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2 miracle game winners away from same 18 game record as last year

magic said:
The Jazz are clearly a better team than last year. Last year they went down by 20 and stayed down by 20. This year they actually make it a close game.

That being said, at the moment I feel the future of the Jazz is going nowhere. We, for the first time, swung for the fences by drafting Exum. We then basically un-swing for the fences by not playing him much at all, with the flawed logic that he is too young and raw.

We traded 2 draft picks for Trey Burke. I would trade those two draft picks and Trey Burke for Exum without hesitation. I wish we would for once completely swing for the fences. For example, I would throw Exum to the wolves and see what happens. If it ends up utterly failing so be it. If he was truly the player we think he can be, he would not fail. As it stands right now, having a Trey Burke at his ceiling will get us nowhere, so it's not like a failed Exum project is any worse.

And I can't see how Exum is getting any better by the way we are developing him now. First we send him with the second unit which has a hard time scoring. This takes away his main strength, passing/court vision. Since they know the second unit can't score well, they can pressure him or double him even if he decides to drive it in and be aggressive. In consequence, this now forces him to develop a pull up jump shot in order to get more playing time. Developing a pull up jump shot takes a LOT of time. This has resulted in less and less minutes for Exum as the season has gone on.

Second, a lot of times they will have either Burks or Hayward run the point instead. So the minutes he's on the floor when this happens are basically useless since I don't ever see him becoming even an above average shooting guard. A great shooting guard needs vertical explosiveness, something Exum doesn't have.

I wish our lineup was this:
Starting:
Exum
Hood
Hayward
Kanter
Favors

Subs:
Burke
Burks
Ingles
Booker
Gobert

By having the lineup this way, Exum will actually be able to operate efficiently and contribute immediately since the floor will be well spread out. He is also a better defender than Trey so we'd benefit defensively as well. Hood will also develop nicely, and I think this starting 5 in general would have good chemistry.

Then when the bench is subbed in we'd have offensive firepower with Trey and Burks. And Trey's crappy defense will not be as painful since he's going against bench players and will have Gobert protecting the rim.

Sadly, these lineups will probably never be tested. But just from watching all the games it makes the most sense to me.
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In Kobe Bryant's first season, he averaged 15.5 minutes per game. John Stockton as a rookie at age 23, 18.2. Exum so far, 18.1 minutes per game. . .
 
Gameface said:
Don't die on us Sneakers! We'll just be tanking this year, and next year and maybe the year after that, plus the year after that year if we're not quite "champion calibre" yet, so just stick with it and 10 or so years from now the Jazz will make an attempt at getting into the playoffs.
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Dont you get it you are not allowed to get jaded after 4 bad years with no improvement. The good folks of the internet have demanded bad young players get big minutes and fail so we know what we have. We need to see they suck before management has the fan support to move forward.
 
framer said:
In Kobe Bryant's first season, he averaged 15.5 minutes per game. John Stockton as a rookie at age 23, 18.2. Exum so far, 18.1 minutes per game. . .
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I understand this but Exum should be given a better team to lead, when he is on the floor.
He needs to play in a functional environment, so he needs to be a paired with at least one more player from the current Jazz starters.
I think best candidate would be Kanter. This way, Jazz would have a strong second punch and Exum will learn to play meaningful minutes and sets with bigs.
 
Tarkanian said:
I understand this but Exum should be given a better team to lead, when he is on the floor.
He needs to play in a functional environment, so he needs to be a paired with at least one more player from the current Jazz starters.
I think best candidate would be Kanter. This way, Jazz would have a strong second punch and Exum will learn to play meaningful minutes and sets with bigs.
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You mean like Hayward? Isn't that the reason that we keep pulling Hayward out and replacing him with Ingles really early in the first? Hayward is the one player that looks like he "gets" the system and is definitely the only one out there with the young'uns in the second unit that really has a clue when things get rough. That probably isn't a permanent thing because it is helping contribute to our bad first quarters, but his presence is definitely a pressure valve off Exum in particular. Once a leader for the bench emerges, I suspect Haywards minutes will better match the other starters.
 
Catchall said:
The Jazz's bench tonight got outscored by 25 pts in a 2-pt loss. If you want, you can look at the bright side and say our starters outscored theirs by 23 pts. This is how the Jazz are rebuilding---throw the young players into the fire and make the bench bad enough to keep us lottery competitive.
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Have to put this in perspective. The Jazz no longer take out all their starters and put in an entire 2nd unit. So the subs defer to the starter(s) that are still on the court in terms of shooting. Nugget subs played 79 minutes combined as opposed to 64 for the Jazz subs.

While the Jazz bench was outscored 38-13, you have to look at the shot totals. Jazz subs only took 12 shots. Denver bench took 34 shots. So per shot, the production was about equal. As each team had about the same number of FG attempts, it's clearly a case of the remaining starter(s) looking for more shot opportunities when they're playing with the 2nd unit. And that's to be expected: Gobert, Ingles and Exum are not offensive threats. Hopefully Hood can find his shot now that he's back in the lineup.
 
I'm still patient and not jumping off the bandwagon...unless we lose by 45 pts at home to a mediocre team and Coach Snyder says "It's just one game".
 
I'm having a boot camp flashback.

I had a colorful RDC (Recruit Division Commander, aka in other branches a "Drill Instructor") named CB2 (SeaBee Second Class) Martini. One more time, CB2 Martini.

CB2 Martini was a hard, mean mother ****er. He took on most of the duties of teaching my brand new recruit division how to march. I mean, this is day one, 89 random dumb asses, trying to march. Marching probably seems pretty straight forward but it actually takes a few days to even be able to march in a straight line. Anyway, there's a guy holding the company flag, called the pylon (the flag is called a pylon and the position is called "the pylon"). Now overall were are marching in order of height, tallest to shortest. But the pylon is the shortest guy and he marches at the front and carries the flag (the pylon). So we're marching around and tripping over each other's feet and CB2 Martini has already "dropped" us a couple times (as in, drop and give me 20). So this time he turns around in a rage, grabs the pylon from the short guy and throws it across this paved marching ground, tells us all to get on the ground and starts yelling at us. He tells us that if we don't get our **** together he's going to beat us all with the pylon...and I quote "and I'm not talking about the ****ing stick!" Then we get up, start marching again and **** up pretty much right away. He stops. Takes a deep breath. Grabs the guy calling cadence pulls him over and kneels him down. He tells us all that what he wishes is that they gave him a .45 and one bullet. He says he'd drop one of us just so we knew this wasn't a ****ing game. Shoot one of us in the head. He mimics doing this to the guy he pulled aside and had kneel down. Then he "beat us" (silly rikky term that means he made us do a bunch of exercises). Then we got up and continued to march like ****.

Don't know why, but this thread made me feel like sharing.

P.S. Petty Officer Martini got new orders half way through my boot camp and was replaced by a Senior Chief. CB2 Martini was a crazy *** person. It was partly an act for boot camp, but that SOB enjoyed that **** way too much.
 
framer said:
In Kobe Bryant's first season, he averaged 15.5 minutes per game. John Stockton as a rookie at age 23, 18.2. Exum so far, 18.1 minutes per game. . .
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Kevin Garnett averaged 28.7 mpg in his first season, and Stockton started 30 years ago. Times have changed. Burke averaged 32.3 mpg in his first season. There is no reason to not play Exum more by this logic.
 
magic said:
Kevin Garnett averaged 28.7 mpg in his first season, and Stockton started 30 years ago. Times have changed. Burke averaged 32.3 mpg in his first season. There is no reason to not play Exum more by this logic.
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Except we didn't actually HAVE another legit point guard on the team when Burke came back off injury. If we had, we could have brought Burke along a bit more slowly which would have been beneficial. Exum is in an extended shooting slump. More time isn't going to cure that. My belief is that he is getting worked hard in practice which would account for his wearing down which is showing in the games. Look, Quinn was hired and revered because of his reputation for player development. In the first season, at least, I'm going to trust his judgment and assume he is "player developing." It really looks like all of the young guys are making strides from where they were last year, so, unless you have any real analysis that Quinn or I may be missing, I'm going to go with his take on the issue.
 
Someone explain to me how first half blowouts like this ... and each of the past 6 games ... are any better than the **** we went through with Corbin. Unwatchable bball
 
After the first two weeks of the season I was thinking we would get 35 wins, hoping for .500 but no playoffs The west is just way to good. It will take 45+ wins to get there. At this point, we might not hit 30 wins. That is pretty sad considering we didn't do much worse with Corbin last year. :mad:
 
magic said:
Kevin Garnett averaged 28.7 mpg in his first season, and Stockton started 30 years ago. Times have changed. Burke averaged 32.3 mpg in his first season. There is no reason to not play Exum more by this logic.
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Except the fact Exum usually scores 2 pts on 1-3 shooting, doesn't penetrate and is pretty much invisible....against fellow backups. I don't like Burke, but Exum is NOT the answer right now, not even close.
 
Sneakers said:
Someone explain to me how first half blowouts like this ... and each of the past 6 games ... are any better than the **** we went through with Corbin. Unwatchable bball
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It just is.
I won't be able to convince you why though, your mind is made up.

You will be back though
 
Some fans expected way too much from this year. Especially the OP.
.
We have a rookie HC.
We got quite a bit younger from an already young team last year.
Our bench is 3 rookies and a 2nd year player with 1 vet.
Our team was boring and pathetic last year while not giving minutes to the guys we were supposedly developing, So now we are doing what should have been done 2 years ago. Our development was seriously stunted because of misuse the last few years.
.
I said before the year we would be lucky to win 30 games. I said that because of all of the reasons listed above. We could win less games this year than last year and still be far better off than we were before.
.
I'm not completely sold on Snyder. But I see enough to give the guy time before starting the bitching I've seen on here lately.
.
I just realized why I virtually never post here anymore and have not stopped by and even looked in almost 2 weeks. Nothing worth reading. At least I did not run across any Franklin posts today, Not worth his time trolling when everybody is already bitching I guess.
 
gregbroncs said:
Some fans expected way too much from this year. Especially the OP.
.
We have a rookie HC.
We got quite a bit younger from an already young team last year.
Our bench is 3 rookies and a 2nd year player with 1 vet.
Our team was boring and pathetic last year while not giving minutes to the guys we were supposedly developing, So now we are doing what should have been done 2 years ago. Our development was seriously stunted because of misuse the last few years.
.
I said before the year we would be lucky to win 30 games. I said that because of all of the reasons listed above. We could win less games this year than last year and still be far better off than we were before.
.
I'm not completely sold on Snyder. But I see enough to give the guy time before starting the bitching I've seen on here lately.
.
I just realized why I virtually never post here anymore and have not stopped by and even looked in almost 2 weeks. Nothing worth reading. At least I did not run across any Franklin posts today, Not worth his time trolling when everybody is already bitching I guess.
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franklin and GVC would disagree with that statement. All the young players were perfectly developed by Corbin last year.
 
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