What Did Corbin Do Wrong Last Night?
- Thread starter franklin
- Start date
D
Deleted member 848
Guest
DIDN RaN MOAR PLAYZ FO KNATER TRADE AL FIRE CIRBIN BURKS MVP
Lol, you make me smile.
D
Deleted member 848
Guest
My only beef is crunch time minutes for Randy defensive sieve Foye. But hey, we will keep seeing him unless Burks and Marvin assert themselves.
Like a doughnut!
Hartsock
Banned
My main complaint is that the Jazz are now an outside in team, Mo and Foye are leading the team in shots. The whole point of bringing in good shooters was to make out inside out game that much more effective. Also we have 3 new key players, give them some time to get stuff figured out, it takes awhile, ask the Lakers.
sojodave
Well-Known Member
Ty had some bizarre lineups tonight, and even though it didn't work, I kinda like him actually experimenting. One of the things he did right, was put in Mo & Gordon in the back court, Millsap at 3, Favors at 4 and Jefferson at 5. It was too late for a come-back, but that line-up is really long and can board. We came out more aggressive in the first quarter and actually played some good defense, but it was short lived and they came back. I agree that the team is shooting too many outside jumpers. We don't look patient enough to get the ball inside.
Is that really a good lineup? Maybe, but I have my doubts. Sap is not really a SF. The other thing about it is that Favors is in for his D, meaning that Sap and/or Al defense sucks, yet with this lineup Corbin keeps them both in. So you can play crappy D and get one of your teammates benched instead of you.
The obvious screwup last night was the second unit he put in. I believe it (was watching a crappy blurry TV) was Burks-Foye-Evans-Kanter_Favors. They did not have a clue of how to run the offense. Embarrassing.
Last edited:
Franklin, I understand what you're saying. Anti-Corbin sentiment here on Jazzfanz can be ridiculous. It's not like Corbin is telling them to chuck a clown shot in the first 4 seconds of the shot clock a third of the time. It's not like he's teaching AJ to stand there while guards score one uncontested layup after another. I'm sure he's trying his best with Burks, who despite being talented, seems to think he's all alone on the court. Not everything is Corbin's fault. But your casual dismissal of even the possibility that he's making mistakes can only mean that either coaches don't matter at all, and they're paying a guy a couple of millions a year out of charitable generosity, or you're as guilty of blind generalizations as the rest of us.
Let's look at some things that Corbin does wrong.
- His utilization of Favors. Throughout the past season, and the first 3 games of this season, Favors is forced to post up if he wants to receive the ball. The guy gets the ball, does some hilarious rigid half twists, and jumps toward the hoop trying to dunk it. He has no post game. That is not how he plays. Sure he can develop it with time, but he doesn't have it right now. So Corbin's mentality is "you do this exact same thing Jefferson does well, or you get no play time. I don't care how well you do anything else". Last night, Favors played really well, because HE DID NOT POST. Not even once. He played his natural pick and roll slashing game, and he did it well. Sure nobody passed him the ball (he wasn't posting!), but the couple of times they did, he executed. And even when he's not passed the ball, I'd rather him establish a good rebounding position than being forced to watch his awkwardness in the post. So what happened last night? Either Favors rightly ignored Corbin's instructions, or Corbin realized he's not using Favors correctly. A year and a half into his tenure. Bravo.
- Corbin is very slow to adapt to game situations. He has his plan, and he'll stick to it for too long. Last night (it was a generally good game), Corbin correctly switched to 2-3 zone after the Jazz struggled to deal with Memphis inside game using man-to-man. The adjustment worked well, and they forced Memphis to take outside shots. It wasn't his fault the players were slow to actually defend those outside shots they intended to create. But in numerous occasions, Corbin failed to react tactically to game situations. How many times have we had a quick guard burn us over and over, while Corbin stood there doing nothing? How many times did our inside-out game fizzle with Jefferson holding the ball for 15 seconds?
- Related to tactical competence, we have suffered enough with Corbin's substitution patterns. He favors the vets unjustifiably. He admits that Favors defense was needed in the past 2 games, but he gives him playtime by moving Millsap to the 3. Why? Is it really that important to have AJ and Sap for 30+ minutes every night? They're not exactly Lebron James, and we can live with them getting 12 ppg instead of the current 14. Similarly, he will tend to go with whoever is oldest to close out games. Why is Foye playing late in the 4th? He's just about the LAST player you want out there. He will try to have every shot, regardless of the situation. Yes he's older, but so ****ing what? Additionally, Corbin neither takes advantage of the hot hand or favorable match ups. He will draw the same plays whether the paint is being defended by D. Howard or Boozer. He will take out players on schedule regardless of what's happening on the floor. This has improved a lot in the second half of last season, but why should such obvious improvements take so long to achieve?
Long story short, we have a coach who doesn't know how to best utilize his own players' strengths or the opposing team's weaknesses. Corbin understands the system very well, and he has a disciplined vision of players' roles and positions on the floor. Those are perfect characteristics, for an assistant coach. But for a head coach, you need someone with guts, creativity, intelligence, and flexibility. Not just knowledge and discipline.
Let's look at some things that Corbin does wrong.
- His utilization of Favors. Throughout the past season, and the first 3 games of this season, Favors is forced to post up if he wants to receive the ball. The guy gets the ball, does some hilarious rigid half twists, and jumps toward the hoop trying to dunk it. He has no post game. That is not how he plays. Sure he can develop it with time, but he doesn't have it right now. So Corbin's mentality is "you do this exact same thing Jefferson does well, or you get no play time. I don't care how well you do anything else". Last night, Favors played really well, because HE DID NOT POST. Not even once. He played his natural pick and roll slashing game, and he did it well. Sure nobody passed him the ball (he wasn't posting!), but the couple of times they did, he executed. And even when he's not passed the ball, I'd rather him establish a good rebounding position than being forced to watch his awkwardness in the post. So what happened last night? Either Favors rightly ignored Corbin's instructions, or Corbin realized he's not using Favors correctly. A year and a half into his tenure. Bravo.
- Corbin is very slow to adapt to game situations. He has his plan, and he'll stick to it for too long. Last night (it was a generally good game), Corbin correctly switched to 2-3 zone after the Jazz struggled to deal with Memphis inside game using man-to-man. The adjustment worked well, and they forced Memphis to take outside shots. It wasn't his fault the players were slow to actually defend those outside shots they intended to create. But in numerous occasions, Corbin failed to react tactically to game situations. How many times have we had a quick guard burn us over and over, while Corbin stood there doing nothing? How many times did our inside-out game fizzle with Jefferson holding the ball for 15 seconds?
- Related to tactical competence, we have suffered enough with Corbin's substitution patterns. He favors the vets unjustifiably. He admits that Favors defense was needed in the past 2 games, but he gives him playtime by moving Millsap to the 3. Why? Is it really that important to have AJ and Sap for 30+ minutes every night? They're not exactly Lebron James, and we can live with them getting 12 ppg instead of the current 14. Similarly, he will tend to go with whoever is oldest to close out games. Why is Foye playing late in the 4th? He's just about the LAST player you want out there. He will try to have every shot, regardless of the situation. Yes he's older, but so ****ing what? Additionally, Corbin neither takes advantage of the hot hand or favorable match ups. He will draw the same plays whether the paint is being defended by D. Howard or Boozer. He will take out players on schedule regardless of what's happening on the floor. This has improved a lot in the second half of last season, but why should such obvious improvements take so long to achieve?
Long story short, we have a coach who doesn't know how to best utilize his own players' strengths or the opposing team's weaknesses. Corbin understands the system very well, and he has a disciplined vision of players' roles and positions on the floor. Those are perfect characteristics, for an assistant coach. But for a head coach, you need someone with guts, creativity, intelligence, and flexibility. Not just knowledge and discipline.
The inclusion of Evans was/is strange with that group.
I am starting to think that Foye is only good for open 3's. He is proving to be terrible at everything else.
Hartsock
Banned
I agree he should focus a bit more on spotting up
Gyp Rosetti
Banned
You're right, he's not telling our players to do those things. In fact, he or Horny or someone else on the coaching staff is likely telling them the exact opposite. Yet, our players still do the same stupid **** time and time again. If the players are informed, yet do this **** anyway, Ty's not doing his job. If he's not informing the players, he's not doing his job. Either way, he's just not doing his job...not well anyway. In brief, I just don't see Ty as very effective and for that he needs to be fired.
fishonjazz
Well-Known Member
Contributor
2018 Award Winner
2019 Award Winner
2020-21 Award Winner
2022 Award Winner
2023 Award Winner
The lineup was mo, foye, burks, evans, kanter.
fishonjazz
Well-Known Member
Contributor
2018 Award Winner
2019 Award Winner
2020-21 Award Winner
2022 Award Winner
2023 Award Winner
Harpring was even questioning the decision of playing burks at the 3
Using a lineup of mo, foye, burks, evans, and kanter... its almost as if corbin was trying to put together a lineup that would fail..... I mean im happy that burks got to play, but give the guy a chance with a lineup that has the ability to succeed.
Using a lineup of mo, foye, burks, evans, and kanter... its almost as if corbin was trying to put together a lineup that would fail..... I mean im happy that burks got to play, but give the guy a chance with a lineup that has the ability to succeed.
TheSilencer1313
Well-Known Member
I would definitely say that might be the case. In no way did he treat Raja with the kind of veteran respect that he's earned over the years.
If/when it comes time for Mo Williams to come off the bench, do you think Corbin will handle the situation the same way?
billyshelby
Well-Known Member
The offense is a total disaster. That's all on Ty. We'll see if he can fix it.
You're taking a lot out of 4 short games.
I judge Corbin by his coaching last season, which was pretty damn good. He played players who deserved minutes, sat those who didn't, and forced the incompetent whiners to rot on the bench during the playoffs.