Conley irrelevant...

JazzBird

Well-Known Member
I was never a big fan of the Conley trade. though hes a solid player hes not a great defender and for the money he costs jazz could have just kept crowder and someone else and had mitchell run the point.
Its not like Snyder has his PG bring the ball up every play and initiate the offense, we see mitchell bringing the ball up, Ingles can initiate the offense clarkson, Mudiay, why was conley a must to bring in???

Sure i get the floor spacing he brings over a Rubio but if one is going to let rubio go to improve spacing why not just move mitchell over to point where hes a better defender and a better shooter?

I just think the jazzs obsession with trying to acquire conley the last few years was a case of not being able to see the forest through the trees and was unnecessary.
 

Thee Idiotic Minivan K

Well-Known Member
I was never a big fan of the Conley trade. though hes a solid player hes not a great defender and for the money he costs jazz could have just kept crowder and someone else and had mitchell run the point.
Its not like Snyder has his PG bring the ball up every play and initiate the offense, we see mitchell bringing the ball up, Ingles can initiate the offense clarkson, Mudiay, why was conley a must to bring in???

Sure i get the floor spacing he brings over a Rubio but if one is going to let rubio go to improve spacing why not just move mitchell over to point where hes a better defender and a better shooter?

I just think the jazzs obsession with trying to acquire conley the last few years was a case of not being able to see the forest through the trees and was unnecessary.
He’s a good player. I wasn’t in favor of the trade either, but was excited about adding another good player, if Quin can integrate him into the system, he adds to our chances at a chip. Might be Quin’s most important coaching job ever.
 
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JazzBird

Well-Known Member
I like adding good players to but at what cost. Conley has a huge contract, instead of having a PG that cant defend id rather the jazz had a bench.

Why make more headaches for oneself, jazz over thought the conley trade got infatuated with a name and meaningless stats and now are stuck with a marginal aging player with a huge contract.

If the jazz wanted marginal players that cant defend there are lots of those guys to be had for a lot cheaper
 

Handlogten's Heros

Well-Known Member
2019 Award Winner
He's not irrelevant. Right now we have guys like Mudiay and JC playing huge roles... those guys may not be able to create and play as well or as much in the playoffs... specifically after the first round. Conley's creation could be big at that point. He has been a gamer in the playoffs in previous years and I think he can get better this year... many of our guys struggled out of the gate.

I still think it would make sense to bring him off the bench... DM is an elite pick and roll guy, Ingles in an elite pick and roll guy, Mike has been in years past. I think defensively it just makes sense to start bigger and maybe close with the Conley, DM, Ingles, Bojan, Rudy lineup. The LA teams pose some matchup issues.

I wonder if we could use his salary better given what we currently know about the roster... the best thing for the team is for him to get back and play well.
 

oneye

Well-Known Member
2018 Award Winner
Agreed. The result speaks for itself.
You’re right playing below .500 teams results speak for themselves lol.

Come on guys. I think there’s an argument you could better use the salary he’s taking up but he will be very needed in the coming month of February and postseason.
 

Handlogten's Heros

Well-Known Member
2019 Award Winner
I like adding good players to but at what cost. Conley has a huge contract, instead of having a PG that cant defend id rather the jazz had a bench.

Why make more headaches for oneself, jazz over thought the conley trade got infatuated with a name and meaningless stats and now are stuck with a marginal aging player with a huge contract.

If the jazz wanted marginal players that cant defend there are lots of those guys to be had for a lot cheaper
In the regular season maybe, but in the playoffs you want more quality and more playmaking. We overpaid slightly in the trade... but corrected it by fleecing Cleveland in the Exum trade. Had we subbed in Exum and kept Crowder then I like it better. I also wanted to limit it to just one pick, but that may not have got it done.
 

Zombie

Well-Known Member
It's a bit too early for a take like this. During the teams recent success we've had a number of things happen. Joe Ingles finding his game in the starting lineup, the bench unit getting upgraded and retooled, Conley going out with an injury, and of course the schedule becoming much easier.

I don't think we can separate Conley out from all of this and say that this proves we don't need him.

Imagine an alternate scenario where we didn't have Conley on the roster to start the year-with the games he's missed we'd probably have a pretty similar record. Now imagine we pick up a guy who put up 21 pts and 6 asts a game the previous year halfway through this season. I think we'd all be pretty ecstatic about what that meant for the ceiling of this team.
 

infection

Well-Known Member
Staff member
2018 Award Winner
2019 Award Winner
It's a bit too early for a take like this. During the teams recent success we've had a number of things happen. Joe Ingles finding his game in the starting lineup, the bench unit getting upgraded and retooled, Conley going out with an injury, and of course the schedule becoming much easier.

I don't think we can separate Conley out from all of this and say that this proves we don't need him.

Imagine an alternate scenario where we didn't have Conley on the roster to start the year-with the games he's missed we'd probably have a pretty similar record. Now imagine we pick up a guy who put up 21 pts and 6 asts a game the previous year halfway through this season. I think we'd all be pretty ecstatic about what that meant for the ceiling of this team.
Nah, he'll come back when our schedule gets really tough and we'll lose some games and everyone will be worried about Conley killing the vibe we had going.
 

JazzyFresh

Well-Known Member
I think people are going to look foolish once playoffs come along and we need him. It's ascinine to think that adding more talent is a bad thing.

People are basing his play off of when the entire team was struggling. It's still going to take time but he only makes this team better, not worse.
 

Zombie

Well-Known Member
Nah, he'll come back when our schedule gets really tough and we'll lose some games and everyone will be worried about Conley killing the vibe we had going.
Well, I was talking more about the perspective people have now.

I don't disagree that some people would have a dim view of the "trade" if the Jazz were to start losing games in the alternate scenario when the schedule gets scary.
 

JazzBird

Well-Known Member
Its not whether or not hes a " good" player its whether or not hes worth his contract for what he offers?

How much better does Conley make the Jazz than say if they had kept Crowder the picks and just moved Mitchell over to point?

Mitchell is a better scorer a better shooter and better defender and is developing as as a distributor. Conley has in the past been a better passer but does one really need to spend the kind of money conley is making to distribute the ball when snyder and the league in general isnt in need of an offense where PGs handle the ball and initiate the offense the majority?

As previously stated ingles handles pg duties as does mitchell mudiay and clarkson and pretty much anyone else not named rudy or tony bradley.

Adding conley weakened the bench and as a cost benefit analysis the cost outweighs the benefit IMO
 

Engorged On Unborn Gore

Well-Known Member
I still think it would make sense to bring him off the bench... DM is an elite pick and roll guy, Ingles in an elite pick and roll guy, Mike has been in years past. I think defensively it just makes sense to start bigger and maybe close with the Conley, DM, Ingles, Bojan, Rudy lineup. The LA teams pose some matchup issues.
Sloan used to sub Stockton out early in the first quarter, then have him play with bench units until the fourth quarter. Sometimes Stock would look a little frustrated about it, especially if he was playing well in the first. But he would usually kill teams in the third, when the Jazz essentially won most of their games in those days.

This team is a bit of a third quarter team. Perhaps Snyder could do something similar (pulling Conley early) to get Mike playing more with alt lineups, and enhance our bench strength.
 

Saint Cy of JFC

Well-Known Member
T
Sloan used to sub Stockton out early in the first quarter, then have him play with bench units until the fourth quarter. Sometimes Stock would look a little frustrated about it, especially if he was playing well in the first. But he would usually kill teams in the third, when the Jazz essentially won most of their games in those days.

This team is a bit of a third quarter team. Perhaps Snyder could do something similar (pulling Conley early) to get Mike playing more with alt lineups, and enhance our bench strength.
They do that with Mitchell
 
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