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Would you be happy with this for the 5th pick?

Core4 said:
My goodness, are you really worried about Jeremy Evans and Erick Murphy? Those guys are scrubs. I love Jeremy as a person. I like his jams. But he's an 11th-man on a roster. As for Murphy, he was RELEASED by another team. Do you think he is a rotation quality player? Let him develop in the D-League.

Marvin isn't a starting PF. IF he re-signs, it will be to back up the SF position.

WE draft a PF and Kanter and Favors can still get 30 mins. each. Gobert and Vonleh/Randle get 18/per as the backups. They're both raw and aren't ready to play substantially more. Of course, there are always injuries. So per game averages will go up a bit from the above. Embiid creates a similar scenario in Year 1. You ease him in slowly and have Favors play more mins. at PF.

Yes, Kanter was tearing it up offensively, but what can he do defensively? Nothing as far as I can see. Vonleh can be a 2-way player. Enes just might be the "Kant"-er man (as in Can't play defense). He just doesn't move well.
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Worried about the minutes. Just because you and I see Evans, Murphy, and !arvin as ill suited for the PF, does not mean the organization will, or that our new coach will. Drafting more bigs not named Embiid is asking for trouble. Gobert hardly played last year, and Kanter was yanked around constantly as he competed for more minutes with Evans and Marvin. He was drafted as a project with insane potential, and has only logged 4090 minutes compared to his counterpart Favors who has 6899 minutes. Be patient. Don't build a dam when we just opened the floodgates.

Drafting Randle or Vonleh adds depth at a position we don't need depth at. If we draft Vonleh or Randle, we will still need patience for them to develop, so why waste the pick? Kanter can develop adequate positional defense, and favors and Gobert can be beasts at it. Problem is solved in time and with proper system. Charlotte plays Al heavy minutes, and Bulls play Boozer a lot, yet both teams have found a way to be top tier defensively. I see Kanter's defensive ceiling as higher than both of them.

Kanter moves fine, I see him as uncertain and second guessing where he should be, which sows down his reaction time. Athletically, he is fairly quick for his size per all his testing.
 
Core4 said:
To add to that, the only concern I have with Vonleh is his motor. Does he become another Marvin Williams...immensely talented, but without the drive to be great?
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This worries me too.

Do you worry about Kanter's motor? The kid who transformed his body between his freshman and sophomore year. I fear people get caught up in how he started last season, and not how he ended it. A serious injury, and a lack of an offseason can be psychologically devastating on a player with as little experience as him, but he worked through it and finished the year strong, in prime bully form.



Really wish I didn't always have to champion Kanter, but it seems like people have forgotten the facts concerning him. Quitting is premature, and the only real upgrade is Embiid.
 
So why draft Smart or Exum when we already have Burke, Burks and Hayward at the guard positions? That only leaves 13-15 mins at the backup PG available.
The ONLY position where the Jazz don't have depth is at SF. They have zero on the roster.

In your opinion, who do we draft at #5? And how do the minutes get distributed? Seems like under the positional "need" theory, McDermott is the answer.

I don't think any coach besides Ty would be as loyal to guys like Jeremy, RJ and Marvin. I just don't see it in other organizations. It was like a disease with Ty and to a certain extent, with Sloan, to be 100% loyal to veterans and make rookies suffer and bleed before getting minutes. Murphy ain't getting mins. There's no worry there. He was a 2nd-rounder and was brought in for a look. He probably wouldn't even make the roster if the Jazz were to draft a PF. Jeremy has, what, a couple of years left on his contract? It won't be renewed. So trade him if he doesn't like the idea of being the 11th man on the roster. He just isn't that good.

Can Kanter become an adequate defender? I'm not convinced. But I LOVE competition. Make him outplay Vonleh or Randle and earn the PF position. If he does, fantastic! He's had a fire lit underneath him and has risen to the challenge. If not, we've upgraded at the position and are a better team (and freed ourselves from paying $10M+ to a one-dimensional player). And yes, I AM worried about Kanter. I'm not quitting on him. All teams need 4 bigs; three of them can get 30 mins+. Competition will make everyone better. And if all 4 show they're worthy of being starters? Then you keep three and get a nice return from trading the 4th.
 
Core4 said:
So why draft Smart or Exum when we already have Burke, Burks and Hayward at the guard positions. That only leaves 13-15 mins at the backup PG available?
The ONLY position where the Jazz don't have depth is at SF. They have zero on the roster.

In your opinion, who do we draft at 5? And how do the minutes get distributed? Seems like under the positional "need" theory, McDermott is the answer.

I don't think any coach besides Ty would be as loyal to guys like Jeremy, RJ and Marvin. I just don't see it in other organizations. It was like a disease with Ty and to a certain extent, with Sloan, to be 100% loyal to veterans and make rookies suffer and bleed before getting minutes. Murphy ain't getting mins. There's no worry there. He was a 2nd-rounder and was brought in for a look. He probably wouldn't even make the roster if the Jazz were to draft a PF.

Can Kanter become an adequate defender? I'm not convinced. But I LOVE competition. Make him outplay Vonleh or Randle and earn the PF position. If he does, fantastic! He's had a fire lit underneath him and has risen to the challenge. If not, we've upgraded at the position and are a better team (and freed ourselves from paying $10M+ to a one-dimensional player).
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A. Gordon has more upside at SF than PF.

PG only has Burke, who was a "safe" pick, not a "potential" pick, and yet he couldn't shoot, get to the line, or play D because of his measurements and lack of athleticism. Neto hasn't come over yet, so I'm not sure if you count him yet. JLIII is a team option, so he should be gone. And Diante Garrett was wildly inefficient, even for a backup, with a PER of 7 something. People just convinced themselves that Garrett looked good because all of the other PG's looked atrocious. Exum and Smart offer many things that Burke will never be able to achieve. Still, A. Gordon w/ 5th pick over Smart. I've posted why numerous times, but don't take my word. Check out his combine results, draft videos, and watch some of his games.


Kanter doesn't need to be paid until next year. Use this upcoming year to truly figure out his worth if he doesn't take want you low ball him this year, or trade him at the deadline if you've seen enough. But don't put yourself in a log jam again where you can't evaluate correctly. The team needs upgrades at SF, since Hayward is a 2, and the Point, not at PF or C, unless you know without a doubt you are upgrading. Interruptions **** with your current asset's window to show you who and what they are.
 
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Core4 said:
The ONLY position where the Jazz don't have depth is at SF. They have zero on the roster.

In your opinion, who do we draft at #5?
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small forward aaron gordon
 
I don't think we're getting a first-option player at #5, unless one of the top 4 players somehow slips. That said, Randle, Vonleh and Smart could all be impact players, and of those three, Vonleh probably has the most upside.

I see Vonleh as a longer and more versatile Marvin Williams. If he can play some minutes at the SF, that's a huge plus.
 
Sexual Favors said:
A. Gordon has more upside at SF than PF.

PG only has Burke, who was a "safe" pick, not a "potential" pick, and yet he couldn't shoot, get to the line, or play D because of his measurements and lack of athleticism. Neto hasn't come over yet, so I'm not sure if you count him yet. JLIII is a team option, so he should be gone. And Diante Garrett was wildly inefficient, even for a backup, with a PER of 7 something. People just convinced themselves that Garrett looked good because all of the other PG's looked atrocious. Exum and Smart offer many things that Burke will never be able to achieve. Still, A. Gordon w/ 5th pick over Smart. I've posted why numerous times, but don't take my word. Check out his combine results, draft videos, and watch some of his games.


Kanter doesn't need to be paid until next year. Use this upcoming year to truly figure out his worth if he doesn't take want you low ball him this year, or trade him at the deadline if you've seen enough. But don't put yourself in a log jam again where you can't evaluate correctly. The team needs upgrades at SF, since Hayward is a 2, and the Point, not at PF or C, unless you know without a doubt you are upgrading. Interruptions **** with your current asset's window to show you who and what they are.
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You take the best player available despite the position and then the coach either makes it work or you let guys battle it out and the best man wins. The other gets traded for a position of need. So how can we get both Smart and Gordon to make you excited about our draft?

Perhaps we can trade one of our young guys or a future pick to get a second pick. Draft Smart/Exum #5 and then trade Burke #23 + next year 2nd round pick for LA#7, then draft Gordon. Jazz can bring Neto over or they could sign Marshall as a FA. With the #35 pick Jazz take best available shooter SG/SF.

Another trade partner might be Charlotte at #9, they don't have a lot of players I want but perhaps the Jazz could do a sign and trade after the draft and include a 3rd team.

Smart/Exum/Marshall/Neto (1 starter/1backup)
Burks/#35
Hayward/ Gordon
Favors/Gordon/Evans
Kanter/Gobert

Fill in the rest when scrubs. If Gordon Hayward leaves than attempt to see if you can find a SF/SG in FA, someone like Afflao in Orlando. He has a reasonable contract 7.75, signed for two more years. 16.2 pts, 3.8 rebounds, 3.4 assists with .815 FT, .459% FG, .392 3PT%.

There is a lot of flexible in this lineup. Offense might be an issue but defensively the Jazz would be tough especially Smart/ Hayward/Gordon/Favors/Gobert
 
Thanks for all the replies gang.

Unfortunately, I still see nothing more exciting than Kanter/Hayward/Burke. I sure hope someone comes in and surprises us but so far this draft is looking less and less exciting, unless the Jazz pull off something to move up.

Kanter, #5, #23 for one of the top 3 maybe?

Maybe I am just being pessimistic but I think it is more of a realistic stance that we are going to have another generic lottery pick on a team full of generic lottery picks that still can't make the playoffs.

:/
 
My thoughts

*Embiid and exum bust potential is based on limited info and Exums star potential is second hand
[table="width: 500, align: left"]
[tr]
[td]star potential[/td]
[td]bust potential/meh[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]1.Embiid[/td]
[td]1.Embiid[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]2.Wiggins[/td]
[td]2.Exum[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]3.Parker[/td]
[td]3.Randle[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]4.Exum[/td]
[td]4.Vonleh[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]5.Gordon[/td]
[td]5.Gordon[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]6.Smart[/td]
[td]6.Smart[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]7.Randle[/td]
[td]7.Wiggins[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]8.Vonleh[/td]
[td]8.Parker[/td]
[/tr]
[/table]


Buy low sell High

Guys that are likely overvalued in many NBA FOs
Hayward, Burke, Favors, maybe Kanter

Undervalued guys
Burks, Evans, Gobert, probably Kanter

5th pick is only on the table to move up for Parker or Wiggins. My 5th pick from likely available guys is Gordon, Smart is a close second.

23rd and 35th are for sale to the highest bidder.

I think DL will make a big splash. One that will surprise us.
 
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