideologies, capitalism, communism, socialism...and applying them all in nuanced ways to create a whole often leads to better over all policies than going whole hog on one ideology.
     
  12. JazzyFresh

    JazzyFresh Well-Known Member

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    If your first two paragraphs were true why must we substantially raise taxes? Particularly the rich who will be paying 50+%?
     
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  13. JazzyFresh

    JazzyFresh Well-Known Member

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    I can't argue with that.
     
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  14. Zombie

    Zombie Well-Known Member

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    The answer to the first question is obvious if you take a couple seconds to think about it.

    As for the second, it's not necessarily the case that the richest among us must have their taxes increased substantially more than the rest of us to pay for this program. That is probably borne out of Sanders belief that our current tax system isn't progressive enough. But that's a separate issue.
     
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  15. fishonjazz

    fishonjazz Well-Known Member Contributor 2019 Award Winner 2018 Award Winner

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    Naos knows how to spell moron but he was intentional spelling it as moran for added meaning.

    Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using JazzFanz mobile app
     
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  16. JazzyFresh

    JazzyFresh Well-Known Member

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    Just to be a prick.
     
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  17. fishonjazz

    fishonjazz Well-Known Member Contributor 2019 Award Winner 2018 Award Winner

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    You seem to just automatically assume the worst possible case scenario whenever anything other the status quo is presented.

    Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using JazzFanz mobile app
     
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  18. The Thriller

    The Thriller Well-Known Member

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    Btw, for those interested:

    https://www.statnews.com/2019/03/22/affordable-care-act-controls-costs/

    And:

    The 4 main types of health care models.

    Essentially:

    1: Germany, Japan, and France have a free market system where insurance is still the primary provider, but they’re nonprofit and heavily regulated.

    2: UK runs its health care system like public schools. Hospitals and doctors are public facilities and employees.

    3: Canada maintains private hospitals and doctors, but they’re reimbursed by one health care plan, Medicare.

    All systems have an optional add on insurance for gyms, vision, cosmetic surgery, anything extra that isn’t covered by the primary system.

    4: Our dysfunctional system, which basically combines all 3 above, plus for profit insurance, and is impossible to regulate or keep costs down. It’s the worst delivery system in the world. But it does make big Pharm, insurance companies, and a handful of doctors filthy rich. They then use their wealth as “free speech” to kill any kind of health care reform in congress.

    http://www.pnhp.org/single_payer_resources/health_care_systems_four_basic_models.php
     
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  19. fishonjazz

    fishonjazz Well-Known Member Contributor 2019 Award Winner 2018 Award Winner

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    Ok chicken little.

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  20. JazzyFresh

    JazzyFresh Well-Known Member

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    Let the big boys talk please.
     
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