Derrick Favors was the best defender in the league last season...

Discussion in 'Utah Jazz' started by r_u_s_t_b_u_c_k_e_t, Jul 9, 2019.

  1. r_u_s_t_b_u_c_k_e_t

    r_u_s_t_b_u_c_k_e_t Well-Known Member Contributor

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  2. Handlogten's Heros

    Handlogten's Heros Well-Known Member 2019 Award Winner

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    Interesting... we will miss him on defense no doubt. He did some great things out there.

    I'm not sure that this is a better way to measure defense. I'm just not sure there is a catch all metric that will ever tell you how good a defender is... based on the results the Draymond method produced I don't think I believe in it. Shabazz Napier was better than Draymond this year? yeah nah.

    I think there are some good metrics that can be used as indicators... but a lot of good defense will be subjective and needs the expert eye test.
     
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  3. Qman

    Qman Well-Known Member

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    The real question is Favors D vs. Ed Davis' D. Is that gap bigger than the Bogdonavic's offense vs. Favors Offense. My guts says we are going to come out ahead.
     
  4. Handlogten's Heros

    Handlogten's Heros Well-Known Member 2019 Award Winner

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    I'm sure there are many here that would like to see that head to head matchup.
     
  5. r_u_s_t_b_u_c_k_e_t

    r_u_s_t_b_u_c_k_e_t Well-Known Member Contributor

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    Good question! Ed shows up as a plus-defender, but pretty far down both lists (5-season and last-season). Bojan is a minus-defender on both, about 2/3 to 3/4 of the way down. If Bojan is sniping like we think he can, we may come out ahead. Or maybe our system will help Bojan get his number up.
     
  6. Handlogten's Heros

    Handlogten's Heros Well-Known Member 2019 Award Winner

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    I think defense is tough to measure... My general stance is if you have an anchor and no absolute sieves then you are likely solid as a team. The guys that anchor the defenses should get the most credit for being good defenders. Rudy, Dray, Embiid, to a lesser extent Turner. The other guys just have to be competent and solid to have a good defense. I think Jeff Green and Bojan are good enough on that end that it won't sink the defense. Ed is smart and his on/off numbers last year were bananas... not sure he is that good, but he is good enough.

    Perimeter guys like Danny Green are tough to measure as well.

    One thing that will help the defense this year... Mike Conley's offense. He is a low turnover guy... Ricky was a high turnover guy... Those turnovers often turned into transition points because the defense isn't set. I also think having Mike run more PnR instead of Joe will help limit the team's turnovers. I think we slide a touch on defense, but that the offense is so much better that no one will complain.
     
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  7. TheStormofWar

    TheStormofWar Well-Known Member

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    FWIW, defense is hard to measure (as mentioned before). Favors will be missed on that end, no doubt what so ever. But some of it is simply eyetest, opinion, and conjecture. Rudy just won the Locksmith Award from the NBPA for the 2nd year in a row. Given this was voted by his peers who play with and against him, that has some merit too. Love 538 though, at least they explain their methodology.

     
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  8. LifeOnaPlate

    LifeOnaPlate Well-Known Member

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    oh stop it :O
     
  9. colton

    colton All Around Nice Guy Staff Member

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  10. idestroyedthetoilet

    idestroyedthetoilet Well-Known Member

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  11. idiot

    idiot Well-Known Member

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    Two (related) things I found interesting from this article (aside from looking at Jazz players' scores):

    1) Nate Silver claims that defensive RAPM
    (not his new DRAYMOND)
    is the best statistic to evaluate defense, though RAPM only works well over long (perhaps multiple-year) periods.

    2) His new DRAYMOND and raw defensive BPM are about equally good/bad at predicting long-term RAPM (though I wish he would have told us how good/bad), but they are not especially closely correlated with one another. In other words, you need both BPM and DRAYMOND to better predict long-term RAPM. (btw, Rubio ends up pretty high with the more comprehensive view).
     
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  12. Ron Mexico

    Ron Mexico Well-Known Member Contributor

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    Favors was really good on defense last year and will be missed at times. But we are upgraded as a team. Plus that stat is equally bad as the rest of individual stats. So many bad rankings of players on it.
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2019 at 4:31 AM
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  13. Revolution 9

    Revolution 9 Well-Known Member Staff Member

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    There's no doubt we'll miss his defense!

    We are trading that for more shooting, and floor spacing.

    We are hoping the difference on offense is big enough to make it worth it. We've seen what Favors and Gobert can do, and I think
    we reached the ceiling. Now, we are taking a risk, but its a risk we have to take.
     
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  14. rjfan

    rjfan Member

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    posibly, but the equation is more complex. favors played on starting pf and backup center, his primary backup at pf were crowder, secondary being niang

    now those rotation spaces gonna be filled by davis at center backup, and at pf it may be some group of players sloting minutes there, bogdanovic, green, o'neal, niang...

    and that's only for the spots where favs played, cause this roster revamp affect others positions too
     
  15. Wes Mantooth

    Wes Mantooth Well-Known Member

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    Listen we were better with Jae on the floor than Favors. Knowing how much of a better shooter Bojan is than Jae, we should be fine. It’s not like Jae was some all-world defender. In fact, where did he rank on that list?
     
  16. Wes Mantooth

    Wes Mantooth Well-Known Member

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    D’angelo Russell ahead of Kawhi lmfao. The Nets sucked on d and he’s not good.

    Trash.

    Just for sag, Jae is 0.32 and Bojan is -0.32. Or something like that. So according to this, Jae is better. But not by that much. And we know Bojan is way better on offense so that bodes well.

    I still want one badass at the 3/4.
     
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  17. idestroyedthetoilet

    idestroyedthetoilet Well-Known Member

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    Leonard's defense slipped significantly last season.
     
  18. Wes Mantooth

    Wes Mantooth Well-Known Member

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    Spare me.
     
  19. idestroyedthetoilet

    idestroyedthetoilet Well-Known Member

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    Spare us, delete that nonsense ^^
     
  20. Ellis269

    Ellis269 Well-Known Member

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    Favors was the consummate pro. Never bitched. Never openly complained. Never pouted about a less-than-ideal role on the team.

    Favors > Exum

    Really wish they would’ve added Exum to the trade for Conley so they could match contracts and operating over the cap.

    Sign and trade for Bojan with Phoenix and Indy (which would’ve been SO easy with Rubio going to Phoenix and T. J. Warren already part of a trade with Indiana.)

    Keep Favors. $17.25 would’ve been a great contract to have at the trade deadline as well.)

    Conley, Mitchell, O’Neale, Bogdanovic, Jingles, Favors and Gobert is a damn good 7 man start for a playoff rotation. Use the full MLE ($9.3 million) on one guy, the BAE ($3.6 million) on another and then trade for a guy using Burks trade exception.

    Add a backup PG, a stretchy 4 and another wing. Between those three and Niang, and you’re all set. Too bad they had to go another route. Oh well.
     

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