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Trump Dictatorship and All Things Politics

Sardines said:
Okay let me rephrase. Stupid *** MAGA idiots call everything that isn't what they believe "far left," "extremely liberal," "socialist," "anti-American," "Unpatriotic." It isn't true. Log is not a flaming liberal. Kamala Harris was not an extremist. That's just stupid **** that stupid people believe.
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Honest questions here:

Do you think expanding the Supreme Court is an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Do you think deporting all illegals in America as an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Do you think getting rid of the filibuster is an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Do you think pardoning J6 prisoners is an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Do you think getting rid of the electoral college is an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Do you think having a federal overwatch on speech is an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Do you think a mandatory gun buyback is an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Do you think getting rid of Federal Departments is an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Do you think replacing the income tax with tariffs an extreme view or do you agree with it?


I can say I don’t agree with any of that (I don’t know about the tariffs Enough) and think it’s extreme views on both sides.

I would rather take what we have now and add Doge and clean Government up completely. Make it more transparent.

Also being a far left extremest is not a bad thing, you might take it that way, but maybe extreme bold moves is the correct action to take. But at the same time the Far Right has extreme views and they think those extreme bold ideas are the best actions to take.

The is a lot of separation between the 3 and that’s completely fine.

But saying what MAGA says is untrue is the same way MAGA feels when the left say the same thing to them. When both sides are extreme.
 
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Sardines said:
You know what I'm tired of? MAGA telling me I'm not a patriotic, constitution loving, land of the free supporting American. MAGA doesn't own patriotism. You can't gate keep my love for the U.S.! And you're not going to gaslight me into believing that I don't stand for the very same ideals that this nation was founded upon.
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Who are you referring to? And I don’t mean ‘point to a vaguely defined group of people’. Show me specific comments from specific people directed at you that make the claims you cite and I’ll stand shoulder-to-shoulder with you to denounce it.

There are those who think Kamala Harris was an extremist. In 2019 she made some comments that came across that way and those old comments haunted her in this past election, but I know I’ve never said Kamala was extremist. I think she’s not a good candidate for a range of reasons but we can disagree on that.

As for LogGrad, I don’t see him as a “flaming liberal”, whatever that means. I see LogGrad as someone who is in physical pain and consuming Percocet at a rate that has put him on the radar of programs created to head off abuse of opioids. That pain, which I don’t doubt is real, has reduced his personal tolerance for being challenged. As LogGrad’s condition persists, his world is contracting and drifting toward nihilism.
LogGrad98 said:
Well it seems the state of Utah has a percocet shortage. I am stuck in St George waiting for my mom to have surgery on her hip and pelvis and taking care of my dad in the meantime and my percocet has run dry. I am trying to get a prescription sent up here by my doctor, but every pharmacy in the area is completely out and reportedly has been for some time. No idea when they might get more. I might have to drive to Vegas to get the prescription filled. Of course this happened because I tried to get the prescription filled 5 days early to avoid this exact scenario, and of course was shot down as the horrifying drug addict I apparently am.
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LogGrad98 said:
Our government is so ****ing bass ackward about all this, and they have no ****ing clue how to deal with these issues besides politicizing the everloving **** out of it until any policies they have don't do anything to address problems real people have, but sure do stick it to the dems or the repubs so they can pwn each other. Because of course the legislators have no problem getting their drugs, as theirs are provided by lobbyists for free anyway.
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On better days, it is only Trump, Musk, and those he sees as “the Oligarchs” that he wants to see dead.
LogGrad98 said:
Time to completely wipe out the oligarchy and start new. Send them all to hell and let someone else step into the role.
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On worse days, he wants to see everyone dead, and I do mean everyone.
LogGrad98 said:
Wipe out all humans ... zero intrinsic value ... we are a virus on the planet. Consuming and destroying everything we touch.
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I don't see that as drifting leftward, but that is just me.

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Bucknutz said:
Honest questions here:

Do you think expanding the Supreme Court is an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Do you think deporting all illegals in America as an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Do you think getting rid of the filibuster is an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Do you think pardoning J6 prisoners is an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Do you think getting rid of the electoral college is an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Do you think having a federal overwatch on speech is an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Do you think a mandatory gun buyback is an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Do you think getting rid of Federal Departments is an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Do you think replacing the income tax with tariffs an extreme view or do you agree with it?


I can say I don’t agree with any of that (I don’t know about the tariffs Enough) and think it’s extreme views on both sides.

I would rather take what we have now and add Doge and clean Government up completely. Make it more transparent.

Also being a far left extremest is not a bad thing, you might take it that way, but maybe extreme bold moves is the correct action to take. But at the same time the Far Right has extreme views and they think those extreme bold ideas are the best actions to take.

The is a lot of separation between the 3 and that’s completely fine.

But saying what MAGA says is untrue is the same way MAGA feels when the left say the same thing to them. When both sides are more extreme.
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Interesting binary there. Why are things either extreme or you agree with them? Could it be an extreme view AND you agree with it? But it be a not-extreme view but you don't agree with it?

It would be easy to say that it is exactly this kind of thinking (on both sides, to be clear, altho I personally think there is more justification for it coming from the left) that got us into this mess. I haven't considered enough if I would agree with that or not, but it wouldn't be an extreme view.
 
gandalfe said:
Interesting binary there. Why are things either extreme or you agree with them? Could it be an extreme view AND you agree with it? But it be a not-extreme view but you don't agree with it?

It would be easy to say that it is exactly this kind of thinking (on both sides, to be clear, altho I personally think there is more justification for it coming from the left) that got us into this mess. I haven't considered enough if I would agree with that or not, but it wouldn't be an extreme view.
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What would you consider an extreme view? I see it as something that doesn’t swing too far away from the center.

For example, why would you want to expand the Supreme Court? Most people on the left say the Supreme Court is compromised by corruption on the right. Yet there is nothing to prove they did anything wrong or maybe even falsely accused. But that’s the grounds to expand? No, you and I both know it’s ideologically leans right and they don’t like it because of its rulings. You don’t hear these same posters say let’s expand the courts now…why, Trump gets to expand it with his picks and the Senate would push them right through.

It’s extreme because they are only wanting to do it to benefit their party and not the good of the country. It’s a selfish idea.

You take rounding up the illegals here and deporting them. I think that it is an extremist view. A more central view to this is deport the people causing issues. These people being a lot of value to country and it makes no sense deporting people who have a life here now. The right thinks it’s going to help their party and it’s a selfish idea.

Again, nothing wrong with wanting these ideas or have these views; they might be needed to make America take the next forward step.
 
Bucknutz said:
Honest questions here:

Do you think expanding the Supreme Court is an extreme view or do you agree with it? Not extreme. Disagree

Do you think deporting all illegals in America as an extreme view or do you agree with it? Extreme. Disagree

Do you think getting rid of the filibuster is an extreme view or do you agree with it? Not extreme. Disagree.

Do you think pardoning J6 prisoners is an extreme view or do you agree with it? Extreme. Disagree

Do you think getting rid of the electoral college is an extreme view or do you agree with it? Not extreme. Strongly agree.

Do you think having a federal overwatch on speech is an extreme view or do you agree with it? Extreme. Disagree. No one was suggesting this as you present it. Dishonest question.

Do you think a mandatory gun buyback is an extreme view or do you agree with it? Extreme. Disagree. Was not even a remote possibility.

Do you think getting rid of Federal Departments is an extreme view or do you agree with it? Somewhat extreme. Generally disagree

Do you think replacing the income tax with tariffs an extreme view or do you agree with it? Extreme. Extremely stupid. Disagree.


I can say I don’t agree with any of that (I don’t know about the tariffs Enough) and think it’s extreme views on both sides.

I would rather take what we have now and add Doge and clean Government up completely. Make it more transparent.

Also being a far left extremest is not a bad thing, you might take it that way, but maybe extreme bold moves is the correct action to take. But at the same time the Far Right has extreme views and they think those extreme bold ideas are the best actions to take.

The is a lot of separation between the 3 and that’s completely fine.

But saying what MAGA says is untrue is the same way MAGA feels when the left say the same thing to them. When both sides are more extreme.
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Do you think expanding the Supreme Court is an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Not extreme. Disagree

Do you think deporting all illegals in America as an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Extreme. Disagree

Do you think getting rid of the filibuster is an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Not extreme. Disagree.

Do you think pardoning J6 prisoners is an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Extreme. Disagree

Do you think getting rid of the electoral college is an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Not extreme. Strongly agree.

Do you think having a federal overwatch on speech is an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Extreme. Disagree. No one was suggesting this as you present it. Dishonest question.

Do you think a mandatory gun buyback is an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Extreme. Disagree. Was not even a remote possibility.

Do you think getting rid of Federal Departments is an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Somewhat extreme. Generally disagree

Do you think replacing the income tax with tariffs an extreme view or do you agree with it?

Extreme. Extremely stupid. Disagree.
 
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Al-O-Meter said:
Who are you referring to? And I don’t mean ‘point to a vaguely defined group of people’. Show me specific comments from specific people directed at you that make the claims you cite and I’ll stand shoulder-to-shoulder with you to denounce it.

There are those who think Kamala Harris was an extremist. In 2019 she made some comments that came across that way and those old comments haunted her in this past election, but I know I’ve never said Kamala was extremist. I think she’s not a good candidate for a range of reasons but we can disagree on that.

As for LogGrad, I don’t see him as a “flaming liberal”, whatever that means. I see LogGrad as someone who is in physical pain and consuming Percocet at a rate that has put him on the radar of programs created to head off abuse of opioids. That pain, which I don’t doubt is real, has reduced his personal tolerance for being challenged. As LogGrad’s condition persists, his world is contracting and drifting toward nihilism.




On better days, it is only Trump, Musk, and those he sees as “the Oligarchs” that he wants to see dead.



On worse days, he wants to see everyone dead, and I do mean everyone.


I don't see that as drifting leftward, but that is just me.

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Probably me. I say they are left wing extremists when they have views of speech regulation, court expansion, mandatory gun buybacks, electoral college removal, filibuster removal and other things that majority of people are for or close to center idea. Obama care was an extremist idea, yet now it’s apart of the norm.

Again it’s okay to have extreme views, just acknowledge it. I want a federal college where it’s subsidized/market based so we can fix the student debt issue. It’s an extreme view.
 
Bucknutz said:
What would you consider an extreme view? I see it as something that doesn’t swing too far away from the center.

For example, why would you want to expand the Supreme Court? Most people on the left say the Supreme Court is compromised by corruption on the right. Yet there is nothing to prove they did anything wrong or maybe even falsely accused. But that’s the grounds to expand? No, you and I both know it’s ideologically leans right and they don’t like it because of its rulings. You don’t hear these same posters say let’s expand the courts now…why, Trump gets to expand it with his picks and the Senate would push them right through.

It’s extreme because they are only wanting to do it to benefit their party and not the good of the country. It’s a selfish idea.

You take rounding up the illegals here and deporting them. I think that it is an extremist view. A more central view to this is deport the people causing issues. These people being a lot of value to country and it makes no sense deporting people who have a life here now. The right thinks it’s going to help their party and it’s a selfish idea.

Again, nothing wrong with wanting these ideas or have these views; they might be needed to make America take the next forward step.
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I think your first sentence is miswritten, you say that an extremist view "doesn't swing too far away from center." I'm sure you mean the opposite. If not, then we need to have a SERIOUS discussion about definitions.

On the Supreme Court issue, specifically, I actually would still be in favor of reworking the court entirely. Expanding it, maybe implementing a round robin of who hears cases. There have been plenty of suggestions for how to make changes. How much can be done without a constitutional amendment is up for debate, but it's absolutely ludicrous that someone can be appointed and spend 50+ years, well into senility, The longest serving justice was there for 36 years, from 1939 until 1975. The problem as I see it is not if they're left or right personally, but if they allow political/personal opinions to outweigh legal considerations. (RBG was a prodigious legal mind, but I think she is an example of this.) The right constantly complains about activist judges, and yet they pack the courts absolutely full of them.

As far as immigration, I think we need to take a bigger look here. The US, and capitalism in general, is absolutely enamored with GROWTH above all else. It's not enough to make $1,000,000,000 every year, you need to make MORE next year, and the year after that. It's not enough to sell more widgets than everyone, you have to sell more every year. Similarly, the US has to keep growing. There are only 2 ways to do that - internally or externally. If we don't have immigration, the only way to do it is internally, that is to say, making people pump out as many kids as possible. That's why the same people who are against immigration (and, let's be real here, they're not just against illegal immigration) are also against abortion and contraception.

But this really isn't addressing why you think that people can't be in favor of (or admit being in favor of) extremist views. Sometimes we need to take extreme measures.
 
Bucknutz said:
Probably me. I say they are left wing extremists when they have views of speech regulation, court expansion, mandatory gun buybacks, electoral college removal, filibuster removal ...
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You make a fair point, but I see things differently. Even though it is currently people prominent on the political left that want those things, I don’t see any of those as left wing ideas. That entire list is about power and control.
  • Make criticism of your ideas illegal.
  • Dilute the court with people guaranteed to uphold your ideas so the court is removed as an obstacle.
  • Take tools of resistance away from those being ruled
  • Remove structures of the republic that have stood in the way of gaining power
  • Weaken the opposition party in the legislative branch.
That is a wish list for subjugation. Abolishing the filibuster was never about some lefty ideal and it should shock no one the political left spun on a dime moments after Trump was elected to now oppose removing the filibuster. It was always about power and control.

Sadly, I also don’t see those ideas as extreme. Throughout history and all over the world, these yearnings for tools to impose governmental dominance are depressingly common.

Bucknutz said:
I want a federal college where it’s subsidized/market based so we can fix the student debt issue. It’s an extreme view.
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If you want to fix the student debt issue, the solution is simple. Make student debt disposable in bankruptcy, and ban co-signers on student loans, but that may be a conversation for a different time.
 
Red said:
www.telegraph.co.uk

Donald Trump ‘to expel all transgender people from military’

Reported move would mean loss of 15,000 personnel at a time when the US is struggling to recruit, warn charities
www.telegraph.co.uk www.telegraph.co.uk
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Cue the apologists.

I don't think this will stand. I cannot see anything like this happening given how many states have laws regarding discrimination, not to mention the federal laws. Of course, gender identity is technically not a protected class at the federal level but I cannot see a sweeping change like this happening without some solid opposition from congress and the senate, not to mention the states pushing back. This one is likely not to happen, imo.

If it does happen, it will likely be a harbinger of further discriminatory acts to come.
 
Bucknutz said:
Do you think replacing the income tax with tariffs an extreme view or do you agree with it?
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Out of all of those "honest" questions, this one is the most hilarious. Tariffs are a tax on imports. Do you know the total value of US imports annually? 3 Trillion. Do you know the US total annual tax revenue just from individual and corporate taxes? 2.6T. So you'd need something like 80% tariffs to break even, which would make basically all imports economically unfeasible, pushing annual imports close to 0. Other countries would also retaliate by imposing their own tariffs on US exports. So the end results would be the total defunding of the US government, including Trumpers beloved police and defense departments, as well as the collapse of the US economy.

So not extreme, and I agree. I've always thought living in the Mad Max universe would be interesting.
 
Fosto said:
Out of all of those "honest" questions, this one is the most hilarious. Tariffs are a tax on imports. Do you know the total value of US imports annually? 3 Trillion. Do you know the US total annual tax revenue just from individual and corporate taxes? 2.6T. So you'd need something like 80% tariffs to break even, which would make basically all imports economically unfeasible, pushing annual imports close to 0. Other countries would also retaliate by imposing their own tariffs on US exports. So the end results would be the total defunding of the US government, including Trumpers beloved police and defense departments, as well as the collapse of the US economy.

So not extreme, and I agree. I've always thought living in the Mad Max universe would be interesting.
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It is also not going to happen as made clear by Scott Bessant, Trump's nomination to be Treasury Secretary when he wrote "tariff gun will always be loaded and on the table but rarely discharged."


It is a negotiation point that will be used in exactly the same way Trump used it in his first term.
 
Fosto said:
Out of all of those "honest" questions, this one is the most hilarious. Tariffs are a tax on imports. Do you know the total value of US imports annually? 3 Trillion. Do you know the US total annual tax revenue just from individual and corporate taxes? 2.6T. So you'd need something like 80% tariffs to break even, which would make basically all imports economically unfeasible, pushing annual imports close to 0. Other countries would also retaliate by imposing their own tariffs on US exports. So the end results would be the total defunding of the US government, including Trumpers beloved police and defense departments, as well as the collapse of the US economy.

So not extreme, and I agree. I've always thought living in the Mad Max universe would be interesting.
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If we don't have over inflated government that is reckless with tax dollars we don't need income tax. Way too much waste, fraud, and abuse in government!
The pentagon has never passed an audit and they weren't even subject to audits until 2018! They cant even account for the money we know they are given and we all know about "black budgets".


View: https://x.com/RepThomasMassie/status/1857394368094597519



View: https://x.com/DaFiretruck/status/1857867433220157628


View: https://x.com/JerryDunleavy/status/1857864210484744702
 
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Mongoose said:
If we don't have over inflated government that is reckless with tax dollars we don't need income tax. Way too much waste, fraud, and abuse in government!
The pentagon has never passed an audit and they weren't even subject to audits until 2018! They cant even account for the money we know they are given and we all know about "black budgets".


View: https://x.com/RepThomasMassie/status/1857394368094597519



View: https://x.com/DaFiretruck/status/1857867433220157628


View: https://x.com/JerryDunleavy/status/1857864210484744702
Click to expand...


Prices would skyrocket, and those with lower income would be the most affected. Right now, the rich pay the vast majority of tax dollars. Tariffs at any level to fund a meaningful government would increase the price of goods astronomically (someone gotta pay for those import taxes), and the rich would be the least affected since the rest of us spend a far larger percent of our income on necessities. Any kind of consumption tax is basically a tax relief for the rich, and a burden for the rest.

But the consequences would be far more reaching than just runaway inflation and a defunded government. The US's ability to export goods would be badly damaged as well. There simply isn't any examples of a nation going for such an extreme economic policy, although the communists come closest (and they don't have good economies). It doesn't matter what the US did in 1850 or whatever. That's a completely different world.

You should also stop conflating completely separate issues to support the argument. The Pentagon needing to be audited has nothing to do with tariffs vs income taxes.
 
Al-O-Meter said:
It is also not going to happen as made clear by Scott Bessant, Trump's nomination to be Treasury Secretary when he wrote "tariff gun will always be loaded and on the table but rarely discharged."


It is a negotiation point that will be used in exactly the same way Trump used it in his first term.
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Trump is having a disagreement with Trump again...


He promises tariffs on day 1 against Canada and Mexico (and China) on day 1, which I think according to Trump is going to be national "Dictator for a Day" day.

I don't know any of this, but I would imagine NAFTA V2.0, which is a "deal" Trump did in term 1, would have stipulations about tariffs against the fellow signers of the treaty.
 
I truly hope we experience these high tariffs. I want Trump supporters to feel what they voted for! You wanted this crap! Enjoy!
 
Sardines said:
I don't know any of this, but I would imagine NAFTA V2.0, which is a "deal" Trump did in term 1, would have stipulations about tariffs against the fellow signers of the treaty.
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It does. There are pages and pages of tariffs Mexico, Canada, and the United States can charge each other as stipulated in USMCA. Here is the US Tariff Schedule:


That said, if you actually read what Trump wrote, it is clearly a negotiation point. Specifically he wrote: "This Tariff will remain in effect until such time as Drugs, in particular Fentanyl, and all Illegal Aliens stop this Invasion of our Country!" He is using the threats of tariffs to get concessions on other things, or in the stylings of soon-to-be Treasury Secretary Scott Bessant, Trump is sitting at the negotiation table with a loaded gun.
 
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