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MVP said:
Ontario and greater Toronto area is certainly more densely populated than North Dakota for example.
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Even adjusted for population density we are seeing far more cases and far more death than we should. Canada has a better health care system. Canada has taken extensive measures To ensure health and safety, like supplying citizens and businesses with relief money that is actually sufficient. Unlike our unemployment benefits, which were a sick joke. They ask strict questions at the border, demand quarantining for 14 days upon entering, and have mask mandates that are strictly followed. Their citizenry by and large are working in a cohesive manner to contain the virus.

America on the other hand has millions of uninsured. Those most vulnerable and uninsured are dying at a much higher clip than those with health care. Americans have resisted efforts to mitigate the virus while demanding that states “open up.” Americans are demanding foot game return. and their prime minister isn’t holding rallies like this:

 
  • Wow
Reactions: MVP
Avery said:
911 cases today. Cases have doubled in the past week.

Just nuts. Utah County 6x higher than the rest of the state.
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My nephew tested positive today. He is 17 or 18. He has a sore throat and congestion and is a little lethargic.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using JazzFanz mobile app
 
Avery said:
911 cases today. Cases have doubled in the past week.

Just nuts. Utah County 6x higher than the rest of the state.
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We had 911 cases today. 408 came from utah county, 338 from salt lake, and 165 from the rest of the state.

Positivity rate is skyrocketing, 16.7. That’s the 2nd highest I’ve seen since mid July once I started recording the positivity rate.

ICU is filling up. Just a week ago we were in the low 60s. Now we are up to 69 percent filled.

On 9/1 we had outbreaks in 25 schools and 125 sick employees/students. We are now up to 63 schools and 371 sick cases. Just on Monday we only had 260 sick cases.

Jordan school district had an emergency meeting yesterday to discuss Riverton high school. The health Dept recommended a 2 week shutdown. The board decided that Thursday and Friday was good enough. And that homecoming activities could continue. so they basically just gave the kids a long weekend.

This isn’t going to end well.
 
Gameface said:
How close are we to herd mentality?
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I know you say this as a joke, but we are actually much closer to herd immunity than people realize. The problem is people conceptualize herd immunity as a theoretical concept where you need 70+ percent of people with immunity, which we translate to mean antibodies. I've been pushing against this for a while now.

June 28:
infection said:
Getting above 50+% of the population infected is so massive. My suspicion would be that it would top out at 25% before it dies down (not suggesting it gets there, just tops out there — at least this strain), and even then I think that may be determined in hindsight, just as a few years later they cake out saying that the actual infection rate of H1N1 was 20%, way higher than originally thought. And with the CDC saying the estimated mortality rate, as of now, is about 0.3%, I’d imagine this runs lower than that.
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June 30:
infection said:
I think herd immunity as a concept is more simplistic in theory than it is in reality, and may function more as a theoretical model than anything else. In any case, I was sharing that tweet not for the comments regarding it but just the graph. With regard to herd immunity, think before vaccines -- how many viruses infected the majority of the population before going away (or, the flips side of how many viruses go away before infecting the majority of the population)? There are way too many variables in the equation with any outbreak of anything, and we generally approach the idea of herd immunity in a vacuum. And I think the concept has been strictly reinforced as a result of public awareness of vaccines and the narrative surrounding them (not saying that's good or bad, just that it's important to know what's informing our assumptions about everything.)
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I post this only to demonstrate the reality always looks like absolute insanity when compared with prevailing notions in society that are reinforced not for their accuracy, but because of their volume and repetition.

Yesterday from the British Medical Journal (one of the top 3-4 regarded medical journals):

www.bmj.com

Covid-19: Do many people have pre-existing immunity?

It seemed a truth universally acknowledged that the human population had no pre-existing immunity to SARS-CoV-2, but is that actually the case? Peter Doshi explores the emerging research on immunological responses Even in local areas that have experienced some of the greatest rises in excess...
www.bmj.com www.bmj.com

What's published here isn't new. It's been known now for a while about people having T cell reactivity against COVID-19 (but universally derided by people with expertise in shaping medical public opinion but without expertise in science or medicine). This would put the herd immunity threshold more in the ballpark of 20-25%. Now, before everyone jumps on "geez that's still huge lol," you can't base this off of confirmed cases, as the seropositive rates are much, much higher. However, this ultimately doesn't matter. Science published doesn't matter because until it starts getting published by non -medical people in the non-medical journal New York Times, or talked about by non-medical people on network and cable news. This will not have any affect on public opinion, and most certainly no affect on public policy until those non-medical folks with the authority to deem something as 'expert' or 'science' decide to do so.
 
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infection said:
It's been known now for a while about people having T cell reactivity against COVID-19 (but universally derided by people with expertise in shaping medical public opinion but without expertise in science or medicine).
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I recall reading about this some time ago, I doubt it was in a medical journal, it must have been in a popular venue, and I factored it somewhat into what I understood might be the case with COVID-19. I recall thinking well, maybe it’s been around before somehow. I don’t recall it being universally derided, at least not at the time I became aware of it. I have also seen herd immunity threshold estimates of about 20%, although most seemed to settle on 40-70%.
 
Red said:
I recall reading about this some time ago, I doubt it was in a medical journal, it must have been in a popular venue, and I factored it somewhat into what I understood might be the case with COVID-19. I recall thinking well, maybe it’s been around before somehow. I don’t recall it being universally derided, at least not at the time I became aware of it. I have also seen herd immunity threshold estimates of about 20%, although most seemed to settle on 40-70%.
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That’s good that you’ve seen that. I just came across this that was posted 14 hours ago:



This is completely ridiculous. This is from a major news organization that wields a lot of influence over public opinion and they don’t know the difference between a case fatality rate and an infection fatality rate. Or, worse, they do know the difference.

But, moreover, what do people trust more: The British Medical Journal, which they’ve likely never heard of, or MSNBC, an institution so large and well known that it be conspiracy theory to suggest that they could get something so wrong?
 
Damn haven't checked this thread in a bit. Full out fear and panic from the same people who swore to me 75,000,000 americans will get sick.
 
JazzyFresh said:
Damn haven't checked this thread in a bit. Full out fear and panic from the same people who swore to me 75,000,000 americans will get sick.
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I know you frequently accused me of fear mongering, for a model that was based on the assumption that absolutely nothing be done. No mitigation. No social distancing, nothing whatsoever. As for fear and panic, the only person who actually seemed to be afflicted with fear and panic was you. I don’t recall anyone describing the terror, how they lived in fear, how they panicked every time the news spoke of the coronavirus. Nobody at all. The only person in this entire thread who kept hopping on fear over the coronavirus, over, and over, and over, and over, was......you, lol. You honestly seem to be the only poster in this thread dwelling on fear and panic. We all die someday. Did you know that? I continue to take precautions due to the coronavirus, but I certainly don’t wake up in the morning, and shake in my boots, like “omg, is this the day?”. Lol. Only you dwell on fear and panic. Why are you so terrified?

And you behave the same way where hatred and vitriol are concerned. In page after recent page, in several threads, you complain about all the hatred directed at you, yet the only one directing the most hateful comments toward several members of this community, over, and over, and over, and over, and over, in all those threads, is......you.

I know people at times have complained about vitriol directed at Republicans by The Thriller, and Dutch could go overboard with anger, yet, in page after recent page, in several threads, I have seen more hatred directed at members here by you than just about anyone else on this forum, in my experience. Your posts appear to be saturated with anger, vitriol, hatred. It’s like you are being consumed by anger and hatred. That’s not healthy, bro. That’s a bad look. I would be embarrassed if I were you. You take projection to heights I have never seen anywhere online, and I frequent quite a few forums.

And it’s the same formula with you, in almost every comment. First, you point out how so and do, or how certain people in general, commit atrocious behavior. Then you launch into that very behavior yourself and spew your vitriol. It’s quite a show, man, quite a show.
 
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Red said:
I know you frequently accused me of fear mongering, for a model that was based on the assumption that absolutely nothing be done. No mitigation. No social distancing, nothing whatsoever. As for fear and panic, the only person who actually seemed to be afflicted with fear and panic was you. I don’t recall anyone describing the terror, how they lived in fear, how they panicked every time the news spoke of the coronavirus. Nobody at all. The only person in this entire thread who kept hopping on fear over the coronavirus, over, and over, and over, and over, was......you, lol. You honestly seem to be the only poster in this thread dwelling on fear and panic. We all die someday. Did you know that? I continue to take precautions due to the coronavirus, but I certainly don’t wake up in the morning, and shake in my boots, like “omg, is this the day?”. Lol. Only you dwell on fear and panic. Why are you so terrified?

And you behave the same way where hatred and vitriol are concerned. In page after recent page, in several threads, you complain about all the hatred directed at you, yet the only one directing the most hateful comments toward several members of this community, over, and over, and over, and over, and over, in all those threads, is......you.

I know people at times have complained about vitriol directed at Republicans by The Thriller, and Dutch could go overboard with anger, yet, in page after recent page, in several threads, I have seen more hatred directed at members here by you than just about anyone else on this forum, in my experience. Your posts appear to be saturated with anger, vitriol, hatred. It’s like you are being consumed by anger and hatred. That’s not healthy, bro. That’s a bad look. I would be embarrassed if I were you. You take projection to heights I have never seen anywhere online, and I frequent quite a few forums.

And it’s the same formula with you, in almost every comment. First, you point out how so and do, or how certain people in general, commit atrocious behavior. Then you launch into that very behavior yourself and spew your vitriol. It’s quite a show, man, quite a show.
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P.S. @JazzyFresh, you also seem to think the world revolves around you. You seem to think a lot of people here owe you something. With your piss poor attitude, nobody here owes you a damn thing.
 
Red said:
I know you frequently accused me of fear mongering, for a model that was based on the assumption that absolutely nothing be done. No mitigation. No social distancing, nothing whatsoever. As for fear and panic, the only person who actually seemed to be afflicted with fear and panic was you. I don’t recall anyone describing the terror, how they lived in fear, how they panicked every time the news spoke of the coronavirus. Nobody at all. The only person in this entire thread who kept hopping on fear over the coronavirus, over, and over, and over, and over, was......you, lol. You honestly seem to be the only poster in this thread dwelling on fear and panic. We all die someday. Did you know that? I continue to take precautions due to the coronavirus, but I certainly don’t wake up in the morning, and shake in my boots, like “omg, is this the day?”. Lol. Only you dwell on fear and panic. Why are you so terrified?

And you behave the same way where hatred and vitriol are concerned. In page after recent page, in several threads, you complain about all the hatred directed at you, yet the only one directing the most hateful comments toward several members of this community, over, and over, and over, and over, and over, in all those threads, is......you.

I know people at times have complained about vitriol directed at Republicans by The Thriller, and Dutch could go overboard with anger, yet, in page after recent page, in several threads, I have seen more hatred directed at members here by you than just about anyone else on this forum, in my experience. Your posts appear to be saturated with anger, vitriol, hatred. It’s like you are being consumed by anger and hatred. That’s not healthy, bro. That’s a bad look. I would be embarrassed if I were you. You take projection to heights I have never seen anywhere online, and I frequent quite a few forums.

And it’s the same formula with you, in almost every comment. First, you point out how so and do, or how certain people in general, commit atrocious behavior. Then you launch into that very behavior yourself and spew your vitriol. It’s quite a show, man, quite a show.
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What am I afraid if? Lol I was never afraid nor will I be. Death does not scare me one bit... I was fighting you all. You lie when you say you weren't fear mongering. You guys literally spent weeks telling me "exponential growth", "I don't understand math", and how stupid I was. You were wrong Red just own it dude. You're(all you guys) blaming me for your wrong doings and isn't going to work with me. A staple in the Communist Party. I see right through you. You posted that 75,000,000-150,000,000 because A) you don't understand numbers B) you wanted those number because it would hurt Trump. This is the length you crazy people will go to. What other reason did you spend weeks telling me 75,000,000 could get sick? Why did you continually try to disprove me when I was so obviously right. Because it would rid you of your Trump addiction if those numbers happened and it's all you have/had. The 75,000,000 sick was worth it and hoped for just because of Trump. You all are maniacally obsessed.

As usual you just see what you want to see. I don't hate anybody. Thriller is close because I truly think he's evil. I could say what I really think but I won't get banned
 
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