Coach Ellis
Well-Known Member
The Clarkson/Klutch connection makes me lean towards trading him before the deadline if there’s not an extension worked out and signed. I love JC, but it’s super risky to sign him long therm to big money.
Trade Rumors Involving the Jazz
- Thread starter Ferguson_Mellochill
- Start date
All of the reading between the lines suggests that Collins is positive culture guy who is not meshing with the bad culture the Hawks have cultivated around Trae Young. I don’t think Collins is the ideal 4 of the future, but I’m confident we will receive a better player than the value it takes to get him.
I think the Jazz should be weary about taking on long term money because of the golden window they have with Lauri+Kessler on low numbers, but the cap is clean enough that I would still take a shot at Collins.
I think the Jazz continue to flip assets, gain picks/increase player values than make a splash in either the summer of 25 or 26.
Kessler
Lauri
Siakam/OG (FA)
Star player (trade the farm)
Quickley/Tyus (FA)
That’s a really good team if they can pull it off. Just gotta keep making positive move and keeping 5 in the chamber (first round picks) for when the next disgruntled star wants out.
I think the Jazz should be weary about taking on long term money because of the golden window they have with Lauri+Kessler on low numbers, but the cap is clean enough that I would still take a shot at Collins.
I think the Jazz continue to flip assets, gain picks/increase player values than make a splash in either the summer of 25 or 26.
Kessler
Lauri
Siakam/OG (FA)
Star player (trade the farm)
Quickley/Tyus (FA)
That’s a really good team if they can pull it off. Just gotta keep making positive move and keeping 5 in the chamber (first round picks) for when the next disgruntled star wants out.
I really doubt it, but if any it would've been Herb Jones. He's just got one year left on his rookie deal, so that's another player they'll need to pay shortly. They'll probably sign EJ Liddell on a cheap next season (2-way now, out with ACL), and they might waive Garret Temple, but they look at luxury tax going forward.
Tremendous Upside
Well-Known Member
IMO there's one really big bullet left to be dodged this season, and that's trading for John Collins.
If we bring him in, he's obviously a big minute starter. And he will immediately end the All Star Lauri Era. Hear me out.
Collins would likely take over the high pick setter / roll man role from Kessler and push Walker back to the bench. The only way these two can co-exist in the same starting lineup is if Collins stands in the corner in a spacing-heavy, small-usage modern PF role, as he's certainly no SF. And I see him throwing a tantrum if it comes to that, as it's precisely the role he's trying to get away from in Atlanta. He wants touches, he wants to be a lob finisher. That's what brought him success early in his career.
Also, that three big lineup would feature Lauri in a straight up SF role, and that's a bad idea - a big part of his success this season has been punishing smaller defenders near the basket. We're already seeing less of that now that Kessler is clogging the paint to an extent, and it would only get more pronounced with Collins (and his defender) hanging near the dunker's spot too. You can talk about Markkanen as a "perimeter big" as much as you want, but the fact is that the only real advantage he has there is shooting over smaller guys. In other words, the same limiting role both Chicago (and to a lesser extent Cleveland) used him in. We don't want that now that we've seen what he can do when he roams around. As a pure SF, playing with two other bigs, he wouldn't be able to drive past many of his defenders and there wouldn't be space for that either as long as Kessler remains a non-shooter who can't draw his defender away from the hoop.
By necessity, Lauri would become even more of an opportunistic scorer than he is now, surviving on other peoples' scraps.
I'm not saying no to a three big lineup as a basic idea (the current iteration is not the real thing, as Olynyk plays much smaller than he is), but the guy we need to complement Lauri and Kessler in that scenario needs to be a better outside shooter than Collins and someone who doesn't need the ball but is comfortable spacing the floor in the corner. Collins is a square peg in a round hole. Lauri has a natural tendency to start floating on the weak side and disappearing if he senses the court is badly spaced, and at this point, we want to avoid a situation like that at all costs because it would be a gigantic waste. He should never again be used in such a narrow way.
So, to sum up... would we be comfortable benching Kessler in favor of Collins? Will Kessler develop a jump shot? Is it even essential for this team that Lauri remains a 20+ point scorer? These are some of the questions that need to be answered. Just trading for Collins (and his stupid contract) and hoping for the best doesn't make sense.
If we bring him in, he's obviously a big minute starter. And he will immediately end the All Star Lauri Era. Hear me out.
Collins would likely take over the high pick setter / roll man role from Kessler and push Walker back to the bench. The only way these two can co-exist in the same starting lineup is if Collins stands in the corner in a spacing-heavy, small-usage modern PF role, as he's certainly no SF. And I see him throwing a tantrum if it comes to that, as it's precisely the role he's trying to get away from in Atlanta. He wants touches, he wants to be a lob finisher. That's what brought him success early in his career.
Also, that three big lineup would feature Lauri in a straight up SF role, and that's a bad idea - a big part of his success this season has been punishing smaller defenders near the basket. We're already seeing less of that now that Kessler is clogging the paint to an extent, and it would only get more pronounced with Collins (and his defender) hanging near the dunker's spot too. You can talk about Markkanen as a "perimeter big" as much as you want, but the fact is that the only real advantage he has there is shooting over smaller guys. In other words, the same limiting role both Chicago (and to a lesser extent Cleveland) used him in. We don't want that now that we've seen what he can do when he roams around. As a pure SF, playing with two other bigs, he wouldn't be able to drive past many of his defenders and there wouldn't be space for that either as long as Kessler remains a non-shooter who can't draw his defender away from the hoop.
By necessity, Lauri would become even more of an opportunistic scorer than he is now, surviving on other peoples' scraps.
I'm not saying no to a three big lineup as a basic idea (the current iteration is not the real thing, as Olynyk plays much smaller than he is), but the guy we need to complement Lauri and Kessler in that scenario needs to be a better outside shooter than Collins and someone who doesn't need the ball but is comfortable spacing the floor in the corner. Collins is a square peg in a round hole. Lauri has a natural tendency to start floating on the weak side and disappearing if he senses the court is badly spaced, and at this point, we want to avoid a situation like that at all costs because it would be a gigantic waste. He should never again be used in such a narrow way.
So, to sum up... would we be comfortable benching Kessler in favor of Collins? Will Kessler develop a jump shot? Is it even essential for this team that Lauri remains a 20+ point scorer? These are some of the questions that need to be answered. Just trading for Collins (and his stupid contract) and hoping for the best doesn't make sense.
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I'm not gonna go too deep into dissecting this... but your view of "Collins throwing a tantrum" is far off the Hawks fan and public media perspective of the guy. If John Collins is the diva who wants to have a huge role... why isnt he forcing his way out or even giving quotes about wanting out?
The storyline of him criticizing the team offense was bloated because it was essentially directed towards Trae Young, their emerging superstar. I dont have access to the Atheltics original article, but BR summarized it like this:
So they blow 2 leads of 15+ with Trae chucking and missing 3s early clock.. and have a film session... Please tell me:
1) How is that toxic? (giving your opion on a video session in a constructive manner)
2) Was he wrong?
Also need I remind you, that they reached ECF in the same year that incident took place and went on a huge run in the spring starting very shortly after that meeting.
416Klawzz
Well-Known Member
Buyout Rose again
416Klawzz
Well-Known Member
Very wishful thinking... I would love it tho
fishonjazz
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What is the point for the jazz? We get rid of two young guys with potential and pick up 2 young guys with potential.
Do we think the two we pick up have more upside or something?
Jazz seem to have good chemistry right now and are playing well. If we arent getting any picks then we better belive we are getting decent sized upgrades.
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Klutch is famously the only agency who tries to get their clients paid the highest amount of money.
/Sarcasm
I'm sorry, but the anti-Klutch **** is so stupid and is very questionable. Clarkson signed an amazing deal to stay with Utah while being with Klutch. Sexton signed a deal with Utah while being with Klutch. An agency's job is to do what their client wants and get them the most money possible. Can we stop demonizing the only black owned sports agency?
Also, if JC wants to stay and tells that to Klutch, they sign him to the best deal Jazz will offer just like any other agency. Its not like they walk over their clients wishes.