If whites moved out of the US.....

[LogGrad98]

https://www.cnsnews.com/news/articl...s-moved-out-usa-how-would-it-solve-inner-city

Interesting article about inner city problems and poverty. From a black perspective.

"You always have to begin with a solution in mind," Woodson told CSPAN Tuesday morning in a discussion on poverty. "I tell people, what is your solution? If all whites tomorrow were to move to Canada and Europe, tell me how it would affect the black on black crime rate, how would it it affect the out-of-wedlock births, how would it affect the spread of AIDS? How would it affect those issues?" he asked.

"What I'm saying to Black America, we must stop victimizaton. We must stop complaining about what white folks have done to us in the past. We must go into ourselves, as Dr. King said, and find indelible ink -- our own emancipation proclamation."

 

[trailing]

I thought Dr King died like in the 60s or something like that, isn't that why we celebrate Dr King day? Anyway whoever this impostor is he seems like a bright fellow, I really really agree with him about the "anti-poverty programs". Most of them are shams.

 

[Deleted member 848]

https://www.cnsnews.com/news/articl...s-moved-out-usa-how-would-it-solve-inner-city

Interesting article about inner city problems and poverty. From a black perspective.

I am cringing way the **** hard.


If all the whites left, it would be reasonable to conclude that the blacks would try to change American society into a society that did not insitutionally discriminate against their own race. Posts and opinions like these merely sedate Americans, and prevent them from coming to terms with America's very real race problem.

 

[babe]

I am cringing way the **** hard.


If all the whites left, it would be reasonable to conclude that the blacks would try to change American society into a society that did not insitutionally discriminate against their own race. Posts and opinions like these merely sedate Americans, and prevent them from coming to terms with America's very real race problem.

I think the "race problem" is not the real problem. I know you don't wanna give conservatives much credit, but I like people who are hopeful and who sorta take the hand of God and walk with it. Here's one example:

Love is the solution for black mothers, for the black family and for America.

“Love endures all things. Love never fails” (1 Corinthians 13:7-8).

https://www.bondinfo.org/blog/dear-mamas-open-letter-single-black-mothers

.
.
BOND stands for "Brotherhood Organization of a New Destiny" primarily serving the black community but willing to work for others with similar problems, conceived principally as the consequence of not having a strong father figure in the home. With an angry mom in no mood for dealing with the street boys, the question arises of how to break a cycle of fatherless homes. Our government assistance has been a cause principally because it created a circumstance where black women could get better support if they kicked the man outta the house so they could qualify for assistance from the government. We have to change those equations and fix it so the family will be economically rewarded for staying together.

People sticking together and helping one another through hard times is what generates upward mobility. Maybe you could think of that in regard to your own family history and see the point. It might or might not really have anything to do with "conservative" or "liberal", "religious" or "secular", but the core reality that we need one another to "Stand, and Deliver" through the hard times in life.

Sometimes he is pretty hard to listen to, and a cringe or two is called for, but mostly I like folks who can stand up say what they think, particularly if it's not something you can get on the mainstream media. I recognize that a lot of people who are not thoroughly indoctrinated in the "acceptable opinions" of our day have some points of merit, even if they may seem "ignorant" to elites.

The slavers who brought blacks here did lose many of the people on the way, and the survivors suffered immensely, and the institution of slavery was an abysmal horror reprehensible to anyone with a rudimentary love for freedom, but however bad or evil all that was, there is no reason we can't all just go out today and make something of the opportunities we have in this country. black or white, we are free. Only our "liberal" welfare policies are holding the economic trap together, and we can change all that.

Anybody who will take immediate action addressing immediate problems can move on up in this country.

 

[DutchJazzer]

I am cringing way the **** hard.


If all the whites left, it would be reasonable to conclude that the blacks would try to change American society into a society that did not insitutionally discriminate against their own race. Posts and opinions like these merely sedate Americans, and prevent them from coming to terms with America's very real race problem.

like in africa, the predominantly black countries. it would flourish right?
with al the natural recourses in africa. those predominatly black countries flourish right.


ooh wait

 

[The Fresh Prince]

I am cringing way the **** hard.


If all the whites left, it would be reasonable to conclude that the blacks would try to change American society into a society that did not insitutionally discriminate against their own race. Posts and opinions like these merely sedate Americans, and prevent them from coming to terms with America's very real race problem.

Not true I think robberies and murders would still be pretty high. I've lived in and around plenty of hoods and I know some downright savages. Not saying anything racist, but a lot of people that come from the hood just simply don't give a ****.

 

[LogGrad98]

I am cringing way the **** hard.


If all the whites left, it would be reasonable to conclude that the blacks would try to change American society into a society that did not insitutionally discriminate against their own race. Posts and opinions like these merely sedate Americans, and prevent them from coming to terms with America's very real race problem.

I thought it was interesting that he commented on black on black crime. Would that go away if all the white people left?

And I do not think this takes away from the race discussions at all. If we do not look at the problem from all possible angles we cannot get solutions that stick. In Six Sigma we see that all the time. People rush projects and do not consider ancillary and codependent systems enough and end up causing more problems while "fixing" the one they were focusing on.

 

[Stoked]

I am cringing way the **** hard.


If all the whites left, it would be reasonable to conclude that the blacks would try to change American society into a society that did not insitutionally discriminate against their own race. Posts and opinions like these merely sedate Americans, and prevent them from coming to terms with America's very real race problem.

Then they should start now as they are part of the problem. I disagree that these opinions "...sedate Americans, and prevent them from coming to terms with America's very real race problem." The racism problem is far from a one sided problem. All sides need to get real about what they are doing to promote the problem. That absolutely includes black Americans. So while this is clearly one sided and as such is horribly incomplete it is no less true.

Personally I think in this exact scenario you would see a dramatic hardening of racial biases on both sides. This would be the end of America. Simply from the sheer number of people that left. According to wikipedia the 2015 US population estimate is 320,856,934 with a white % of 77.7. That is 249,305,837 people. Entire industries, cities and states fail over night. It would be like some B level movie. Foreign countries would move in and carve up the spoils. Not because "whites" left but because almost 250 million out of 320 million people left. But who would get the blame for this failure? Those that left, which in this case is white people. They would be blamed and harshly for destroying America (a point to which I would have a hard time disagreeing with). But how would the average while person respond? With mocking and degrading accusations along the line of "told you that us whites were the backbone of america and that you leeched off of us. now we are free of you".

When in reality it was simply a numbers game.

 

[Deleted member 848]

I think the "race problem" is not the real problem. I know you don't wanna give conservatives much credit, but I like people who are hopeful and who sorta take the hand of God and walk with it.

I don't consider sticking together with your family a 'conservative' phenomenon at all, really-- this sort of thing can be advocated from every angle of the political spectrum, either via individual preaching or government assistance.

People sticking together and helping one another through hard times is what generates upward mobility. Maybe you could think of that in regard to your own family history and see the point. It might or might not really have anything to do with "conservative" or "liberal", "religious" or "secular", but the core reality that we need one another to "Stand, and Deliver" through the hard times in life.

I think it's a mistake to reduce a phenomenon as complex as upward mobility solely as a result of families sticking together. There are tens of factors that play a role in upward mobility and/or social reproduction.

Sometimes he is pretty hard to listen to, and a cringe or two is called for, but mostly I like folks who can stand up say what they think, particularly if it's not something you can get on the mainstream media. I recognize that a lot of people who are not thoroughly indoctrinated in the "acceptable opinions" of our day have some points of merit, even if they may seem "ignorant" to elites.

I'm all for people having the right to preach unpopular opinions, truly. The reason I cringe here is because his treatment of this issue individualizes and depoliticizes black suffering, which will only perpetuate issues such as black-on-black crime.

The slavers who brought blacks here did lose many of the people on the way, and the survivors suffered immensely, and the institution of slavery was an abysmal horror reprehensible to anyone with a rudimentary love for freedom, but however bad or evil all that was, there is no reason we can't all just go out today and make something of the opportunities we have in this country. black or white, we are free. Only our "liberal" welfare policies are holding the economic trap together, and we can change all that.

Would you say that the opportunities of a black American are equal to the opportunities of a white American? If not, we need to change that.

Anybody who will take immediate action addressing immediate problems can move on up in this country.

Given the bureaucratic nature of your political system, something of this nature is becoming harder to do.

 

[green]

https://www.cnsnews.com/news/articl...s-moved-out-usa-how-would-it-solve-inner-city

Interesting article about inner city problems and poverty. From a black perspective.

I said this a couple weeks ago and was railed on this board for it.

Out of everyone who railed on me, how many of you sent money to Baltimore? How many quit your jobs and moved there to help the cause?

None? So I was right? Huh.

No one cares about you or me. No one owes you or me anything. If you want to better your life YOU have to do it. If you wait for someone else to fix your problems, you will be waiting a long time.

 

[Deleted member 848]

Not true I think robberies and murders would still be pretty high. I've lived in and around plenty of hoods and I know some downright savages. Not saying anything racist, but a lot of people that come from the hood just simply don't give a ****.

Place any one of us at birth in the hood, and most of us would be no different. People not giving **** coming out of the hood is a result of intergenerational suffering, government failing to support properly, and the members feeling like second class citizens. The "hood" perpetuates these problems because of the toxic environment it's characterized by, along with the institutional racism that its black members face.

I thought it was interesting that he commented on black on black crime. Would that go away if all the white people left?

1) Seeing as there would proportionately be more black people in the country after the entire white population leaves, it would be foolish to believe otherwise from a logical standpoint
2) crime is generally an intra-racial phenomnenon-- whites mostly commit crimes against whites, and blacks mostly commit crimes against blacks. In fact, most crime in America is actually white-on-white
3) Murder rates are reflections of the environments & upbringings that communities & individuals possess. It's quite easy to conclude why black crime is such a problem when you realize the living situations of so many black Americans across the country.

And I do not think this takes away from the race discussions at all. If we do not look at the problem from all possible angles we cannot get solutions that stick. In Six Sigma we see that all the time. People rush projects and do not consider ancillary and codependent systems enough and end up causing more problems while "fixing" the one they were focusing on.

Fixing "black on black" murder rates, when more crimes are actually "white on white", is quite frankly stupid and debatably racist, IMO. It's much, much more worthwhile to treat the cause of the illness as opposed to focusing on band-aid solutions.

 

[Deleted member 848]

Then they should start now as they are part of the problem. I disagree that these opinions "...sedate Americans, and prevent them from coming to terms with America's very real race problem." The racism problem is far from a one sided problem. All sides need to get real about what they are doing to promote the problem. That absolutely includes black Americans. So while this is clearly one sided and as such is horribly incomplete it is no less true.

Stoked, come on. There is very, very, VERY clearly one demographic group that feels the brunt of pretty much every covert indication of race in america-- and the other cultural groups pale in comparison (don't even get me started on the contrast with America's white majority).

Personally I think in this exact scenario you would see a dramatic hardening of racial biases on both sides. This would be the end of America. Simply from the sheer number of people that left. According to wikipedia the 2015 US population estimate is 320,856,934 with a white % of 77.7. That is 249,305,837 people. Entire industries, cities and states fail over night. It would be like some B level movie. Foreign countries would move in and carve up the spoils. Not because "whites" left but because almost 250 million out of 320 million people left. But who would get the blame for this failure? Those that left, which in this case is white people. They would be blamed and harshly for destroying America (a point to which I would have a hard time disagreeing with). But how would the average while person respond? With mocking and degrading accusations along the line of "told you that us whites were the backbone of america and that you leeched off of us. now we are free of you".

When in reality it was simply a numbers game.

I don't think anyone here (even the author) is advocating for the departure of white people.

 

[Deleted member 848]

I said this a couple weeks ago and was railed on this board for it.

Out of everyone who railed on me, how many of you sent money to Baltimore? How many quit your jobs and moved there to help the cause?

None? So I was right? Huh.

No one cares about you or me. No one owes you or me anything. If you want to better your life YOU have to do it. If you wait for someone else to fix your problems, you will be waiting a long time.

You can't fix your own problems unless you are given the tools to fix it. The government is supposed to help provide those tools for you-- yet the government racially provides some tools to certain demographic groups moreso than others. That's the problem here. Why are the starting points different? Why do some cultural groups have to defy more odds to get to the same point than others? Is it a genetic thing? I have a Genetics degree, and I can tell you with full confidence that it isn't. Is black culture inherently anti-mobile and anti-education? If it is, it's because of what white America has done to their culture. These are the conversations we need to be having-- not ****ing asinine opinions of "well guise if all wite ppl left wut WOOD happen to bLACKONBLAK Krime!?!"

 

[Stoked]

Stoked, come on. There is very, very, VERY clearly one demographic group that feels the brunt of pretty much every covert indication of race in america-- and the other cultural groups pale in comparison (don't even get me started on the contrast with America's white majority).



I don't think anyone here (even the author) is advocating for the departure of white people.

Departure of white people was in line with the article of what happens if they left. Didn't mean to imply that you, or anyone else, were really advocating for it. Just my take on what would happen if it did happen is all.

I never once said that blacks don't feel the brunt of the problem. But that does not mean they dont share any of the blame. Racism is not confined to one racial group. Yes the current power structure is heavily biased towards whites.

But if we are going to get real then let's get real. That includes calling out racist, and other damaging, attitudes and actions among minorities.

My point is that any attempts to fix this problem by laying the blame at the feet of one group will never, ever work. In fact, it only makes it worse.

 

[LogGrad98]

You can't fix your own problems unless you are given the tools to fix it. The government is supposed to help provide those tools for you-- yet the government racially provides some tools to certain demographic groups moreso than others. That's the problem here. Why are the starting points different? Why do some cultural groups have to defy more odds to get to the same point than others? Is it a genetic thing? I have a Genetics degree, and I can tell you with full confidence that it isn't. Is black culture inherently anti-mobile and anti-education? If it is, it's because of what white America has done to their culture. These are the conversations we need to be having-- not ****ing asinine opinions of "well guise if all wite ppl left wut WOOD happen to bLACKONBLAK Krime!?!"

I can't think of a single thing the government specifically does that benefits whites and oppresses blacks. Welfare, job centers, medicaid/care, obamacare, and then you have affirmative action which drives state run universities to favor black applicants (probably better said non-white), and any other social program you choose to mention. The problem is far more societal than governmental imo. Job corps or work centers will send blacks and whites to interviews. It is the interviewer who decides if race will be factor in their decision. I am not saying you are wrong, I just cannot think of any examples of the US government programs geared toward whites more than blacks. Can you give some examples?

 

[DutchJazzer]

if we are hving this hypothetical tought process.

how about this thought experiment.
if 77.7% is white
instead of moving 77% out. what if blacks get to choose their cites
23% of the states is about 10-11 states.
what if the blacks get to choose those 11 states. all white should move to the other. they then make their own "country"
now the problem of "ghost" cities is naught.

how do you think those black states would do?

 

[Stoked]

if we are hving this hypothetical tought process.

how about this thought experiment.
if 77.7% is white
instead of moving 77% out. what if blacks get to choose their cites
23% of the states is about 10-11 states.
what if the blacks get to choose those 11 states. all white should move to the other. they then make their own "country"
now the problem of "ghost" cities is naught.

how do you think those black states would do?

On the whole? Average with the states ran by other racial groups. Some better, some worse.

As for racial relations I think it would be damaging. Segregation, willing or enforced, decreases exposure and by extension knowledge of the other. That leads to misunderstandings and increased biases.

 

[LogGrad98]

if we are hving this hypothetical tought process.

how about this thought experiment.
if 77.7% is white
instead of moving 77% out. what if blacks get to choose their cites
23% of the states is about 10-11 states.
what if the blacks get to choose those 11 states. all white should move to the other. they then make their own "country"
now the problem of "ghost" cities is naught.

how do you think those black states would do?

I would choose Nevada. Specifically, Reno. Great place to live. I really miss it.

 

[Deleted member 848]

I can't think of a single thing the government specifically does that benefits whites and oppresses blacks.

Well, other than allowing the perpetuation and existence of black suffrage without proposing any systemic changes across America.

Welfare, job centers, medicaid/care, obamacare, and then you have affirmative action which drives state run universities to favor black applicants (probably better said non-white), and any other social program you choose to mention. The problem is far more societal than governmental imo.

The problem became societal because of government policy. You simply cannot separate the two, as both are incredibly interrelated phenomena. Our current perception of black people is very much a reflection of the government policy of our forefathers, and the rights/dignity/stigma given to black people over the span of centuries. Things like government mandates to strap body-cams, or sanctions to police stations found committing white-on-black officer crime are government interventions that could help curtail our existent societal racism (and I'm not politician-- these are only a couple of examples)

job corps or work centers will send blacks and whites to interviews. It is the interviewer who decides if race will be factor in their decision. I am not saying you are wrong, I just cannot think of any examples of the US government programs geared toward whites more than blacks. Can you give some examples?

Dude, again: the whole reason the interviewer has race factoring into his decision is because the decades-long racist governments of North America. The last thing we want to do is acknowledge that many of our policies now favour all people equally, consider America post-racial, and call people lazy when they criticize a still-racist America.

I do think America has, and continues to take huge huge strides in addressing racism-- now, while we let our current generations of black folk try to heal their wounds of cruelly-racist policy that only existed 50 years ago, here are a couple racist things, off the top of my head, that we can currently address from a governmental standpoint:

1) Criminal justice system & legal sentencing. The differences in sentences of equal crimes between whites and blacks can be found all over google. So can the inconsistency of the CJS (in many other aspects) across different racial groups.
2) Housing-- both current an historically, with the impacts still being existent to this day (blacks got a minute percentage of allocated government housing, with repercussions still current). Look into the history of the FHA, and it's current ramifications. Residential discrimination is a huge one (with blockbusting, redlining, mortgage discrimination) that the government could play a role in addressing, but hasn't one so with any effectivity.
3) Racial profiling, which is institutionalized to varying extents

 

[Deleted member 848]

On the whole? Average with the states ran by other racial groups. Some better, some worse.

As for racial relations I think it would be damaging. Segregation, willing or enforced, decreases exposure and by extension knowledge of the other. That leads to misunderstandings and increased biases.

Too bad Israel still has trouble understanding this. Let's hope they get the memo some day for the sake of the Palestinians.