The Biden Administration and All Things Politics

[Deleted member 365]

Unfortunately, our military history is rife with things that didn’t go right. Task Force Smith, Desert One, hell, even Custer’s Last Stand were all massive tragedies with a litany of issues.

That doesn’t excuse Afghanistan from being a cluster because it is, but let’s not ignore a history of error.

It’s hard to encourage any soldier to fight and die for a country that you know is going to be overrun a matter of weeks or months. I agree Afghanistan is a cluster. But I’ve listened to experts on podcasts and read plenty to know that there just weren’t many options left for Biden. Even speeding up the visa process had issues due to covid, politics, and sending a message that the country was about to fail (speeding up its failure). It’s impossible to sell the idea that the country is doing okay while smashing the red button to evacuate everyone ASAP. Doing so might have made this taliban takeover occur earlier, like in June or May.

 

[JazzyFresh]

It’s hard to encourage any soldier to fight and die for a country that you know is going to be overrun a matter of weeks or months. I agree Afghanistan is a cluster. But I’ve listened to experts on podcasts and read plenty to know that there just weren’t many options left for Biden. Even speeding up the visa process had issues due to covid, politics, and sending a message that the country was about to fail (speeding up its failure). It’s impossible to sell the idea that the country is doing okay while smashing the red button to evacuate everyone ASAP. Doing so might have made this taliban takeover occur earlier, like in June or May.

Lol how stupid. You're telling me this would've happened when we had multiple air bases, an embassy, and complete control of the nation?

Jfc.. how amazingly dense

 

[JazzyFresh]

So Biden is now turning Americans away and he's going to abandon them according to multiple sources, including CNN.


Don't worry though, he got his refugee voters everyone!!! The refugees his decision literally created.

 

[reignman40]

Nothing compared to surrendering a 20 year war, leaving Americans to die and arming terrorist all while specifically saying this wouldn't happen.

The entire Biden admin is a complete joke.. Something like 85 billion in military equipment left behind.

Imagine voting for a 50 year corrupt politician from our grandparents era so you can put weak *** establishment back in the white house.. "ohh uhhhhh as usual they gave me a list of reporters to call on" "uhhhh is it time to wipe my *** yet and give me ice cream"



Sent from my SM-A326U using JazzFanz mobile app

 

[Deleted member 365]

Good article refuting a lot of the garbage that the same posters who spread misinformation about covid are now saying about Afghanistan. Rubin isn’t a liberal either.

The insistence that there must have been a painless way — or, by gosh, a less painless way! — to lose a 20-year war, rescue all imperiled Afghans and avoid any more casualties is a fable too many insist on cultivating.
We should have kept control of Bagram airfield! (Bagram is 30 miles or so from Kabul. The U.S. military would have had to protect any caravan of refugees transported there, while also defending a very large facility.)

We should have pulled out everyone in April! (Would not the Afghan government have crumbled then?)

We should have known the army would collapse! (Apparently 20 years of training and effort to forge a national identity was a waste of time.)

Just leave a few thousand U.S. troops there! (And attacks akin to what happened on Thursday would magically cease? One should think long and hard before increasing the number of Gold Star parents.)

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/08/29/biden-tells-some-hard-truths-few-want-hear/

 

[JazzGal]

The entire Biden admin is a complete joke.. Something like 85 billion in military equipment left behind.

Sent from my SM-A326U using JazzFanz mobile app

Why is Biden blamed for the actions of the Afghan military? Isn't that equipment what we gave to their military to defend their own country, which they didn't do? They are the ones who left their equipment to the Taliban, not the Americans.

I am not saying that every decision Biden makes is perfect, but it is getting tiresome to lay all of this at his feet when he inherited a mess from past administrations and the Afghani government/military.




Sent from my moto z3 using JazzFanz mobile app

 

[Deleted member 365]

Why is Biden blamed for the actions of the Afghan military? Isn't that equipment what we gave to their military to defend their own country, which they didn't do? They are the ones who left their equipment to the Taliban, not the Americans.

I am not saying that every decision Biden makes is perfect, but it is getting tiresome to lay all of this at his feet when he inherited a mess from past administrations and the Afghani government/military.




Sent from my moto z3 using JazzFanz mobile app

And for people who don’t give a **** about Afghanistan or its people to suddenly pretend to care. That’s the other thing. It’s just such fake outrage to try to exploit a tragedy to score political points. Anything to cover up the Jan 6 insurrection, I guess.

 

[Deleted member 365]

Let’s not forget:

Trump: Americans Who Died in War Are ‘Losers’ and ‘Suckers’

The president has repeatedly disparaged the intelligence of service members, and asked that wounded veterans be kept out of military parades, multiple sources tell The Atlantic.

www.theatlantic.com

Critics denounce 'low energy' Donald Trump for skipping WWI cemetery ceremony

White House cites rain as reason for canceling cemetery visit by Donald Trump.

www.usatoday.com

Donald Trump Criticizes Muslim Family of Slain U.S. Soldier, Drawing Ire (Published 2016)

In an ABC interview, Mr. Trump implied that Ghazala Khan’s silence while her husband spoke about their soldier son’s death at the Democratic convention may have been because of her Muslim faith.

www.nytimes.com

Trump reportedly told the widow of a slain soldier, “He knew what he signed up for”

A Democratic member of Congress says she heard the call.

www.vox.com

Biden’s administration will be evaluated for its mistakes. I’m sure there are things they could’ve done better. But an Afghanistan exit was going to be bad no matter what.

Let’s not forget our recent past guy. mocking gold star families, calling killed soldiers “suckers and losers,” and skipping out on remembering American sacrifices over a little bit of rain that might’ve messed up his hair. Remember this while his side acts all tough; like they cared about Afghanistan and actually had any solutions. Puh-lease.

We all saw for 4 years the previous guy **** up everyday on the job because of his stupidity, lack of attention, corruption, and narcissism. The current batch of folks attacking Biden would be defending Trump even though we all know things would’ve been worse under trump. The situation would’ve been less organized, less competent, and more racist.

 

[Deleted member 365]

Remember this? Keep this in mind

 

[Al-O-Meter]

Why is Biden blamed for the actions of the Afghan military? Isn't that equipment what we gave to their military to defend their own country, which they didn't do? They are the ones who left their equipment to the Taliban, not the Americans.

Biden is blamed for the way he evacuated Bagram Air Base. The edge the Afghan military had over the Taliban was the ability to call for air support. That air support was all based out of Bagram Air Base. The Afghan Air Force did have pilots who could fly and were flying in support of the ground forces, but the maintenance on those aircraft was handled by contractors.

There was no orderly transfer of power from the American military to the Afghan military of Bagram Air Base. Without telling the Afghan military, our allies, or our citizens living in Afghanistan, we turned off the lights and left in the middle of the night. When the US Military left they took the aircraft maintenance contractors with them.

Biden has promised “over the horizon” air support, meaning from aircraft carriers and distant countries but he didn’t make good on that promise. The Afghans did what they could to keep the aircraft in the air including making zoom calls to mechanics in the US who would try to help them diagnose and instruct over the phone. One by one the aircraft broke. Within a matter of days there was no air support and the Taliban overran the Afghan military. It is the decisions, lack of communication, and actions associated with Bagram Air Base why so many are blaming Biden for the failure of the Afghan military.

Miscue After Miscue, U.S. Exit Plan Unravels

President Biden promised an orderly withdrawal. That pledge, compounded by missed signals and miscalculations, proved impossible.

www.nytimes.com

 

[LogGrad98]

Why is Biden blamed for the actions of the Afghan military? Isn't that equipment what we gave to their military to defend their own country, which they didn't do? They are the ones who left their equipment to the Taliban, not the Americans.

I am not saying that every decision Biden makes is perfect, but it is getting tiresome to lay all of this at his feet when he inherited a mess from past administrations and the Afghani government/military.




Sent from my moto z3 using JazzFanz mobile app

That is the nature of American politics. The new guy gets all the credit of what happened before them, for a decade of intelligence operations for example (Obama got bin laden) and the blame for crappy decisions of the past. Depending of course on your specific political bent.

 

[Deleted member 365]

That is the nature of American politics. The new guy gets all the credit of what happened before them, for a decade of intelligence operations for example (Obama got bin laden) and the blame for crappy decisions of the past. Depending of course on your specific political bent.

When does the new guy get credit? For the past 8 months we’ve been giving Trump the credit for the vaccine so his followers would get vaccinated. There is a double standard here where Republicans have an insanely low level of standards that is met if they just refrain from eating their own lego pieces for 5 seconds and an insanely high level of standards for Democrats where they’re blamed no matter what.

Afghanistan is a mess that began with Reagan and the USSR in the 1980s. It became our mess after Bush invaded. Obama maintained the deception. Trump deserves credit for shutting the endless occupation down. And Biden deserves credit for keeping Trump’s deal.

I guess Biden could’ve evacuated earlier? I guess he could’ve processed more visas. But I’ve read/heard from enough experts that believe that even these things aren’t as clear cut as media members/cynical republicans critics make it out to be. Bagram is a two hour drive from Kabul. Securing the route to the airport would’ve been a great task. More Americans probably would’ve died. Processing visas? With covid forcing staffs to be understaffed and with our current nativist politics? Good luck. And had we mass evacuated earlier, wouldn’t that have potentially caused a panic that might’ve sped up the former government’s downfall?

Like most things, this is complicated. Much more complicated than what our reactionary media makes it out to be.

The thing that bugs me are the double standards applied to Trump and Biden. The same people online and on the media currently criticizing Biden like none other are the same Trump Ball Washers who’s be blaming obama or Clinton for this and blowing Trump had hewon re-election.

 

[fishonjazz]

Biden is blamed for the way he evacuated Bagram Air Base. The edge the Afghan military had over the Taliban was the ability to call for air support. That air support was all based out of Bagram Air Base. The Afghan Air Force did have pilots who could fly and were flying in support of the ground forces, but the maintenance on those aircraft was handled by contractors.

There was no orderly transfer of power from the American military to the Afghan military of Bagram Air Base. Without telling the Afghan military, our allies, or our citizens living in Afghanistan, we turned off the lights and left in the middle of the night. When the US Military left they took the aircraft maintenance contractors with them.

Biden has promised “over the horizon” air support, meaning from aircraft carriers and distant countries but he didn’t make good on that promise. The Afghans did what they could to keep the aircraft in the air including making zoom calls to mechanics in the US who would try to help them diagnose and instruct over the phone. One by one the aircraft broke. Within a matter of days there was no air support and the Taliban overran the Afghan military. It is the decisions, lack of communication, and actions associated with Bagram Air Base why so many are blaming Biden for the failure of the Afghan military.

Miscue After Miscue, U.S. Exit Plan Unravels

President Biden promised an orderly withdrawal. That pledge, compounded by missed signals and miscalculations, proved impossible.

www.nytimes.com

I see you saying the Taliban over ran the afghan military. Now from what I understand trump made a deal with THE TALIBAN that we would withdraw from Afghanistan. He didn't include the afghan government in this deal. So it would seem to me that the intention was that the Taliban was supposed to take over the country. If that is the case then why would we provide air support to the afghan military? Seems like if we were going to support anyone it would be the Taliban since they are the ones that Trump made a deal with.

 

[Deleted member 365]

I see you saying the Taliban over ran the afghan military. Now from what I understand trump made a deal with THE TALIBAN that we would withdraw from Afghanistan. He didn't include the afghan government in this deal. So it would seem to me that the intention was that the Taliban was supposed to take over the country. If that is the case then why would we provide air support to the afghan military? Seems like if we were going to support anyone it would be the Taliban since they are the ones that Trump made a deal with.

This is a really good point.

 

[fishonjazz]

Like it would be weird if trump was on the phone with the Taliban leader making a deal to leave Afghanistan and the Taliban leader asked trump "what if the afghan military tries to resist us taking over?" And trump responded "well then we will support them and rain down hellfire on your asses." And the Taliban leader was like "cool cool, sounds good to us"

 

[Al-O-Meter]

I see you saying the Taliban over ran the afghan military. Now from what I understand trump made a deal with THE TALIBAN that we would withdraw from Afghanistan. He didn't include the afghan government in this deal. So it would seem to me that the intention was that the Taliban was supposed to take over the country. If that is the case then why would we provide air support to the afghan military? Seems like if we were going to support anyone it would be the Taliban since they are the ones that Trump made a deal with.

Trump did make a deal with the Taliban that included a withdrawal of US forces but its main purpose was to serve as a starting point for negotiations between the Afghan government and the Taliban. Everything was contingent on the so-called “intra-Afghan negotiations”.

The Afghan government wasn’t party to the agreement because at the time no one would agree on who the Afghan government was. Both Ashraf Ghani and Abdullah Abdullah claimed victory in the 2019 election. That wasn’t sorted out until after the agreement had been made.

On the first day of the intra-Afghan negotiations there was supposed to be a big prisoner swap which the Afghan government refused to honor. Without the prisoner swap there was no intra-Afghan negotiations, and without the intra-Afghan negotiations there was no deal. Everyone except the US had broken the terms. Biden was free and clear to justifiably do whatever he wanted including stopping the clock on withdrawl.

The situation was stable and the US had zero people lost in combat for over a year. We knew who the Afghan government was and we knew who the Taliban leadership was. We could have restarted negotiations for the prisoner swap, made that exchange happen, and started the intra-Afghan negotiations at which the clock could once again start ticking on American withdrawl with a smooth transition. Biden did what he did because he chose to do it, not because he was handcuffed by any broken deal from the previous administration.

Afghan conflict: What will Taliban do after signing US deal?

A sense of cautious optimism is rising, but Afghanistan's political future is yet to be decided.

www.bbc.com

 

[jazzVA]

Like it would be weird if trump was on the phone with the Taliban leader making a deal to leave Afghanistan and the Taliban leader asked trump "what if the afghan military tries to resist us taking over?" And trump responded "well then we will support them and rain down hellfire on your asses." And the Taliban leader was like "cool cool, sounds good to us"

Here is the “deal”—link. It basically says you stop shooting and fomenting terrorism (lol?) and we’ll leave. Oh and we’ll release 5,000 of your prisoners as a sweetener. Not so much a deal as a surrender agreement.

 

[JimLes]

Biden is blamed for the way he evacuated Bagram Air Base. The edge the Afghan military had over the Taliban was the ability to call for air support. That air support was all based out of Bagram Air Base. The Afghan Air Force did have pilots who could fly and were flying in support of the ground forces, but the maintenance on those aircraft was handled by contractors.

The Afghan military is a joke. You should not need planes or air support or contractors to defeat a ragtag army of 50 thousand(in a country of 40+ million) whose entire arsenal consists of Toyota trucks and rocket launchers.

At the end of the day, you have to want to fight. You don't need airplanes for that.

 

[FalseFlagg K]

Joe Biden. Captain empathy. Obv has somewhere to be while he watches your dead soldiers being brought onto US soil ??

 

[Deleted member 365]

The Afghan military is a joke. You should not need planes or air support or contractors to defeat a ragtag army of 50 thousand(in a country of 40+ million) whose entire arsenal consists of Toyota trucks and rocket launchers.

At the end of the day, you have to want to fight. You don't need airplanes for that.

I’ve read that one of the major issues with the Afghan army has been desertions. Many just don’t want to fight. They signed up for the paycheck but many are illiterate and don’t really identify with Afghanistan as a country. Most identify with their localities and tribes more than the country.

It doesn’t seem like there was any amount of training or money could force the army to fight.