Chill Folks

[gomretat]

Before the season began, many of us said the Jazz were somewhere around a 30 - 32 win team. This is what a 30 win team does people. They have ups and downs - times of good basketball and times of bonehead mistakes. We have young players figuring out where they fit and how to play. We have deficits in some key areas like PG play and outside shooting. We have veterans who are wondering what their role is and wondering when the youth movement will take over. The Jazz will get better. They will learn how to finish more effectively. Ty will get more comfortable with his hands at the wheel in a number of different situations. The list can go on, but this is what being a 30 win team does. We are who we are.

 

[Dr. Jones]

I want to see better substitutions/distribution of minutes, now.

We talk about Al being a black-hole in the post. I think the same can be said of Ty with his handling of the roster ...

 

[Grandpa Jazz]

We are who we are.

Categorically deny this post (Chill Folks). I am weary to the bone of hearing these types of things. Have been hearing them roll out of Jerry for years and years. Quote" I am excited to play this game, see who we are", "Quote: "We are who we are" followed by an explanation that we are not good shooters, not tough enough, not athletic and a litany of things we can't do. Bull****, we are who we let ourselves be!! Quote: " I never told them not to guard the three point shot". My absolute most infuriating thing to ever come from Jerry. No Jerry, you didn't tell them not to defend it, but you did tell them to be somewhere else (sagging off and defending the paint) rather than staying with their man. Why? because the three is a low percentage shot. Well it was, during Darrell Griffiths day (when he was the only one allowed to actually shoot one) but today it is the weapon of choice. Today the NBA is a knife fight and our knives are 2 feet long while the opponents are three feet long. Join the 21st century or this fan of the Jazz from the beginning of this team in Utah will just quit paying attention altogether. I realize this is a "rant", but i realized last night in the middle of the third quarter that the Jazz would lose that game. Why? Because i have seen this movie before, hundreds of times actually and it played out as if i had written the script myself. ENOUGH!!!!

 

[gomretat]

, we are who we let ourselves be!!

Putting words in my mouth Gramps. No one is saying let it be. And I am not saying be content. I am saying that all rebuilding teams and young teams go through this. I am saying those who predicted in the neighborhood of 30 wins appear to be correct at this point. This is what teams that are around .500 do. This has nothing to do with Jerry saying they should have guarded the 3 pt line. That is comparing apples to oranges. This year is new territory for the Jazz since the Stockton and Malone era. So again I say, Chill.

 

[Grandpa Jazz]

So again I say, Chill.

See the thread "3 pointers" that's what i agree with. Agreed this team was not going to be great from the start, we all know that, but its not just wins and losses it's about how you play the game. I'm just saying that
the Jerry way is so deeply ingrained into this franchise it could hold us back for another ten years. I'm saying encourage your players too work for situations where they can spot up for a three, encourage them to take them when
available and most of all when the game is on the line do not leave a great shooter unguarded at the three line. If unguarded these guys shoot as well from there as a good free throw shooter does from 15 ft.

Lastly, this is not "new Territory" since the Stockton Malone ERA" because that expired 2-3 years after their last game. We can't use that premise forever. It's more the new territory after the Williams Boozer ERA. And that doesn't really
qualify as an ERA.

In short, i should chill (and will) for my own health. But you misunderstand why i'm ranting. It's not about losing last night, it's about HOW they lost and that it was unnecessary. Youth is not an excuse. Who was
on the floor when that game was lost? That was not a "young" team.

 

[Revolution 9]

It's not the losing that concerns me it's who is being played. I'm ok with trying to make the playoffs, and playing the vets until a point.
That point has come. The Vets got the the mins, and have FAILED. So it's time to let our high draft picks get a shot.

 

[YB85]

To quote Dick Vermeil, "It's time to take the diapers off". Let Favors, Kanter, and Burks play. What are they going to do, lose games?

 

[chawx]

"Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." - Albert Einstein

I'm with Gramps... set player substitutions and lack of emphasis on guarding the 3-pt shot have been the Jazz's downfall for the last 2000+ games I've watched. They were able to mask it a lot better in the Stock/Malone Era because Stockton and Malone were freaks of nature and could win games despite a coaches/other teammates best efforts to give it away.

Listen to the real Big Al (Albert Einstein) when he said that quote above...we need to start doing some things different and a good place to start would be getting away from having a set rotation on substitutions of players AND the lack of emphasis on guarding the 3-pt shot.

 

[NCJazz]

To quote Dick Vermeil, "It's time to take the diapers off". Let Favors, Kanter, and Burks play. What are they going to do, lose games?

Perhaps time for KOC and Greg to have a chat with Ty and tell him that we approve of playing the young guys bigger minutes. At this point letting the young guys play and getting two lottery picks is the best thing. Sorry, even if Howard has a decent game playing him 30 minutes + is not helping our future. Wish we also had a young PG we could see from time to time.

 

[cowhide]

Putting words in my mouth Gramps. No one is saying let it be. And I am not saying be content. I am saying that all rebuilding teams and young teams go through this. I am saying those who predicted in the neighborhood of 30 wins appear to be correct at this point. This is what teams that are around .500 do. This has nothing to do with Jerry saying they should have guarded the 3 pt line. That is comparing apples to oranges. This year is new territory for the Jazz since the Stockton and Malone era. So again I say, Chill.

+100 for Grandpa Jazz comments. It was as though he was reading my mind. Yes all rebuilding teams go through growing pains but the Jazz as an organization seem content with just being in the playoffs. Al most every rebuilding franchise play their high draft picks a significant amount. It is so frustrating when the Jazz are playing guys who are not even part of the future. Now if we were 23-8 I could see playing the veterans, but we are 15-17 and the young guys are getting less time. I don't see Cleveland limited their two top draft picks. They are only a couple games behind us but their two rookies are getting experience and have already improved.

 

[Revolution 9]

"It's time to take the diapers off"

Sounds like something Sloan once said to CJ.....

 

[Beantown]

Don't tell me what to do.

 

[Hantlers]

I'm not as mad about losing games as I am about the way that we're losing. We aren't showing any heart, we aren't seeing good coaching, we aren't seeing the young guys develop. We all knew we were going to lose games, but we thought we would be able to see our young guys develop and get good playing time at the same time. It's just disappointing that we're losing with veterans instead of our young guys.

 

[Revolution 9]

Just brang this home tonight from the brewery around the corner. Cheers to all of you. Let's relax, drink, and forget all of our Jazz worries.....

PROST!!

 

[Jerry Lundegaard]

The thing about Ty Corbin that had me so worried (to say the least) during the preseason was how inexperienced and reactionary he appeared to be at the end of last season, and during the preseason.

If you recall in last night's Minnesota game they fouled immediately to extend the game, where as the game before against the Spurs he opted to play it out and take his chances with the defense getting a stop - and getting the ball back with like 4 or 5 seconds. Jefferson iced us with a 3 and we were toast.

Either strategy has worked, and can be justified.. I just am disturbed that he most likely chose to foul immediately last night because of how the Spurs game unfolded.

Like many, I feel his rotations leave much to be desired but I also think there's a strong possibility the rotations and PT is based on KOC's desires. Perhaps to showcase guys they want to trade, or just as evaluation for such a young team moving forward. At least that's what I hope for Ty's sake. If that's not the case, then Ty is just in over his head.

But lets make one thing clear - I don't think if Ty had established a set rotation and let guys get comfortable in their roles form the get go we'd have that many more wins. Certain guys may be playing better, or more consistent, but we still lack a solid point guard. Last night's loss sucked a fat one because I had this sick feeling when we were cookin' that Minn was going to come storming back, and we'd fold like a tent.

I highly doubt last night's loss will be a character builder, or a good learning experience, as Ty tried to sugar coat us with in his quotes to the media.

Hayward is the key to our success with the roster we have because he's the most versatile perimeter threat we have as far as creating for himself and/or others, but he is still playing scared. He needs that killer instinct/competitive edge that all good NBA players have.

 

[squareinthecircle]

Good stuff there Gramps.

 

[m3at]

To quote Dick Vermeil, "It's time to take the diapers off". Let Favors, Kanter, and Burks play. What are they going to do, lose games?

I'm ready for this. I say trade Big Al, Sap and Harris for an upgrade at PG and an upgrade at SG and let the yougins figure this game out. I would rather lose games knowing that the young guys are developing instead of losing games knowing that they are not developing. I love Al and Sap and I think Harris is a good enough person, but they aren't the future, so let's get started on the future already.

 

[gomretat]

We can all make a list of the things we wish were different - I have a long list myself. Whether or not you have a tizzy fit about how they guard the 3 pt line is not the point. Whether or not the Jazz turn the time over to the young uns right now or not is a great debate but still not the point. What we are going through is what every team goes through that decides to build primarily through the draft. This is the normal part of that gig and it is new territory in Utah.

I do disagree that this team is content to simply be in the playoffs though I think it was true until last year. That was what we had with Deron, Booz and Memo - a team that had no chance of contending but was a lock for the playoffs. The decisions to leave that era behind demonstrates that they want to do something different.

 

[NCJazz]

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Just brang this home tonight from the brewery around the corner. Cheers to all of you. Let's relax, drink, and forget all of our Jazz worries.....

PROST!!

Where is the Natie Light?

 

[squareinthecircle]

I'm ready for this. I say trade Big Al, Sap and Harris for an upgrade at PG and an upgrade at SG and let the yougins figure this game out. I would rather lose games knowing that the young guys are developing instead of losing games knowing that they are not developing. I love Al and Sap and I think Harris is a good enough person, but they aren't the future, so let's get started on the future already.

I'd like to keep Sap as a top shelf 6th man. He will have good value in that role.