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Wolves in Utah

What about the coy wolf? Have you guys heard about that? It's the eastern coyote. It's like 1/4 wolf, 2/3 coyote and the rest domestic dog breeds. Apparently they now number over 1 million, and are pretty aggressive, even have killed some humans.
 
b_line said:
What about the coy wolf? Have you guys heard about that? It's the eastern coyote. It's like 1/4 wolf, 2/3 coyote and the rest domestic dog breeds. Apparently they now number over 1 million, and are pretty aggressive, even have killed some humans.
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Not related, but there are people who breed wolves with domestic dogs...those people should be shot. Dangerous "pets".
 
♪alt13 said:
Exactly.

I would add that I think it's time for western states to start proposing Wilderness areas, predator reintroduction, etc in eastern states. :)
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Montana needs to set up a lottery draw for one tag for a grizzly bear. Would rack in the $$$$$$.
 
I've never seen a wolf in Utah but have ran across a huge mountain lion on east side of Zion.
 
Howard said:
Not related, but there are people who breed wolves with domestic dogs...those people should be shot. Dangerous "pets".
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He didn't breed them, but my dad bought one. I HATED THAT ****ING thing.
At about 4 years old (after biting me multiple times) it cornered me in the barn, I grabbed a spade and smacked it across the head as hard as I could. Knocked it silly and then shot it about 10 times. **** that "dog."
 
Howard said:
Not related, but there are people who breed wolves with domestic dogs...those people should be shot. Dangerous "pets".
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Agreed.
Hope they are not breeding the wolves with pitt bulls
 
Joe Bagadonuts said:
Cool video. I wonder how much of what it says is true. It sounds plausible, but feels a bit overstated, especially given the timeframe.
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I was able to find a twelve page paper written up about how elk migration is influenced by wolf introduction/relocation, including how they gathered the data over the course of 363 days. This illustrates the beginning of the cascade quite well.

Please PM me and we can discuss delivery of it to you, if you'd like.

There's also this terribly long link of a 15 year study Shortened, to make mind safe
 
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ElRoach0 said:
Please enlighten me.

Include numbers.
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Numbers? Don't have them. We don't even know how many wolves we have man, you aren't going to get accurate numbers anywhere.

Anyways, many deaths occur from the hazing by wolves, particularily with pregnant cow elk/does/moose etc. The stress causes early births, which lead to either DOA or killed by wolves/other animals. You don't need to believe it, I know there aren't a bunch of studies that can prove it, but I've seen it. I know people who have seen it. It's why elk are moving into places they never were before. Just common sense, tbh.
 
Howard said:
Numbers? Don't have them. We don't even know how many wolves we have man, you aren't going to get accurate numbers anywhere.

Anyways, many deaths occur from the hazing by wolves, particularily with pregnant cow elk/does/moose etc. The stress causes early births, which lead to either DOA or killed by wolves/other animals. You don't need to believe it, I know there aren't a bunch of studies that can prove it, but I've seen it. I know people who have seen it. It's why elk are moving into places they never were before. Just common sense, tbh.
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Well of course you don't. Why would you look at studies that people did with legitimate numbers when you can run with gut feeling and anecdotal evidence?

Here's an excerpt from another actual study:

Abstract: We examined interactions between wolves (Canis lupus) and domestic calves (Bos tauras) within a grazing allotment in central Idaho, USA, to evaluate the role of wolves on calf survival and movements. During the 1999 and 2000 grazing seasons, we radiomarked 231 calves/year-representing 33% of the calf population--on the Dia- mond Moose Association (DMA) grazing allotment and monitored their survival and movements relative to wolf distribution. Overall, calf survival was high (295%), with relatively few mortalities (n = 13) among the marked population. Of the 13 calf mortalities, 8 were unrelated to predation (pneumonia, unknown natural causes, fire), 4 were wolf predation, and 1 was coyote predation. Calves selected by wolves were younger than the surviving cohort by an average of 24 days (wolf-killed: 31 Mar ? 13 days [mean birthdate ? SE], n = 4; live population: 7 Mar ? 1.6 days, n = 207; P < 0.05). Calf movement patterns and group size did not vary relative to the level of spatial overlap with wolves. However, vulnerability to predation appeared to be correlated with spatial proximity of calves to wolf home ranges and rendezvous sites. These results suggest that in our study area, the overall impact of wolves was not significant on either calf survival or behavior.
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5 calves in 231 died from predators; wolf or coyote. 2.1% Let's be generous and use that whole 13, and round to 5%. So, feeding on calves, or causing stress related calf deaths, and blaming wolves for all other natural death phenomenon.. just seems trivial at best to me. Weigh that to the benefits gained by keeping some of the top predators around, as illustrated by the video posted yesterday and many, many documented studies.. it just seems fair. Educate yourself at scholar.google.com; just type in trophic cascade. You'll see study after study showing the gains, from small to large.

All that's not so say if you see a wolf or wolf pack actually preying on your livestock let them have the cattle. But most aren't talking defend your property, they're talking extinction or trail of tears level control. This is just an unnecessary knee jerk reaction to an old fear that's been demonstrated benign in latter times.
 
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