What's new
By:

kurt kragthorpe hits the nail on the head

Basically I think between the things I mentioned, numberica said, jope said, stoked said and hartsock agreed with....... I would say the jazz would have at least 3 more wins and possibly twice that many more (6) wins.

Sad thing is that most of the things he did wrong are very very simple things that are mostly inexcusable (not subbing defense for offense, not knowing the score at the very end of a game, playing a young talented player like burks more than some crappy old vets like Watson and tinsley, leaving a player in a game when he is playing THE BEST game of his life)
 
I don't know about 50 wins (bear in mind that the WCF Deron team won 51 and won 54 at its best), but even I thought this team would be significantly better than what we've seen.
 
Hartsock said:
Foye on Kobe - The game where the Lakers beat us by 18 and Kobe only had 14? Probably didn't matter either way.

Big Al instead of Favors when we needed defensive stops late in game - Agreed, but how many games did an Al defensive possession cost the Jazz a game? Maybe the Hornets loss with the Vazquez layup?

Playing Hayward 17ish straight minutes and getting him burnt out to finish the game - agreed should have broken that up a bit

Rewarding Kanters brilliance while Big Al and Sap were gone with 5 minute games - Yeah, that was odd for sure

The 20ish DNPs-Coaches decisions Burks got at the start of the year - eh, not convinced Burks was/is a huge difference maker yet. But I would like to have seen him play because he's entertaining.

Playing Watson over Tinsley - blah both have been really bad and occasionally ok. Tinsley a little less bad but not by a whole lot.
Click to expand...

So bad coaching decisions should only count when it is a close game? hayward is a much better defender and has shown to be capable of defending Kobe.

As for the Big Al it was also the Clips game so at least 2.

Burk was sat in favor of what? 30 minutes of Foye? Tinsley and Watson? Terrible. As for not knowing if Burks is a difference maker. Well that is because he never gets to play and when he does he scores, drives, hustles and brings energy.

How about riding all the same people anytime the Jazz go into OT. Ty hardly ever makes subs in OT.

Ty sticking to his sub patterns no matter what, unless it is the vet that is going off that is.

His horribly inconsistent use of player such as Favors, Burks and Carroll.

The list goes on and on.
 
NUMBERICA said:
I don't know about 50 wins (bear in mind that the WCF Deron team won 51 and won 54 at its best), but even I thought this team would be significantly better than what we've seen.
Click to expand...

I went thru and looked at the close games we lost and there are 12. Even if we had won 1/2 of them that places Utah at 49 wins and fighting for #50 tonight.
 
bordelais7 said:
How many close games did the Jazz win this season?
Click to expand...

I'll have to look...brb...

Edit: I see 20. I counted all games decided within 9 points. Keep in mind I am going by final score.

Still not change the fact that Corbin has a history of making bad choices and that it costs the Jazz games. Also he does not have the history to back up a bad season like Pop does.
 
Stoked said:
I went thru and looked at the close games we lost and there are 12. Even if we had won 1/2 of them that places Utah at 49 wins and fighting for #50 tonight.
Click to expand...

You would have to cancel out some of the games we won and shouldn't have, like OKC.
 
Hartsock said:
What are some specific examples of Ty losing games for the Jazz. Obviously he has been far less than perfect, but what are some blatant examples of him costing the Jazz an easy win? I remember them being brought up but cannot remember what they were.
Click to expand...

The Bulls game I saw, after an excellent third quarter by Jefferson, Corbin kept Jefferson in for the entire fourth quarter instead of resting him. Jefferson was clearly fatigued by the end of the game, and it was quite predictable.
 
So how many examples do you want Hartsock? I have seen about 10 so far, ranging from specific games to general trends.
 
Stoked said:
Why? Am I not saying that the coach we have has the Jazz under performing?
Click to expand...

If you are trying to gauge a possible record, you can't say well we should have won all these 1 point games and still say you should have won all the games you shouldn't have won. No team does that.
 
Stoked said:
So how many examples do you want Hartsock? I have seen about 10 so far, ranging from specific games to general trends.
Click to expand...

Some I'm buying, some I'm not. I think Corbin has struggled but I also believe that Jazz are a fighting for the 8th seed talent level team.
 
Hartsock said:
Some I'm buying, some I'm not. I think Corbin has struggled but I also believe that Jazz are a fighting for the 8th seed talent level team.
Click to expand...

That right there is a major difference. I think the Jazz have the talent to be a 50 win team. That would make them the 6th seed right now.

You are right no team wins every close game. But teams with coaches sure do seem to win a better % of them than the Jazz are.
 
Hartsock said:
Some I'm buying, some I'm not. I think Corbin has struggled but I also believe that Jazz are a fighting for the 8th seed talent level team.
Click to expand...

The Jazz level of talent has nothing to do with the examples of bad coaching that have been shown. They are poor rotations, playing the wrong player for the situation, playing poorer players over better players...that is coaching not talent.
 
Hartsock said:
Some I'm buying, some I'm not. I think Corbin has struggled but I also believe that Jazz are a fighting for the 8th seed talent level team.
Click to expand...

Agreed. Some of the examples given are legit, some are just subjective speculation, and some are kind of ridiculous. Foye on Kobe in a game where Kobe scored 14 points and the Jazz lost by 18, or suggesting Corbin actually draws "plays that have foye taking guys off the dribble, or mo Williams playing hero ball, or foye jacking up contested 3's from 5 feet beyond the line", or that Hayward can't play for 17 minutes straight (Kobe would laugh in your face).

The jazz have a chance to win 44 games in a tough Western Conference where 5 teams have won 55 or more games. And they had to play 32 games without Mo Williams. Maybe they could have won 3 or 4 more but I don't think they were a 50 win team.
 
Hartsock said:
Some I'm buying, some I'm not. I think Corbin has struggled but I also believe that Jazz are a fighting for the 8th seed talent level team.
Click to expand...

Utah is less talented than Houston? Wtf? Denver? Memphis?

I really think some of you (well mostly just hartsock) need to step away from the jazz Kool-aid and really look at things. Either the jazz are really just an 8th seed talent, which means that koc has completely sucked. Or, the jazz are a 3-6 seed talent level but underachieving because of their coach.

It's one or the other.
 
My2Cents said:
Agreed. Some of the examples given are legit, some are just subjective speculation, and some are kind of ridiculous. Foye on Kobe in a game where Kobe scored 14 points and the Jazz lost by 18, or suggesting Corbin actually draws "plays that have foye taking guys off the dribble, or mo Williams playing hero ball, or foye jacking up contested 3's from 5 feet beyond the line", or that Hayward can't play for 17 minutes straight (Kobe would laugh in your face).

The jazz have a chance to win 44 games in a tough Western Conference where 5 teams have won 55 or more games. And they had to play 32 games without Mo Williams. Maybe they could have won 3 or 4 more but I don't think they were a 50 win team.
Click to expand...

I never said that Kobe won that game. I was giving examples of poor coaching decisions by Corbin. Foye guarding Kobe Bryant is a poor decision.
 
Hartsock said:
What are some specific examples of Ty losing games for the Jazz. Obviously he has been far less than perfect, but what are some blatant examples of him costing the Jazz an easy win? I remember them being brought up but cannot remember what they were.
Click to expand...

early in the season at hornets for example
 
The Thriller said:
Utah is less talented than Houston? Wtf? Denver? Memphis?

I really think some of you (well mostly just hartsock) need to step away from the jazz Kool-aid and really look at things. Either the jazz are really just an 8th seed talent, which means that koc has completely sucked. Or, the jazz are a 3-6 seed talent level but underachieving because of their coach.

It's one or the other.
Click to expand...

Lol. No. The Jazz are an 8th seed level team after trading away their superstar for rookie and young, developing big men. If you think that's a bad move then okomgrofl.

Those who thought this team would magically better by adding an under achieving SF and two bench guards are kidding themselves. Some of us got over excited, that's all. We're fans, go figure.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page
Back
Top