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kurt kragthorpe hits the nail on the head

The Jazz have one of the worst defensive starting lineups and one of the worst thrown together backcourts in the league. They did well to win as many games as they did.
 
Lol. No. The Jazz are an 8th seed level team after trading away their superstar for rookie and young, developing big men. If you think that's a bad move then okomgrofl.

Those who thought this team would magically better by adding an under achieving SF and two bench guards are kidding themselves. Some of us got over excited, that's all. We're fans, go figure.

So you agree, that the young big men are the future? They're essentially replacing our PG superstar and franchise player?

So why are they collectively (barely) playing more than Big Al? Why the hell is Big Al and Millsap still on this team? Are they the future? Are they replacing Dwill?

So then your problem lies with the coaching, right?

Folks, you can't have it both ways. You can't praise KOC for his acquisition of young talent and then excuse Ty Corbin's lack of PT given and development of the young players.

Either Corbin or KOC has failed. Choose which one. Or both. But no more pansie footing around while drinking the Locke Kool-aid
 
What are some specific examples of Ty losing games for the Jazz. Obviously he has been far less than perfect, but what are some blatant examples of him costing the Jazz an easy win? I remember them being brought up but cannot remember what they were.

Careful. That list almost takes a second hands to count them all on.
 
So you agree, that the young big men are the future? They're essentially replacing our PG superstar and franchise player?

So why are they collectively (barely) playing more than Big Al? Why the hell is Big Al and Millsap still on this team? Are they the future? Are they replacing Dwill?

So then your problem lies with the coaching, right?

Folks, you can't have it both ways. You can't praise KOC for his acquisition of young talent and then excuse Ty Corbin's lack of PT given and development of the young players.

Either Corbin or KOC has failed. Choose which one.

Man, you sure are putting a lot of words in his mouth, and then demanding he make a decision NOW NOW NOW. What's up with that?
 
I don't have a problem with Al playing 30+ minutes. He's our leading scorer and the anchor of our offense more often than not.

I have a problem with Foye getting minutes ahead of Burks, Hayward and Carrol who can hit 3s, plus play defense and rebound.

I have a problem with Millsap getting more minutes than Favors and Kanter, although it looks like we were shopping Sap.

Corbin basically went with an offensive strategy of Al in the post, Foye spreading the floor and Sap playing weakside out 18 feet. I get it, but other than Hayward running an occasional pick-and-roll our offense was limited and predictable while our defense/rebounding cost us games.

The coaching staff was very limited in their ability to run an offense and stay even on defense and the boards. I think our coaching staff is weak.
 
I never said that Kobe won that game. I was giving examples of poor coaching decisions by Corbin. Foye guarding Kobe Bryant is a poor decision.

Not to beat a dead horse, because I think you make some valid points otherwise, but Kobe scored 34 and 29 in the two wins and 14 in the loss. He is averaging 27 for the season. I don't know who guarded Kobe for what periods of time during these games, but in the loss we held Kobe to 13 pts. under his season average. I just don't understand how you can characterize that as a coaching failure.
 
Also, I think Burks is a better point guard than Mo is. He's better at getting in the lane, better at making passes over the defense and better running the pick-and-roll. Burks and Mo should have switched roles.
 
Not to beat a dead horse, because I think you make some valid points otherwise, but Kobe scored 34 and 29 in the two wins and 14 in the loss. He is averaging 27 for the season. I don't know who guarded Kobe for what periods of time during these games, but in the loss we held Kobe to 13 pts. under his season average. I just don't understand how you can characterize that as a coaching failure.

FWIW, both Hayward and Marvin guarded Kobe well in the Jazz wins.
 
David Locke already explained to Mahony why Al Jefferson must play so many minutes. Don't know why everyone's refusing to listen to it.
 
Utah is less talented than Houston? Wtf? Denver? Memphis?

I really think some of you (well mostly just hartsock) need to step away from the jazz Kool-aid and really look at things. Either the jazz are really just an 8th seed talent, which means that koc has completely sucked. Or, the jazz are a 3-6 seed talent level but underachieving because of their coach.

It's one or the other.

Denver and Memphis are certainly more talented than the Jazz. Houston, eh, but they have a legit star in Harden, and in the NBA stars win games. Also keeping a small market team where no one wants to play is not sucking FYI, its doing the best you can given your resources.
 
Utah is less talented than Houston? Wtf? Denver? Memphis?

I really think some of you (well mostly just hartsock) need to step away from the jazz Kool-aid and really look at things. Either the jazz are really just an 8th seed talent, which means that koc has completely sucked. Or, the jazz are a 3-6 seed talent level but underachieving because of their coach.

It's one or the other.

You try to make it to clear cut. Players don't always play to the level of their talent every night, regardless of coaching. The Jazz have underachieved at times because of Corbin, but you can't blame Corbin for all of the team's shortcomings, which is what some people on here seem to be saying.
 
You try to make it to clear cut. Players don't always play to the level of their talent every night, regardless of coaching. The Jazz have underachieved at times because of Corbin, but you can't blame Corbin for all of the team's shortcomings, which is what some people on here seem to be saying.

This is accurate, all the blame none of the credit.
 
Either the jazz are really just an 8th seed talent, which means that koc has completely sucked. Or, the jazz are a 3-6 seed talent level but underachieving because of their coach.

It's one or the other.

Actually, it's both. The current talent level is 7-9, but the future talent level will be 2-5.
 
Utah is less talented than Houston? Wtf? Denver? Memphis?

Pretty much. Perhaps the Jazz didn't belong in the playoffs this year at all honestly.

Hmm.

Still, I don't see greatness in Corbin and the unfortunate reality is we need greatness to win a championship unless at least one of The Four is really legit and the Jazz get really lucky in 2014. Hell, even then...
 
So you agree, that the young big men are the future? They're essentially replacing our PG superstar and franchise player?

So why are they collectively (barely) playing more than Big Al? Why the hell is Big Al and Millsap still on this team? Are they the future? Are they replacing Dwill?

So then your problem lies with the coaching, right?

No, the veterans have enough talent and experience that they are slightly better than the youngster, but by very little. Utah has the smallest starter-bench discrepancy int he league.
 
Actually, it's both. The current talent level is 7-9, but the future talent level will be 2-5.


Thank you, Jazz fans have this romanticized version of the youth. Sure, they might end up being very good or even great. But as of right now, right this second, they are just pretty good with a ton of potential. Ty has not screwed this team out of anything. Favors gets a rebound against Chicago theres a win, Carroll doesn't get smoked by Reddick theres a win, Mo makes a layup in cleveland theres a win, those are not on Corbin. The blame goes for every one on this team from Al on down to Murphy, KOC and Ty are also included, everyone needs to do their job better.
 
I simply disagree. I think this team has the talent to be a 6th seed. I do not see Houston, Lakers and GS as better than Utah.
 
Thank you, Jazz fans have this romanticized version of the youth. Sure, they might end up being very good or even great. But as of right now, right this second, they are just pretty good with a ton of potential. Ty has not screwed this team out of anything. Favors gets a rebound against Chicago theres a win, Carroll doesn't get smoked by Reddick theres a win, Mo makes a layup in cleveland theres a win, those are not on Corbin. The blame goes for every one on this team from Al on down to Murphy, KOC and Ty are also included, everyone needs to do their job better.

You speak the truth hartsock..... and yet corbin still sucks
 
Thank you, Jazz fans have this romanticized version of the youth. Sure, they might end up being very good or even great. But as of right now, right this second, they are just pretty good with a ton of potential. Ty has not screwed this team out of anything. Favors gets a rebound against Chicago theres a win, Carroll doesn't get smoked by Reddick theres a win, Mo makes a layup in cleveland theres a win, those are not on Corbin. The blame goes for every one on this team from Al on down to Murphy, KOC and Ty are also included, everyone needs to do their job better.

Also, AS much as we love to complain and blame corbin (I do this too) Basketball really isn't even a coaches game.
 
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