What's new
By:

All-Time NBA Draft FINALS: Spycam1 vs. Ellis269

Who would win in a 7 game series?

  • Total voters
    34
  • Poll closed .
Ellis wins in 6 due to PG/SG, how he built around Jordan, Spy has edges at at C, SF (small margin).
But well done to both of you well thought out teams- Good Luck to both of you
 
zbone said:
What I don't understand is how in the world spycam's team made it to the finals. Ellis wins clearly.
Click to expand...
In the Semis I managed to score 10 votes against Ellis' team.. that's the most any team has achieved so far in this year's competition..
 
ONE LOVE said:
In the Semis I managed to score 10 votes against Ellis' team.. that's the most any team has achieved so far in this year's competition..
Click to expand...

And you were leading the voting early on enough to make me worry.

I'm very happy with how I built my team. I got 4 out of my top 5 targets for starters (missing out on Anthony Davis and having to go with Webber instead.) I really like my starting 5, but in hindsight, I'd have built my bench differently based on one opportunity that I passed on. I'll go into depth how I think I could have built an even stronger bench once the voting is over.
 
As soon as I saw the starting 5 for Ellis I predicted he'd win.

This is way close though. Spy always makes a good team.
 
usually whoever has Jordan puts a dumb team around him. Also, Ellis had the advantage of getting a chance to pick Pippen. Pippen is usually gone by the turn. He got Ewing there too who is usually gone.
 
Hack said:
As soon as I saw the starting 5 for Ellis I predicted he'd win.

This is way close though. Spy always makes a good team.
Click to expand...

I agree. The voting doesn't reflect that, but Spy's team is damned good and very challenging. Usually there's no way to pair Olajuwon with a talent like Bird. It cost him in the rest of his lineup, but he did an impressive job despite being slightly handicapped.

Also, you screwed up my best laid plans twice by snagging Anthony Davis and Penny Hardaway right in front of me.
 
Hack said:
usually whoever has Jordan puts a dumb team around him. Also, Ellis had the advantage of getting a chance to pick Pippen. Pippen is usually gone by the turn. He got Ewing there too who is usually gone.
Click to expand...

I was stressing watching the board develop and going those two would fall. Almost traded up to get at least one, but my patience paid off. I was damned fortunate to have the board go my way AND for One Love to draft Gary Payton without really wanting him. Trading for him was huge for my team.
 
Round 8

85. Hekate - Arvydas Sabonis
86. Hack - Andrew Wiggins
87. Thee jazz fan - DeMarcus Cousins
88. Eminence - Bobby Jones
89. White Chocolate - Ron Artest
90. Tfivas - Robert Parish
91. Jeffrey32 - Sidney Moncrief
92. Hack - Penny Hardaway
93. Ellis269 - Chris Bosh
94. Spycam1 - Chauncey Billups
95. White Chocolate - Amar'e Stoudemire
96. Thee jazz fan - Bob Pettit

Round 9

97. Ellis 269 - Deron Williams
98. Spycam1 - Mark Eaton
99. Spycam1 - Rajon Rondo
100. One Love - Tim Hardaway
101. Ellis269 - Jimmy Butler
102. Jeffrey32 - Lenny Wilkens
103. Tfivas - Dell Curry
104. Jeffrey32 - Marc Gasol
105. Eminence - Danny Green
106. Ellis269 - Kyle Korver
107. Siro - Shawn Marion
108. Hekate - Draymond Green

This is where I almost went a totally different direction with my bench. I tried trading for Dennis Rodman in the 6th round, but had to settle for Dwight Howard instead. When pick #93 came up, WC proposed a three team trade where I'd get Rodman, Spy would get Howard and WC would get Elgin Baylor. I was on the verge of taking the deal if I could keep my other picks as they were, but balked because of Dwight's 2-way potential off my bench. Had I take the deal, I had a totally different plan than the one I executed. I still would have drafted Chris Bosh at #93, but I would have focused on getting 90's players to fill out my back court. Instead of Deton Williams at #97, I would have taken Tim Hardaway (who was One Love's starting PG), Marc Gasol at #101 (couldn't believe he was still on the board) and then Dale Ellis at #106 (to provide the shooting and spacing that I drafted Korver for). Then at 121 I'd have picked Glenn Robinson to round out my wing rotation and hope Nate Thurmond lasted to my final pick.

Final Roster (and very likely for me to pull off)

1 : Gary Payton - Tim Hardaway
2 : Michael Jordan - Dale Ellis
3 : Scottie Pippen - Glenn Robinson
4 : Chris Webber - Dennis Rodman - Chris Bosh
5 : Patrick Ewing - Marc Gasol - Nate Thurmond
 
This vote is way too lopsided.

For example, I take spy's team 10 out of 10 times over ONE LOBE's (<-- typo, but lololol)
 
My 4th year in a row making it to the Finals. But I only have one ring. I'm officially the LeBron James of this competition.
 
Cunning Linguist said:
Regarding each guy's starters...

NBA Finals MVP's: Ellis has just Jordan. Spy has Billups, Wade, Bird and Olajuwon. That's four guys who have come up HUGE when it matters most. Edge Spy.

NBA Championship rings: Ellis 12 (Jordan 6, Pippen 6)
Spy 14 (Rodman 5, Bird 3, Wade 3, Olajuwon 2, Billups 1)
Again, the edge to spy.

All-NBA 1st Team: Ellis 17 (Jordan 10, Pippen 3, Payton 2, Webber 1, Ewing 1)
Spy 17 (Bird 9, Wade 2, Olajuwon 6)
TIE

Best rebounding rates all-time: Ellis--Ewing 59th, Webber 119th...
Spy--Rodman 1st, Hakeem 36th, Bird 124th...
No one else in the top 250.
Spy kills Ellis on the glass.

Best TS% all-time: Ellis--Jordan 78th, Ewing 160th,...no one else in the top 250
Spy--Billups 59th, Wade 93th, Bird 97th, Olajuwon 157th, Rodman 206th

So let's think about this. Spy's team stretches the floor much better and is much, much more efficient offensively. Then, even when they or Ellis' team does miss shots, Spy is pulling down far more rebounds and therefore getting many more opportunities.

Spy's team is better offensively by a mile and better up front defensively by a mile. And again, I think we all know defense works inside out.
Click to expand...

Nice info. Thanks for sharing.

This stuff just proved to me even more that this is my favorite team I've ever constructed.
 
To those saying Webber and Rodman are equal: I get where you're coming from, but how does Webber--as a 5th option--impact the game more than Rodman does with his rebounding and defense? Webber's peak years were great, but in terms of how each player would function within their respective team, I think Rodman clearly wins. Being on a team of superstars would in no way hinder what Rodman brings to a team.

My outside shooting >>> Ellis' outside shooting.

Billups' ability to play off the ball while his star wings run the offense > Payton's ability to do so.

My point is that I think my team has much better chemistry; it functions as a cohesive unit better than Ellis'; the whole is greater than the sum of its parts. The chemistry element of building these teams goes overlooked sometimes. It's that type of cohesion that allowed the Pistons to defeat the star-studded Lakers; or the Spurs to beat the Heat.

Not to bash on your team or anything, Ellis. Good match. You were able to capitalize on winning the #1 pick in this thing like no one else has before. Congrats.
 
Last edited:
spycam1 said:
To those saying Webber and Rodman are equal: I get where you're coming from, but how does Webber--as a 5th option--impact the game more than Rodman does with his rebounding and defense? Webber's peak years were great, but in terms of how each player would function within their respective team, I think Rodman clearly wins. Being on a team of superstars would in no way hinder what Rodman brings to a team.

My outside shooting >>> Ellis' outside shooting.

Billups' ability to play off the ball while his star wings run the offense > Payton's ability to do so.

My point is that I think my team has much better chemistry; it functions as a cohesive unit better than Ellis'; the whole is greater than the sum of its parts. The chemistry element of building these teams goes overlooked sometimes. It's that type of cohesion that allowed the Pistons to defeat the star-studded Lakers; or the Spurs to beat the Heat.

Not to bash on your team or anything, Ellis. Good match. You were able to capitalize on winning the #1 pick in this thing like no one else has before. Congrats.
Click to expand...
Good post.
It's true that chemistry goes overlooked.... and I think it kind of goes overlooked for a reason.
I have no way of knowing how these guys will mesh.
Maybe wade is upset that he isn't the man and bird gets the ball too much.
Maybe rodman drives hakeem (and everyone else) crazy with his antics.
Maybe Griffin is pissed that he's coming off the bench.
Maybe rondo acts like rondo.

Maybe everyone gets along and they all fit together.



I mostly look at matchups
Then I will look at things like who has more size, shooting, rebounding, defense, scoring, etc.

Most of my vote is weighed buy overall talent on the team though.


Also, you talk about billups ability to play off the ball.
Webber has that ability too as a floor spacer and a guy that can pass better than must big men. He could be near the top of the key and hangout while his teammates operate and get the ball kicked to him and be a triple threat to score, drive, or make a good pass.

As for webber being the 5th option...... I would have pippen and payton focus on defense and use most of their energy on defense and then on offense Jordan would be option #1 obviously and webber would be my #2 option since he is so versatile offensively.
I would put ewing 18-20 feet away from the hoop on the baseline (where he is deadly from) to pull hakeem away from the hoop and then let jordan and webber slice up the defense.
 
Last edited:
Ellis's team looks unbeatable on paper, but as far as championship experience is concerned, Spy's team has a combined 17 rings (every starter has rings, 8 players total) whereas Ellis's team has 14 rings shared by only 3 players. Jordan doesn't deserve another championship after pushing-off/cheating to get his sixth against the Jazz. Payback is a bitch...Spy wins.
 
One other thing that influences my vote (that you guys have no way to strategize for) is being biased/overrating guys that I loved to watch play when i was growing up.

Gary payton was one of my all time favorites so I probably over rate him.
I really like hakeem and webber too.
 
Fwiw, Rodman would spend a lot of time guarding Jordan, and Bird would guard Webber. Rodman making things difficult for Jordan was one of the reasons he couldn't get passed the bad boy Pistons back in the day. Not that that was the sole reason, or that that alone would shift this series in my favor, but having a guy like Rodman to guard Jordan, and Bird who can switch onto 4s is a really nice strategy. Rodman would be my first or second choice (along with Pippen) to guard Jordan.

Not that it matters. This stuff is still fun to talk about though.
 
Man, everybody talking about rings... rings and team record are NOT player evaluation tools, these are TEAM evaluation tools. One of the very last things I look at when evaluating players.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page
Back
Top