I assume you've read the bible?
It is good to be back!!!
- Thread starter Former Member
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I assume you've read the bible?
I'm serious. This isn't intended as an insult to anyone. But I'm really glad not to have to worry about whether something fits with my view of my religion, nationality, ethnicity, or even general ideologies like liberalism, conservatism, capitalism, socialism, whatever.
If there was a conscious god, this would be the very first thing I'd thank it for.
... our yearning to know our creator is within all of us (if we're truly honest with ourselves).
Also the universal realization that a material being cannot "create" anything material is a pretty good clue. (i.e., we can merely move/change material things, but not "create" something out of thin air)
Oh, is that what it is? I thought I was just constipated.
Funny.. but not at all satisfactory.
This is going to end badly for you.. I'd graciously back away while you still can.
When discussing a topic that is faith-based rather than easily proven, it is up to the intellect of those debating....
no offense.
The Fresh Prince
Well-Known Member
Been gone so long, and you still have more posts than me...
Need to get my weight up, welcome back!
Need to get my weight up, welcome back!
Former Member
Banned
Yes. However, I will not make an official vow of celibacy until my ordination (at least another three years).
You require a more satisfactory answer? Fine.
How do you know what's "within" every honest man? Your world-class neuroscience research? Your deep and extensive philosophical knowledge? I'm betting they're a bunch of empty words designed to delude you into thinking that everyone would feel the same way you do if they'd just be honest with themselves!
As for the prime mover argument, you're saying that the universe could not have come from nothing. Unless your god was involved. Also, your god came from nothing. But that's it. Everything else comes from something, or is created from nothing by something that came from nothing. P.S. Everyone knows that deep inside. But only if they're honest.
Impressive.
LOL.. so what is your opinion on what caused the big bang then, Mr. Caus & Effect? See the difference between you and me is I'm open to the possibility that something/someone made that happened, while you're not.
I'm not going to ruin this welcoming party for WhiskyPriest, so on that basis I'll stop.
This is about the most basic logical fallacy. "You either give me an explanation, or you accept mine regardless of its merits".
You twist the meaning of open-mindedness to serve your belief. I am very open minded. I don't think I hold the same opinion I held 5 years ago on the majority of subjects. Does that mean every sentence uttered as divine truth is worth considering? No.
There are many MANY possible explanation of how the universe came to be. Most of them are far superior to "it was created by a supernatural being". Hell, if that is a reasonable hypothesis, then I can make them up on the fly. The Blackswordsman created the universe. His denial only confirms it, for Lord TBS is most humble. Please keep an open mind about my "theory".
If we're going to discuss your god, you must define him. You must do it in real terms, with real meaning, because that shows you know what you believe, and not just parroting empty statements like "god is forever". Then we can discuss whether that construct can possibly come from nothing, and whether it can create universes.
Until then, we can contemplate other ,better, theories:
Quantum fluctuation:
https://abyss.uoregon.edu/~js/ast123/lectures/lec17.html
This one denies the universe is something at all. The number zero can be thought of as a representation of nothing. But it can also be made up by somethings. -1+1=0. Similarly, the universe can just be a temporary blip of somethingness over its natural state of nothingness.
Simulation:
https://inspirehep.net/record/1189720
If humanity survive long enough, it is reasonable to assume that computer simulations will become sophisticated enough, that universes with different parameters can be produced. Some of those will in turn produce conscious beings, who will wonder about the nature of their universe.
Multiverse:
https://www.scientificamerican.com/...cations-lend-support-to-multiverse-hypothesis
This is by far the most scientifically supported possibility. The universe is part of an infinite number of universes that flux in and out of existence. They have no beginning and no end, collectively.
And there are many others. SO MANY. But until we have the ability to test such hypotheses, they remain in the realm of amusing speculation.
Edit: If this is hijacking Whisky's thread, I'm willing to take it elsewhere.
LOL..
I knew the good old "multiverse" argument would make its appearance. I guess it's easier to accept that there "INFINITE NUMBER OF UNIVERSES EXISTING" than it is to believe in 1 creator.
As I said, I'm not going to ruin this welcoming party for WhiskyPriest.
You can carry on, but I'm stopping here.
I knew the good old "multiverse" argument would make its appearance. I guess it's easier to accept that there "INFINITE NUMBER OF UNIVERSES EXISTING" than it is to believe in 1 creator.
As I said, I'm not going to ruin this welcoming party for WhiskyPriest.
You can carry on, but I'm stopping here.
Again, you speak of things you know nothing of. And yet, you speak of them with such conviction! I was simply laying down the possibilities. And I would think that an extensive theory based on well established mathematical and physical facts warrants more attention than some childish emotion-based impulse that hasn't been examined by the very person who holds it.
Keep in mind that I only responded because you demanded a serious response. Otherwise I wouldn't have. I knew it was a waste of my time, and that you will not put any effort in your retort, but I naively thought you may have legitimate interest in gaining knowledge.
But knowledge is the nemesis of blind faith, and I should not have expected any serious reflection on your part.