Keillor and MeToo
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Red
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You abandoned the discredited conspiracy theory very quickly, and said it doesn't matter. But, what that did reveal is that you were willing to simply accept those theories uncritically in the first place, because they buttressed your beliefs about Dr. Ford. Which can be seen as demonstrating your beliefs about Dr. Ford are not necessarily based on a rational analysis of Ford or her testimony, as you likely would claim, but more likely on an underlying prejudice against Ford in general.
Your willingness to embrace conspiracy theories reflects poorly on your judgement, you're human, it happens. But, throwing them right out the window that quickly demonstrates you had a preconceived conclusion to begin with, which is your right, but what really needs to be questioned is whether those preconceived conclusions are based in your attitude about women in general. Now, it's not my place to suggest you take a good look at underlying beliefs, that's up to you.
that's pretty much how I would define it
True, although I honestly have rarely been victimized to the point that I feel threatened - and in some of those situations where I have felt some degree of threat, it's often been where the guy doesn't do anything in particular, but is just sort of creepy and in my general presence (sitting next to me on the bus, walking the same direction as me) and I feel uncomfortable.
More typically, when guys behave like jerks I ignore them and that's often the end of it - - if it persists to the point that I have to tell them to "cut it out" or whatever, they generally comply - - or if it's just someone trying to be friendly and make a "connection" most will take the hint if you tell them you're not interested - really in my experience, while they certainly do exist, most guys don't intentionally want to harass women
Particularly not random women - but I do think it's more common in workplace situations where there is more opportunity to harass and perhaps also a power imbalance (a family situation would be similar, the frequent contact presents frequent opportunity)
Again you are showing your ignorance. Harassment doesn't have to be continual to be harassment.
I'm aware of your side of the story you have sent me multiple long pms about to me about this, for some unknown reason. You have also sent pms about this to many people on here.
It's pretty silly that you are trying to buy into any conspiracy that you can instead is believing someone. Also why are you bringing up some other random situation? You're desperately trying to find 1 case to justify your beliefs. The vast majority of women don't get any justice for being sexually assaulted, the vast majority tell the truth when they say what happened, most women will get sexually harassed or worse.
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Ok, I will provide my take on this.
First of all, I do believe Ford was part of a plot to sabotage Kavanaugh -- the possible link to the CIA seemed to fit, but I didn't look into it that carefully. Furthermore, I have at times found Snopes to be wrong, which doesn't mean they are wrong in this case as it appears they researched it carefully. The bottomline is that I opposed Kavanaugh, in great part because of the possibility that he could affect the repeal of Roe V Wade. And I think it was this fear that motivated this plot.
Do I believe in conspiracies -- absolutely. They are far more common than people realize, but organizations that are in the business of lying like the CIA, which incidentally masterminded JFK's assassination, try to equate it with lunacy. This is the tactic of applying negative connotations to words to influence opinion (euphemism) -- because people believe a conspiracy was involved in JFK's assassination, then you're a lunatic. If you have read the histories of the CIA, many written by disgruntled former agents, you will find that conspiracy is the general mode of operation of the intelligence agencies -- stealth, subversion, cover-up. This is what the CIA does.
All I am seeking is the truth. Is it true that men often sexually harass women, yes, though it depends on what you mean as often. Is it a constant thing done by many men. I would object to that. Is it common among Hollywood moguls who are in a position to do so, perhaps yes as we know the "legend" of the casting couch (a little quid pro quo going on here, however), but then I can't say for sure because we only hear about the more high profile and sensational cases. I certainly despise people like Cosby but he is mentally-ill and a rare exception.
Do men and women view sexual harassment differently - yes. Would I feel uncomfortable about someone staring at my crotch? Yes, but I wouldn't bring that person to court and charge them with a crime. And let's face it, if a teenage boy with little experience was "harassed" by an older attractive woman, do you think he would welcome it, or not? More than likely, however, a teenage girl would not unless she was infatuated with the man. I actually was on the other end of such situations, not often, but occasionally, during the six years I was a college English teacher. I did not cross the line but I know of colleagues who did. In my opinion, that is sexual harassment but what teacher would charge a student with sexual harassment? More communication is needed about this topic. I think Moe's experience is much more common. The average guy has enough sense not to cross the line.
My beef is people accusing people of something that happened years ago without proof. And it's wrong to convict someone of something only based on hearsay, especially something that happened decades ago. Hey, it has happened to me here on Jazzfanz. No one really knows what happened between myself and One Brow 12 years ago. It's a He said/he said case. But there actually was a member on the board who was in total agreement about One Brow's multiple personality. Of course, we had no proof, only suspicion and maybe I was wrong. Yet because I approached One Brow about it and he denies it, I was harassing him. I only approached him because I was getting harassed and there was strong circumstantial evidence that he was the source. So, I wish all you accusers would just STFU and stop accusing me of something I never did. I did not stalk or harass anyone.
The court of public opinion is often not based on truth but emotion, fear, and a mob mentality. It's such things that caused hundreds or more women to be burned at the stake in the Middle Ages. It's what caused many people to be unjustly accused by Joe McCarthy, destroying their careers. Now we have MeToo, and I believe it engages in the same character assassination because people conflate their own experience with something about which they have no first hand knowledge. I found on FB that the people who were the most hysterical about the Kavanaugh situation were people who confessed to being abused or raped -- this makes a lot of sense to me, whether they're right or wrong.
Finally, we all are human, we all have frailties, and we all make mistakes and sometimes lose self-control. To attack someone for that -- I'm not talking about a pattern of behavior -- is insensitive and cruel. Archie has to admit that I never called him at work. In fact, the more I have read his posts since our dust-up, I actually have to begun to like the guy, though he seems not to recognize that. I was upset with him for his penchant for negging. But he is only human like the rest of us.
Bawse Dawg
Well-Known Member
Disgusting.
You PM me to read that drivel?
You PM me to read that drivel?
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You're free to rebut it with actual facts. You have my closing statement.
Bawse Dawg
Well-Known Member
You haven’t listened to anything anyone has said. You’ve just decided you are going to feel attacked.
So I’ll pass. Evaluate your life.
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The problem is that you can't effectively rebut some of my comments. Maybe you need to do your own evaluation. Maybe your beliefs are based on emotion rather than fact. I am only questioning things because I want the truth, the facts, not some emotional reaction to it. The same thing happened to Socrates because he wouldn't go along with the crowd and stuck to his beliefs. I never said I'm 100 percent correct but I am questioning the mob mentality that is occurring and the dangers that it engenders.
Comparing yourself to Socrates? Are you going to follow that to the logical conclusion?
Not everyone who faces opposition is a misunderstood genius. Some are just jerks.
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There are a lot of others who agree with my take -- just go online and you will find them. No, I don't plan to kill myself, though I could simply stop posting here. If I did, as I have taken breaks periodically, I would still read the Jazz news. I do learn things, especially about the Jazz. It should be a fun pastime but some people turn it into a place to vent hostility.
Darkwing Duck
Well-Known Member
Like the first post of this thread, for instance.