would it be okay if i a movie is made about mlk with a white actor playing him.

[DutchJazzer]

had this discusion with some of my friends about supergirl.

in super girl they cast a big smooth talking alpha male black guy as jimmy Olson.
but people are complaining about the casting, the proponents of this casting are calling every RACISM!

i do not like this jimmy olson, cus to me jimmy Olson was always a nerdy, weak, shy, bad with the ladies frail beta male. not some alpha male confident buf guy.

what say you is this just a case of racism, or legitimate gripes.

 

[Zapper7246]

Not okay. That would just be dumb.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Siro]

Comic books originated in the first decades of the 20th century when diversity in media was non-existent. Should society and its values stand still just because a bunch of small minded men think the race of fictional cartoon figures is central to their lives?

 

[Hekate]

Comic books originated in the first decades of the 20th century when diversity in media was non-existent. Should society and its values stand still just because a bunch of small minded men think the race of fictional cartoon figures is central to their lives?

The problem with the changing races is that it is either just a make-up or a complete character overhaul. It kills any artistic creation. There should be more and more diverse characters created instead of turning side characters into black people. It's almost an insult to the minorities.

There should also be more original superhero films but I may be wanting more than I should.

 

[DutchJazzer]

Comic books originated in the first decades of the 20th century when diversity in media was non-existent. Should society and its values stand still just because a bunch of small minded men think the race of fictional cartoon figures is central to their lives?

but what about the character/persona stuff.

andy why if they change everything of that character, then if you complain about it ur a racist. when skin color is the least of the problem

 

[DutchJazzer]

this:

became this

they changed everything that make jimmy Olson, his whole persona/psyche .it has nothing to do with skin color.
political correctness ruined a character. other than that super girl sucked. so will watch a few more episodes but if it does not drastically improve i will be gone.

 

[Gameface]

but what about the character/persona stuff.

andy why if they change everything of that character, then if you complain about it ur a racist. when skin color is the least of the problem

Yet you've given skin color all of the mentions.

 

[DutchJazzer]

Yet you've given skin color all of the mentions.

because any critique i gave the "creative/pc decission" is considered racism.
so we are beyond the point of not mentioning it

 

[Siro]

The problem with the changing races is that it is either just a make-up or a complete character overhaul. It kills any artistic creation. There should be more and more diverse characters created instead of turning side characters into black people. It's almost an insult to the minorities.

There should also be more original superhero films but I may be wanting more than I should.

How exactly does it kill "artistic creation"? We're talking about comic book characters, not painting over the Mona Lisa. Virtually every comic book character has a million different reincarnations with different names, looks, and characteristics. This artistic integrity only becomes an issue when it comes to race. The second part is not true either. This diversification is happening slowly across the entire medium. Several lead characters have also transformed (for example, the female Thor and black Falcon).

What it boils down to is an irrelevant adjustment to a product for mass consumption. The characters adjust to reflect the norms and trends of their times, just as they always have. It's a non-story.

 

[Hekate]

How exactly does it kill "artistic creation"? We're talking about comic book characters, not painting over the Mona Lisa.

Values are not important, to have any value is. I doubt you are writing off a entire genre.

Virtually every comic book character has a million different reincarnations with different names, looks, and characteristics.

Yes, and they have different authors who create canon or non-canon storylines.

This artistic integrity only becomes an issue when it comes to race.

Most of the time, yes. At least there are some who find Scarlett Johansson named as Motoko from Ghost in the Shell a problem. Changing her race would change how she would see the world thus create an entirely different story with possibly differen themes.

I may accept this may be a non-case in comic books because it is mostly just "American" culture.

The second part is not true either. This diversification is happening slowly across the entire medium. Several lead characters have also transformed (for example, the female Thor and black Falcon).

And it should happen. Female Thor, I support but it's a common trope, Breakout character, and she will probably go back to being normal once Thor is worthy again. I thought Falcon was created black.

What it boils down to is an irrelevant adjustment to a product for mass consumption. The characters adjust to reflect the norms and trends of their times, just as they always have. It's a non-story.

Word. Buuuut it's not a non-story.

 

[Siro]

Values are not important, to have any value is. I doubt you are writing off a entire genre.




Yes, and they have different authors who create canon or non-canon storylines.



Most of the time, yes. At least there are some who find Scarlett Johansson named as Motoko from Ghost in the Shell a problem. Changing her race would change how she would see the world thus create an entirely different story with possibly differen themes.

I may accept this may be a non-case in comic books because it is mostly just "American" culture.



And it should happen. Female Thor, I support but it's a common trope, Breakout character, and she will probably go back to being normal once Thor is worthy again. I thought Falcon was created black.



Word. Buuuut it's not a non-story.

I'm not sure how this answer is relevant to the topic. This isn't about how to transcend tropes in pop entertainment. It is about making a fuss over something hilariously inconsequential and unimportant. Everything about comic books change all the time in every way imaginable. They are written over a long period by different people in order to entertain. Changing a character's race is a lot less of a change than changing the character into an entirely different person, which happens all the time in comics.

This is about Dutch's OP, which is about how upset he is to see black characters in comics. I see such bitching on the internet all the time. Pretending the concern is about pushing for higher standards is a distraction.

 

[Hekate]

I'm not sure how this answer is relevant to the topic. This isn't about how to transcend tropes in pop entertainment. It is about making a fuss over something hilariously inconsequential and unimportant. Everything about comic books change all the time in every way imaginable. They are written over a long period by different people in order to entertain. Changing a character's race is a lot less of a change than changing the character into an entirely different person, which happens all the time in comics.

This is about Dutch's OP, which is about how upset he is to see black characters in comics. I see such bitching on the internet all the time. Pretending the concern is about pushing for higher standards is a distraction.

Who cares about Dutch? Everything is inconsequential and unimportant. **** science, too.

I believe changing a characters race is changing the character to a different person. You don't, that's okay.

 

[Siro]

Most of the time, yes. At least there are some who find Scarlett Johansson named as Motoko from Ghost in the Shell a problem. Changing her race would change how she would see the world thus create an entirely different story with possibly differen themes.

I may accept this may be a non-case in comic books because it is mostly just "American" culture.

Oh, and this change is only "unacceptable" because it doesn't make sense. Why not make her a cat? Or a can of soda? It is not consistent with that universe's internal logic (no indication that their Japan has natives with European ethnicity). It has nothing whatsoever to do with race. Changing the character to be chubby, for example, would be perfectly fine, as it would not conflict with the world's logic. So not an instructive example.

 

[Siro]

Who cares about Dutch? Everything is inconsequential and unimportant. **** science, too.

I believe changing a characters race is changing the character to a different person. You don't, that's okay.

It is inconsequential within the context of comics, not as an existential statement.

If they changed the character's name and characteristics, but kept him a white male, we would not have heard a peep. I wouldn't even know the controversy exists. After all, they did that thousands of times over more than half a century. I'm afraid your position is built on a house of cards. It is time to let it collapse.

 

[VINYLONE]

they changed everything that make jimmy Olson, his whole persona/psyche .it has nothing to do with skin color.
political correctness ruined a character. other than that super girl sucked. so will watch a few more episodes but if it does not drastically improve i will be gone.

You're right. I agree. The character was ruined and changed from a beta male to an alpha male. PC did not ruin this character because there are black nerds (Did I do thaaaaat?), an over-zealous suit did.

That being said, are you comparing a character from a comic book to a historical figure known for championing the civil rights of all people? Please advise. Please ****ing advise because we are NOT talking about Kirk Lazarus here.

 

[Siro]

By the way, this happens whenever a non-white character plays a traditionally white role. Just like the recent James Bond debacle. Similar to this, the racists scrambled to find reasons to object to the casting that had nothing to do with race. Most hilarious among them was Anthony Horowitz calling the casting of Idris Elba "too street". Change the character all you want. Make him blond, redhead, old, young, Scottish, English, or whatever you want, AS LONG AS YOU KEEP HIM WHITE, and nobody will say a thing. Casting a movie about ancient Egypt with 90% of the characters played by white actors is a non-issue however (as it should be btw, who gives a ****?).

But no, for sure, it's all about the integrity of the artistic vision.

 

[♪alt13]

Ummm I don't know if you know this dutch but MLK wasn't a comic boom character. He was real, like really reals furreal.

 

[Miggs]

One of the coolest, most likable, and most loved characters in recent film had his race changed from text to film and nobody gave a damn.

There are bigger fish to fry.

I'll let people try to figure out which character from which movie.

 

[DutchJazzer]

By the way, this happens whenever a non-white character plays a traditionally white role. Just like the recent James Bond debacle. Similar to this, the racists scrambled to find reasons to object to the casting that had nothing to do with race. Most hilarious among them was Anthony Horowitz calling the casting of Idris Elba "too street". Change the character all you want. Make him blond, redhead, old, young, Scottish, English, or whatever you want, AS LONG AS YOU KEEP HIM WHITE, and nobody will say a thing. Casting a movie about ancient Egypt with 90% of the characters played by white actors is a non-issue however (as it should be btw, who gives a ****?).

But no, for sure, it's all about the integrity of the artistic vision.

idris is not to street, unless he cant act and act exactly like stringer bell when playnig james bond.
but thats like saying gary oldman is to gangsta in because he played a thug in true romance

 

[Miggs]

Btw I'm not saying it would be cool for a white guy to play MLK, Jr. It wouldn't be. At all,