https://crommunist.com/2014/04/08/white-people-on-offence/#more-8624
The Crommunist looks at a phrase he sees too often.
The Crommunist looks at a phrase he sees too often.
On telling someone who the "real racist" is
- Thread starter One Brow
- Start date
tl;dr
The notion that experience with racism gives you a better perspective on what is or is not racist, and people of color have more experience with racism than white people, so when white people say that the person of color is being the "real racist", you need to account for that difference.
The notion that experience with racism gives you a better perspective on what is or is not racist, and people of color have more experience with racism than white people, so when white people say that the person of color is being the "real racist", you need to account for that difference.
Hmmm...interesting. I will have to think on that.
I will admit that experinces affect our view on ideas. So naturally there would be differences. But just because someone is more experienced or less experienced with racism does not make their claims of racism and more, or less, true.
Racism, in my view, is being used as a charge against someone simply because they did not give you what you want or do things your way. Doing so only lessens the severity of the charge over all and makes people tone deaf to it. A crying wolf scenario if you will.
If you are going to take the time to think about it, why not also take the time to read the link?
green
Well-Known Member
I think the real problem is, we use that word too often.
There is a difference between racism, not agreeing with a thought or idea, and/or just not liking an individual. The problem with the word "racism" or "racist" is that it is evolving into the "god" realm. Such as, when you are in a debate with someone and they say, "well, God told me." The debate ends. You can't discuss topics with that person, because if they believe God told them, then they won't be swayed.
So, in the same vein, if someone doesn't agree with you, the easiest way to win the debate, is toss out the "racism/racist" word, and you're done. Argument over, they won (troutbum/Wells is the best at this). It doesn't matter how right you may be or how wrong they are, they win. You are now the racist.
I think the "real racist" comment extends from that. It is the way to "fight back".
Anyways, just my two cents.
There is a difference between racism, not agreeing with a thought or idea, and/or just not liking an individual. The problem with the word "racism" or "racist" is that it is evolving into the "god" realm. Such as, when you are in a debate with someone and they say, "well, God told me." The debate ends. You can't discuss topics with that person, because if they believe God told them, then they won't be swayed.
So, in the same vein, if someone doesn't agree with you, the easiest way to win the debate, is toss out the "racism/racist" word, and you're done. Argument over, they won (troutbum/Wells is the best at this). It doesn't matter how right you may be or how wrong they are, they win. You are now the racist.
I think the "real racist" comment extends from that. It is the way to "fight back".
Anyways, just my two cents.
There is a reason I won't click the link. It is not a simple TLDR scenario.
Does the reason apply at home as well?
Instead of thinking of this in terms of a fight, why not try a cooperative approach? Ask them why they see the position as racist; what the message is that they see and you do not. If you get a response, don't come back with a counter until you think it over for a day or so. It's so easy to get caught up in a back-and-forth; it's so hard to just listen (yes, this applies to me at times as well).
green
Well-Known Member
This is great advice.
There is always middle ground. I think societies biggest issue is that we no longer want middle ground. We all want our way or we want to take our ball and go home.
Let's get back to the middle ground.
green
Well-Known Member
Here is my take on the article. Until Fox News, and MSNBC, and our policiticians and writers, like the writer you linked to, stop saying things like:
"white people are far less likely (some would say it is definitionally impossible) to experience racism than are PoC. It seems preposterous to assume that you, a person with no experience in the topic under discussion, would be in a position to lecture someone about that topic"
Then we know that they aren't in it to find a solution, but to make a buck.
Game over for me at that point. I'm not interested in hearing what you have to say anymore. Like I mentioned above, you just told me that "god" is directing you (or in this case, you believe that it is impossible for a white person to be discriminated against), and you don't want to hear anything I have to say. You just want to push your agenda, charge me for it, and move on.
So, I guess he won. I clicked his link, and he made his money. Goal accomplished, and now the world is a little worse off because of it.
Another comical quote:
"Regardless, the point remains that it is deeply bizarre that a white person would appoint hirself the objective arbiter of what is and is not racism, over a PoC. It is a preposterous arrogance in any other circumstance, treated with loathing akin to what we assign backseat drivers and Monday morning quarterbacks. And yet we see this ridiculous pattern pop up again and again."
The most comical quote of the day, after he gives the quotes above, is this:
"Hypocrisy, properly done, requires selective omission of the obvious...But the rest of us, those not so dazzled by their self-regard that they able to see through the banal falsity of such posturing, we recognize that racism is real and has real effects and is not some convenient flail with which to thrash our opponents."
Kettle, let me introduce to Mr. Pot over here.
Again, as long as we take articles like this seriously, nothing will change, and the world will continue to decline.
Why is is always, I'm right, and you are dumb for not agreeing with me?
Why can't he come and say, "look, I don't agree with this "real racist" term because of 1, 2, and 3. Then listen to the other side?
Why does he have to come and say, this isn't true because of 1, 2, and 3, and if you don't believe me, your dumb, because it is impossible to know how I feel, and you are white and white people are just racist anyways and the redskins and indians mascots prove this?
"white people are far less likely (some would say it is definitionally impossible) to experience racism than are PoC. It seems preposterous to assume that you, a person with no experience in the topic under discussion, would be in a position to lecture someone about that topic"
Then we know that they aren't in it to find a solution, but to make a buck.
Game over for me at that point. I'm not interested in hearing what you have to say anymore. Like I mentioned above, you just told me that "god" is directing you (or in this case, you believe that it is impossible for a white person to be discriminated against), and you don't want to hear anything I have to say. You just want to push your agenda, charge me for it, and move on.
So, I guess he won. I clicked his link, and he made his money. Goal accomplished, and now the world is a little worse off because of it.
Another comical quote:
"Regardless, the point remains that it is deeply bizarre that a white person would appoint hirself the objective arbiter of what is and is not racism, over a PoC. It is a preposterous arrogance in any other circumstance, treated with loathing akin to what we assign backseat drivers and Monday morning quarterbacks. And yet we see this ridiculous pattern pop up again and again."
The most comical quote of the day, after he gives the quotes above, is this:
"Hypocrisy, properly done, requires selective omission of the obvious...But the rest of us, those not so dazzled by their self-regard that they able to see through the banal falsity of such posturing, we recognize that racism is real and has real effects and is not some convenient flail with which to thrash our opponents."
Kettle, let me introduce to Mr. Pot over here.
Again, as long as we take articles like this seriously, nothing will change, and the world will continue to decline.
Why is is always, I'm right, and you are dumb for not agreeing with me?
Why can't he come and say, "look, I don't agree with this "real racist" term because of 1, 2, and 3. Then listen to the other side?
Why does he have to come and say, this isn't true because of 1, 2, and 3, and if you don't believe me, your dumb, because it is impossible to know how I feel, and you are white and white people are just racist anyways and the redskins and indians mascots prove this?
green
Well-Known Member
Here is what should happen:
First, we need to decide if a white person can feel the feelings of racism, or can they emphasize with someone who has gone through racism.
That's the first step.
So, can a white person know what it is like to be discriminated against because of their skin color?
First, we need to decide if a white person can feel the feelings of racism, or can they emphasize with someone who has gone through racism.
That's the first step.
So, can a white person know what it is like to be discriminated against because of their skin color?