Trump and Putin in Helsinki

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Red, Jul 16, 2018.

  1. Red

    Red Well-Known Member

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    It's possible that Trump's performance, in today's joint press conference with Putin, represents a turning point in the Trump presidency. It seemed to represent the ultimate example of Trump placing himself above his country. Refusal to defend his country on foreign soil, capitulation to the man who launched an attack on the United States, support for Putin's lies, praise tossed Putin's way. Days after the indictment, by an American grand jury, of 12 officers of the Russian military intelligence service(GRU), for cyberattacks conducted in the service of influencing the 2016 election in Trump's favor. If you saw it, you may still be slack jawed hours later. Hard to imagine a lower point in the American presidency. People don't want to believe Trump is Putin's puppet, but hard to think otherwise after this day. This was one for the ages.

    Three minutes of "highlights", but there were many more astounding moments:



    The full press conference:

     

  2. Red

    Red Well-Known Member

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    There have been many strong statements issued today. I posted some links in the "National Lampoon European Vacation..." thread, since this was the final leg of Trump's European trip, but since this is perhaps the most disgraceful moment in many a presidency, and since it may actually turn out to have opened at least more eyes among Trump's fellow citizens, when all is said and done, I thought it deserved its own thread.

    Many strong statements, from both sides of the aisle. And that's happened before and meant, well, not much, forgotten in a week. It's possible, though, that history will make note of this day.

    Here was the statement released by Sen. John McCain:

    “Today’s press conference in Helsinki was one of the most disgraceful performances by an American president in memory. The damage inflicted by President Trump’s naiveté, egotism, false equivalence, and sympathy for autocrats is difficult to calculate. But it is clear that the summit in Helsinki was a tragic mistake.

    “President Trump proved not only unable, but unwilling to stand up to Putin. He and Putin seemed to be speaking from the same script as the president made a conscious choice to defend a tyrant against the fair questions of a free press, and to grant Putin an uncontested platform to spew propaganda and lies to the world.

    “It is tempting to describe the press conference as a pathetic rout – as an illustration of the perils of under-preparation and inexperience. But these were not the errant tweets of a novice politician. These were the deliberate choices of a president who seems determined to realize his delusions of a warm relationship with Putin’s regime without any regard for the true nature of his rule, his violent disregard for the sovereignty of his neighbors, his complicity in the slaughter of the Syrian people, his violation of international treaties, and his assault on democratic institutions throughout the world.

    “Coming close on the heels of President Trump’s bombastic and erratic conduct towards our closest friends and allies in Brussels and Britain, today’s press conference marks a recent low point in the history of the American Presidency. That the president was attended in Helsinki by a team of competent and patriotic advisors makes his blunders and capitulations all the more painful and inexplicable.

    “No prior president has ever abased himself more abjectly before a tyrant. Not only did President Trump fail to speak the truth about an adversary; but speaking for America to the world, our president failed to defend all that makes us who we are—a republic of free people dedicated to the cause of liberty at home and abroad. American presidents must be the champions of that cause if it is to succeed. Americans are waiting and hoping for President Trump to embrace that sacred responsibility. One can only hope they are not waiting totally in vain.”
     
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  3. rare144

    rare144 Well-Known Member

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    Man get real

    Swamp creatures livid at peace
     
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  4. Red

    Red Well-Known Member

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    What happened to "America First"? People won't soon forget the coward of Helsinki.
     
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  5. Revolution 9

    Revolution 9 Well-Known Member Staff Member

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    Trump First
     
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  6. Red

    Red Well-Known Member

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    Since the ascension of Donald Trump, the editors of the Washington Post have adopted the motto "Democracy Dies in Darkness", emphasizing the traditional role of the free press in America as the watchdog of our democracy. And yesterday, regardless of what the Mueller probe eventually determines, the Post correctly determined that Trump has just openly colluded with the Russian government.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...91f9aa-8914-11e8-a345-a1bf7847b375_story.html

    THE ENDURING image of the U.S.-Russia summit in Helsinki on Monday will be that of President Trump standing next to Vladimir Putin and suggesting he found Mr. Putin’s “powerful” denial at least as persuasive as the U.S. intelligence community’s unanimous finding that Russia intervened in the 2016 election. Coupled with another groundless attack on the FBI and an apparent endorsement of a patently disingenuous offer by Mr. Putin to collaborate with the investigation of special counsel Robert S. Mueller III, Mr. Trump appeared to align himself with the Kremlin against American law enforcement before the Russian ruler and a global audience.

    Mr. Trump had said he would raise the issue of Russia’s interference in the election with Mr. Putin, but the result was a series of statements that could have been scripted by Moscow. Mr. Trump said that, while Daniel Coats, the United States’ director of national intelligence, had told him Russia was responsible for hacking into the server of the Democratic National Committee, “I don’t see any reason why it would be.” He referred to various discredited conspiracy theories about the hack while lambasting the FBI. When offered an open-ended opportunity to cite any behavior by Russia that had contributed to poor relations, the president sidestepped, saying, “I hold both countries responsible.” As Mr. Trump apparently sees it, Russia’s invasions of Ukraine and Georgia, war crimes in Syria, poison attack in Britain and the shooting down of a Malaysian civilian airliner over Ukraine are morally equivalent to the policies pursued by previous U.S. administrations.

    It’s not yet known what Mr. Trump and Mr. Putin discussed in their private meeting, or whether they reached any tangible agreements. Both leaders suggested there had been accord on securing Israel’s border with Syria and on providing humanitarian aid to Syrian refugees, though they offered no details. Even if he obtained nothing concrete from Mr. Trump, Mr. Putin scored a symbolic triumph by appearing to stand as an equal with the U.S. president in a relationship with “special responsibility for maintaining international security,” as he put it.

    While Mr. Trump’s insistence on granting Mr. Putin that status was misguided, it paled beside his betrayal of the FBI and his own senior intelligence officials. Incredibly, Mr. Trump appeared to endorse a cynical suggestion by Mr. Putin that Mr. Mueller’s investigators be granted interviews with a dozen Russian intelligence officers indicted in the DNC hack in exchange for Russian access to associates of William Browder, a financier whose exposure of high-level corruption and human rights crimes in Moscow led to the adoption by Congress of the Magnitsky Act, which imposed sanctions on those responsible. Mr. Putin’s citation of bogus Russian charges against Mr. Browder was matched by Mr. Trump’s garbled reference to “the Pakistani gentleman” who was falsely alleged by right-wing conspiracy theorists to be behind the leak of DNC emails.

    In Helsinki, Mr. Trump again insisted “there was no collusion” with Russia. Yet in refusing to acknowledge the plain facts about Russia’s behavior, while trashing his own country’s justice system, Mr. Trump in fact was openly colluding with the criminal leader of a hostile power.
     
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  7. str8line

    str8line Well-Known Member Contributor 2019 Award Winner

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    Now is the time we officially see if the Republican party has a single vertebra of spine left. They should begin the impeachment process immediately.
     
    Red likes this.
  8. elan_prodigy

    elan_prodigy Well-Known Member

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    Lol. Media whipping the sheeple into a frenzy again I see.
     
  9. Red

    Red Well-Known Member

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    Mar 17, 2015
    JOHN BRENNAN, FMR. CIA DIRECTOR: I thought that there was nothing that Donald Trump could say that would shock me, but I was wrong. I was just totally shocked at the performance of Donald Trump in Helsinki at a press conference with Vladimir Putin.


    "I just found that it was outrageous. and even when the press, thank goodness the press asked the right questions. Even when the press gave him an opportunity to hold Russia accountable for anything, he chose to talk about Hillary Clinton, about his election, about servers. He criticized American citizens, Secretary Clinton, and others as opposed to really taking advantage of a world stage with all the world's eyes upon them to point out how unacceptable Russia's behavior and interference in our election and the elections of other democratic countries around the globe is. But he just shirked those responsibilities.

    I just cannot understand how the national security team can continue to abide by this and how Pompeo and Bolton and Kelly can continue in their jobs. This, I think, rises to the point of good American patriots resigning in objection to that performance by Donald Trump.

    I'm at a loss of words to describe just how outrageous his words, his statements, his behavior has been. And one can only conclude that he fears Vladimir Putin and that one on one discussion, who knows what was discussed there. And how Mr. Putin now is the master puppeteer of Donald Trump, the person who is in our Oval Office. Outrageous...

    Republican patriots all over the country, including in the Congress, where are you? When are you going to speak out and roundly condemn what Donald Trump is doing? And all of those good Americans who voted for Mr. Trump believing that he was going to protect this country, I think you have now his demonstrated unwillingness, maybe inability, to protect this country's interests.

    I think this is a time for all Americans to rally and to say, Mr. Trump, you are not doing what is necessary in order to keep this country strong and safe. And Mr. Putin must be now with his team just rejoicing in what has happened in Helsinki."
     
  10. Red

    Red Well-Known Member

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    In fairness, an American president, betraying his nation, failing to defend his nation, live, on foreign soil, before the entire world, probably would have accomplished that anyway.....
     
  11. elan_prodigy

    elan_prodigy Well-Known Member

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    Dramatic much. Calm ya farm Red.
     
  12. str8line

    str8line Well-Known Member Contributor 2019 Award Winner

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    Did you watch the press conference? Did you hear his interview immediately afterwards? What's with you people blaming the media for everything?
     
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  13. Red

    Red Well-Known Member

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    That members of Trump's cult of personality would willingly embrace their cult leader's act of cowardice, and betrayal of his country, is perhaps the least surprising reaction to yesterday's watershed moment. Just as history will not forget Trump's unwillingness to defend his nation, so too will history remember the complicity and cowardness of his followers.
     
  14. elan_prodigy

    elan_prodigy Well-Known Member

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    I dont blame the media, I understand their purpose and goals. I blame the ignorance of the population.
     
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  15. str8line

    str8line Well-Known Member Contributor 2019 Award Winner

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    So you didn't watch the press conference or interview?
     
  16. Rubashov

    Rubashov Well-Known Member 2019 Award Winner

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    Whats he going to be like when he's re-elected?
     
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  17. Jazzta

    Jazzta Well-Known Member

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    I wouldn’t be surprised, see George W. Bush or Obama...
     
  18. Rubashov

    Rubashov Well-Known Member 2019 Award Winner

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    I'd bet on it.
     
  19. idestroyedthetoilet

    idestroyedthetoilet Well-Known Member

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    Some of us don't sit around pathetically waiting with baited baited breath for another thing to cry on jazzfanz about. Tell me, do you (and Red) find that a fulfilling life?
     
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  20. Jazzta

    Jazzta Well-Known Member

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    Don’t forget Thriller, I wonder who pays him
     
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