A piece of good news

[Jamezz]

https://www.freedomworks.org/content/house-introduces-bill-repeal-patriot-act

This is awesome, introduced by both a Dem and a Rep. I wish them well and I'm sure the vast majority of the American public support it.

 

[Harambe]

https://www.freedomworks.org/content/house-introduces-bill-repeal-patriot-act

This is awesome, introduced by both a Dem and a Rep. I wish them well and I'm sure the vast majority of the American public support it.

A bill is just a piece of paper without support. Repealing the patriot act is very important, but without a majority support it's just another waste of tax payer dollars.

I'll pull a Jamezz, and say "call me when" they actually get some weight behind it
I

 

[franklin]

On the flip side, the Utah republican nannies just passed the seat belt law as a primary offense. After years of spending your tax dollars to campaign to you that you should do something you may not want to. What happened to this state?

 

[fishonjazz]

On the flip side, the Utah republican nannies just passed the seat belt law as a primary offense. After years of spending your tax dollars to campaign to you that you should do something you may not want to. What happened to this state?

This pisses me off.
Gives the cops a bs reason to pull over whoever they want and simply claim that they didn't see that you had a seat belt on.

 

[VINYLONE]

On the flip side, the Utah republican nannies just passed the seat belt law as a primary offense. After years of spending your tax dollars to campaign to you that you should do something you may not want to. What happened to this state?

What's the scuttlebutt on this law for those of us that live elsewhere?

 

[Beer]

This pisses me off.
Gives the cops a bs reason to pull over whoever they want and simply claim that they didn't see that you had a seat belt on.

So buckle up, its better for everyone. I just can't fathom why some are so opposed to the idea of being safe.

 

[fishonjazz]

So buckle up, its better for everyone. I just can't fathom why some are so opposed to the idea of being safe.

You didn't understand my post apparently.

Now a cop can pull someone over, who IS wearing thier seatbelt, and when the driver asks why they were pulled over the cop simply says "I thought you were not wearing your seatbelt."

This will greatly help the police to be able to pull people over when they are profiling someone because they always have a built in reason to pull someone over now

I mean if my seatbelt is grey and the shirt or jacket I'm wearing is grey then that seat belt is going to be awfully hard to see. So a cop might pull me over for "not wearing a seatbelt" even though I am wearing one...... essentially pulling me over for no reason at all and just harrassing me/you/the general public.


I prefer to deal with cops as little as possible. This new rule simply increases my chances of dealing with the police even if I wear my seatbelt 100% of the time

 

[Beer]

You didn't understand my post apparently.

Now a cop can pull someone over, who IS wearing thier seatbelt, and when the driver asks why they were pulled over the cop simply says "I thought you were not wearing your seatbelt."

This will greatly help the police to be able to pull people over when they are profiling someone because they always have a built in reason to pull someone over now

I mean if my seatbelt is grey and the shirt or jacket I'm wearing is grey then that seat belt is going to be awfully hard to see. So a cop might pull me over for "not wearing a seatbelt" even though I am wearing one...... essentially pulling me over for no reason at all and just harrassing me/you/the general public.


I prefer to deal with cops as little as possible. This new rule simply increases my chances of dealing with the police even if I wear my seatbelt 100% of the time

I did miss that yes. But can't a cop pull you over and say you were speeding even though you weren't just the same? If they really want to pull you over they can get you going 2 or 3 over the limit. I get what you are saying though.

 

[Harambe]

Provide a link please? I'm not great with legalize, but it appears HB079 said the opposite...

 

[fishonjazz]

I did miss that yes. But can't a cop pull you over and say you were speeding even though you weren't just the same? If they really want to pull you over they can get you going 2 or 3 over the limit. I get what you are saying though.

Good point.

 

[Jamezz]

I just think the bill that was introduced is better than nothing. By no means I think that it's a done deal, if it gained momentum I wouldn't be surprised if they pull another 9/11 to rejuvenate the idea of 'patriotism'. About the seat belt issue I'm with fish, just another tool for the cops to harass us.

 

[franklin]

What's the scuttlebutt on this law for those of us that live elsewhere?

Are you a bigger fan of a nanny state or insurance dictating laws? Maybe I'm assuming too much but I'm shocked a seemingly sensible libertarian bent would have no problems with something like this.

Provide a link please? I'm not great with legalize, but it appears HB079 said the opposite...

I heard it on the radio so it must be true. I'll be happy if you're correct, and even happier if HB079 repeals the secondary seat belt offense and gays as a protected class, legalizes marijuana, repeals all the ridiculous alcohol laws, removes politics from public education, outlaws any congressional fight over public lands, allows me to order porn and wine from out of state, kills all pit bulls, and requires enforcement of a move right law.

 

[franklin]

Good point.

It's not a good point. Police, despite all the hatred they take, have a conscious and some morals. There's a difference between giving them an excuse and an obligation.

I'm a regulator and I don't look for excuses to harass, ever. I may get loose with my normal procedures when I have a very, very good reason to do so, but you have to understand two things about this. First, I'm opening up a can of worms that creates an *** load of work that I don't want. Second, if I overstep my boundaries there is less than zero incentive for me or a cop. Loss of agency credibility, harassment suits, jeopardizing my pension (cops are on a much shorter time frame with there 20 year pension requirement), and for me but not cops I would be pushing away potential future employers. Cops have a whole lot more negatives than that last one, however, since we can catch them on camera and they can face some serious criminal charges for being dirty.

We have a saying about those who abuse the system will eventually hang themselves. It goes in reverse for a cop only magnified from white collar crime and civil penalties to prison time and losing everything you worked for for years and years. It would take a helluva lot for me to even question considering thinking about maybe doing something shady. I guarantee cops have the same mentality.

 

[franklin]

Also, it's a **** point because police don't pull people that way. You'd here about it if they did, and we don't here about it.

 

[fishonjazz]

Also, it's a **** point because police don't pull people that way. You'd here about it if they did, and we don't here about it.

You don't think that some cops are corrupt? That's your opinion I guess.

I totally find it conceivable for a cop to see a person driving a car that is dressed a certain way, or is of a certain race, or thier car is of a certain type (low rider or something) and decide that they want to pull that individual over (in the hopes of finding some drugs or guns or whatever) and use this seat belt law as the reason for the initial stop.

 

[fishonjazz]

Also, it's a **** point because police don't pull people that way. You'd here about it if they did, and we don't here about it.

I have heard about profiling before. And I have only heard the word "profiling" in context with police officers.

 

[fishonjazz]

It's not a good point. Police, despite all the hatred they take, have a conscious and some morals. There's a difference between giving them an excuse and an obligation.

I'm a regulator and I don't look for excuses to harass, ever. I may get loose with my normal procedures when I have a very, very good reason to do so, but you have to understand two things about this. First, I'm opening up a can of worms that creates an *** load of work that I don't want. Second, if I overstep my boundaries there is less than zero incentive for me or a cop. Loss of agency credibility, harassment suits, jeopardizing my pension (cops are on a much shorter time frame with there 20 year pension requirement), and for me but not cops I would be pushing away potential future employers. Cops have a whole lot more negatives than that last one, however, since we can catch them on camera and they can face some serious criminal charges for being dirty.

We have a saying about those who abuse the system will eventually hang themselves. It goes in reverse for a cop only magnified from white collar crime and civil penalties to prison time and losing everything you worked for for years and years. It would take a helluva lot for me to even question considering thinking about maybe doing something shady. I guarantee cops have the same mentality.

In this post you are comparing how you do things in your line of work with how all police do things.

I tend to think that not every police officer does his or her job in exactly the same way since they are all individuals each with thier own different flaws and morals, rather than robots that I can lump all together

 

[Gameface]

I don't think a police officer has to be corrupt or a bad person or violate policy in order to harass and invade a person's privacy and potentially destroy their life and the life of their family. It's called the drug war. Fighting the drug war requires harassment and invasion of privacy as a matter of standard operating procedure. Adding to that, the drug war targets the poor and minorities and the more reasons you give police to initiate a stop the more leeway they have to selectively enforce the law on those they consciously or subconsciously view as a "criminal."

 

[franklin]

I don't think a police officer has to be corrupt or a bad person or violate policy in order to harass and invade a person's privacy and potentially destroy their life and the life of their family. It's called the drug war. Fighting the drug war requires harassment and invasion of privacy as a matter of standard operating procedure. Adding to that, the drug war targets the poor and minorities and the more reasons you give police to initiate a stop the more leeway they have to selectively enforce the law on those they consciously or subconsciously view as a "criminal."

Profiling involves targeting those who don't conform to your views of what proper society should be. Seat belt laws for adults legalize profiling, and force people to conform to what congress' view of what proper society should be. That's the only difference between profiling without a seat belt law and with one. Dragging out the minority card is an excuse, one that expresses deeper sentiment with what's really wrong with dumb *** laws like this.

There's also the issue with allowing insurance to dictate our lives. I pay for those who don't wear seat belts just like I pay for those who ride motorcycles, partake in watersports, recreate in the mountains, or play with fireworks. Are we going to outlaw all those activities just because the rest of us have chosen to bear the costs when things go south? How about we harness every skier and snowboarder to a protective, speed controlled zipline because it's ******** that my medical insurance pays for these idiots to break there legs.

 

[franklin]

You don't think that some cops are corrupt? That's your opinion I guess.

I totally find it conceivable for a cop to see a person driving a car that is dressed a certain way, or is of a certain race, or thier car is of a certain type (low rider or something) and decide that they want to pull that individual over (in the hopes of finding some drugs or guns or whatever) and use this seat belt law as the reason for the initial stop.

Do you want to give a reasonable response that's not built to put words into my mouth so it's worth responding to?