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CJ Miles is the man!

gregbroncs said:
Yea right. Bell shoots the exact same % from the floor as CJ this year. And a negligible margin better from 3.

The year that Miles was the starter he shot .459 FG% and .352 3 pt% both much better than Bell as the starter this year. It's easier to shoot a high % when your the man that the other team does not worry about. Deron, Millsap and AJ are all options over Bell when he is on the floor. A lot of the time Miles is on the floor he is the 1st option to score. Miles' #'s 2 years ago in Bell's role were much better than Bell this year. Add to that Bell's defense this year is less that advertised and he's part of the unit that hardly ever outscores their opponent.
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who cares about 2 years ago? That was a different team. Plus, Miles has never been good enough to retain the starter position for a whole season anyways. Last year he eventually lost it to Maththews/AK.

His FG% last 4 seasons leading upto this one:

48%
46%
43%
41%

Nice progression.

Moral of the story- You give him a bigger role and you get diminishing returns.
 
vj_74 said:
who cares about 2 years ago? That was a different team. Plus, Miles has never been good enough to retain the starter position for a whole season anyways. Last year he eventually lost it to Maththews/AK.

His FG% last 4 seasons leading upto this one:

48%
46%
43%
41%

Nice progression.

Moral of the story- You give him a bigger role and you get diminishing returns.
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This might be a first, but vj just won.
 
vj_74 said:
who cares about 2 years ago? That was a different team. Plus, Miles has never been good enough to retain the starter position for a whole season anyways. Last year he eventually lost it to Maththews/AK.

His FG% last 4 seasons leading upto this one:

48%
46%
43%
41%

Nice progression.

Moral of the story- You give him a bigger role and you get diminishing returns.
Click to expand...

FG% doesn't tell half the story. He is at career highs in points, rebounds, blocks, steals, ft attempts. All with the same amount of minutes.

Advanced stats
PER: 14.9 (career high)
+/- : +17.3 (career high)

You can't spin all those statistics, he is by far having his best year ever.
 
vj_74 said:
who cares about 2 years ago? That was a different team. Plus, Miles has never been good enough to retain the starter position for a whole season anyways. Last year he eventually lost it to Maththews/AK.

His FG% last 4 seasons leading upto this one:

48%
46%
43%
41%

Nice progression.

Moral of the story- You give him a bigger role and you get diminishing returns.
Click to expand...

2 years ago is the only time he was a starter playing the same role that Bell is now. Bell is also playing with similar if not better talent around him than Miles was then. He was better at it shooting wise than Bell is now.

You completely dodged the main point and only have FG% as your backing. As Jazz4ever pointed out he is better in every way than he has ever been and doing it as the only real scoring option off of the bench. He is being defended better than Bell he is being keyed upon and still putting up the same %'s as Bell.

Now I'm not pushing for CJ to start because Bell as the main scoring option off of the bench would make those pathetic #'s even worse. But trying to say Bell is better just because he is shooting better (especially when he really isn't) is naive.

Mathews was better than Miles and deserved the start. I've never said otherwise. But Bell isn't. I don't mind him starting but he's getting way too many minutes. Actually if the starters keep digging holes I might start minding him starting because he looks like the weakest link in that lineup.
 
Yay!!! CJ showed up in Cleveland. Go CJ!!
 
but wait cj sucks. he is inconsistant. :D.

the only player who gets flack for being inconsistent. how about those other jazz players that are inconsistent they get some kind of free pass?
 
gregbroncs said:
Now I'm not pushing for CJ to start because Bell as the main scoring option off of the bench would make those pathetic #'s even worse. But trying to say Bell is better just because he is shooting better (especially when he really isn't) is naive.

Mathews was better than Miles and deserved the start. I've never said otherwise. But Bell isn't. I don't mind him starting but he's getting way too many minutes. Actually if the starters keep digging holes I might start minding him starting because he looks like the weakest link in that lineup.
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If Miles started, he would easily become the weakest link too. Reason Bell is starting right now is because apart from the fact that he doesn't jack up shots like Miles, he also brings the intangibles, a bit of the veteran savvy and experience and vocal leadership this team needs, apart from gritty defense. So, even if he shot a little worse than Miles no one would mind him starting. But he is actually shooting better and that just makes things easier. Bell is just averaging 28 mins which is'nt that high for a starter. Miles might be better than previous years but still not steady enough to be a 30-min starter/finisher night in and night out.
 
vj_74 said:
If Miles started, he would easily become the weakest link too. Reason Bell is starting right now is because apart from the fact that he doesn't jack up shots like Miles, he also brings the intangibles, a bit of the veteran savvy and experience and vocal leadership this team needs, apart from gritty defense. So, even if he shot a little worse than Miles no one would mind him starting. But he is actually shooting better and that just makes things easier. Bell is just averaging 28 mins which is'nt that high for a starter. Miles might be better than previous years but still not steady enough to be a 30-min starter/finisher night in and night out.
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As if Kirilenko and the aging Raja are "steady enough"?

Tonight showed that careful use of Bell and Miles together (i.e., when the opposing 2/3 lineup isn't too tall) might be valuable.

The Bucks game showed that DW-CJ-AK-PM-AJ is valuable--and it's been valuable more often than DW-RB-AK-PM-AJ. Hopefully the difference isn't as clear anymore if Bell has found his shot again.

Whether CJ starts or not, it's crazy that Bell has been logging more minutes than Miles. Even with CJ's catching and jacking, Miles and Bell have the exact same FG% (before tonights game); yet Miles leads Bell significantly in points (& +/-) and mildly in rebounds, steals, & blocks. Miles logged nearly twice the FTs as Bell, and that's not all from playing with the second unit.

Bell playing more than Miles is good ol' Jerry vet bias; Bell's defense hasn't even been particularly stellar to warrant it, nor has Miles defense been particularly bad. It's a much more benign form of Derek Fisher disease: Sloan likes to start the locker-room stabilizer, no matter whether it's the optimal choice or not. At least Bell is arguably an off-guard--not like sub-40%-FG Fish.
 
vj_74 said:
If Miles started, he would easily become the weakest link too. Reason Bell is starting right now is because apart from the fact that he doesn't jack up shots like Miles, he also brings the intangibles, a bit of the veteran savvy and experience and vocal leadership this team needs, apart from gritty defense. So, even if he shot a little worse than Miles no one would mind him starting. But he is actually shooting better and that just makes things easier. Bell is just averaging 28 mins which is'nt that high for a starter. Miles might be better than previous years but still not steady enough to be a 30-min starter/finisher night in and night out.
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CJ would probably become the weakest link because our starter's are pretty good. But Bell would be horrendous in the role CJ is playing this year and like IGS stated CJ is pretty much doing everything better than Bell on the court except shooting % which he is equal at not worse like you keep trying to claim.

CJ should be getting more minutes than Bell and he's not. Now I understand Bell last night had a good game (I couldn't watch it) but how many "good" games has Bell had this year compared to CJ? Not as many if it's even close he has not scored 20 pts even once. And even on Bell's "good" game CJ has more steals, assists, points and rebounds than him in 10 less minutes.
 
gregbroncs said:
CJ should be getting more minutes than Bell and he's not. Now I understand Bell last night had a good game (I couldn't watch it) but how many "good" games has Bell had this year compared to CJ? Not as many if it's even close he has not scored 20 pts even once. And even on Bell's "good" game CJ has more steals, assists, points and rebounds than him in 10 less minutes.
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When Miles was borderline useless his first 25 games last year weren't you the one that said we had to be patient with him because he was coming off an injury?

Bell is coming off a much more severe injury and is 10 years older than Miles. And while Bell has been way better in his first 25 or so back this year than Miles had been last year; why doesn't he get the same slack?
 
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