2021 NBA Draft Preview (new thread)

[LoPo]

And to come back to a Lopo talking point, if you want Kuzma and the Lakers/Lebron really dont **** with him, you offer Favors for Kuzma.

Lakers can get out of a ****** deal a year early and they get a big man who can do a minutes split with Harrell and be effective.

I'm of course the OG Kuzma person in the history of the NBA, but the dude is overpaid. I might want compensation back for taking on that contract tbh.

I'm suggesting

Kuzma, #22 and a 2026 1st
for
Bojan

I think it's a fair deal. Kuzma is a slight step back from Bojan, but Bojan's lack of any production outside of scoring alarms me. He had the half of his life against the Clippers and we still lost. I think Kuzma could provide more defense and rebounding with the occasional hot game as well.

I have also suggested a deal around Favors for Kuzma, but I don't think LA does that without us losing more assets.

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[Saint Cy of JFC]

I'm suggesting

Kuzma, #22 and a 2026 1st
for
Bojan

I think it's a fair deal. Kuzma is a slight step back from Bojan, but Bojan's lack of any production outside of scoring alarms me. He had the half of his life against the Clippers and we still lost. I think Kuzma could provide more defense and rebounding with the occasional hot game as well.

I have also suggested a deal around Favors for Kuzma, but I don't think LA does that without us losing more assets.

Sent from my SM-G970U using JazzFanz mobile app

Your esuggesting a large pile of **** for one of our best players. Kuzma isnt anywhere near a slight step back. He's a James Harden 5 step back travel no call kind of step back from Bojan.

Kuzma aint out here D'ing anyone up. At least Bogey can get tough on dudes. Kuzma is a better rebounder for sure, but he isnt a game changer and he likely wouldnt be in our closing 5 (the only area the Jazz have trouble rebounding from because they were elite all year outside of that)

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

A few thoughts on a few players after watching some limited stuff:

As always, I'm a total novice. I welcome thoughts from those who are more knowledgeable than I am.

Vrenz: I'm very intrigued. His lack of any in-between game is a problem, but I like a lot of the rest. Great passer/playmaker; I like his defensive potential well enough; I think his shot will probably be adequate. Length would really help Jazz if he can turn into a rotation player

Roko: I like his attacking the basket from 15 feet in, though don't know if it will translate. Seems to have decent toughness/motor. Could end up fine on defense, though I have questions on lateral quickness/inside presence. Less sold on the outside shot. Wish he was 1 1/2 inches taller.

Ayo: Maybe can be a decent complement to Donovan. Good in the open court. I didn't see as much to excite me in the half court. Not sure he's really a playmaker, but rather someone who's just a good functional cog. Defensive potential looks solid, though I didn't see what I was hoping to see (a lock-down type) on that side of the court from what I watched.

Bones: Don't we already have the better/taller/heavier version in Clarkson?

Duarte: Was hoping to see Doug Christie 2.0. Not sure he's quite that, though he's probably serviceable. I think maybe slightly overrated.

Isaiah Todd: I think he may be underrated. Skills seem to work well with the NBA game. His relative lack of creating is more acceptable with someone who projects to play small-ball 5 (as opposed to perhaps Thor & Murphy).

Chris Smith: I might take the gamble despite the injury. Has everything needed in a wing, other than consistent motor (which is why I'll probably be wrong with my hopes for him).

Wieskamp: fine as a second-rounder if we get one somewhere. He doesn't do enough for me in terms of offensive creation or defense to really tempt me more than that.

I still think Wieskamp is being underrated defensively just because he's a white dude who looks kind of ike Duncan Robinson

 

[Elizah Huge]

I'm suggesting

Kuzma, #22 and a 2026 1st
for
Bojan

I think it's a fair deal. Kuzma is a slight step back from Bojan, but Bojan's lack of any production outside of scoring alarms me. He had the half of his life against the Clippers and we still lost. I think Kuzma could provide more defense and rebounding with the occasional hot game as well.

I have also suggested a deal around Favors for Kuzma, but I don't think LA does that without us losing more assets.

Sent from my SM-G970U using JazzFanz mobile app

This makes us worse. Like considerably worse.

 

[idiot]

I still think Wieskamp is being underrated defensively just because he's a white dude who looks kind of ike Duncan Robinson

Hope you're right. I'm an Iowa fan, so would love to see him succeed.

 

[idiot]

Anyone with thoughts on Sandro Mamukelashvili? He's interesting for some of the same reasons Vrenz is interesting (though older). He's also about 40 pounds heavier at the same 6-10. Apparently he's on the Jazz's radar.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Anyone with thoughts on Sandro Mamukelashvili? He's interesting for some of the same reasons Vrenz is interesting (though older). He's also about 40 pounds heavier at the same 6-10. Apparently he's on the Jazz's radar.

Seems like a good small ball 5 type, at least offensively. I think he's basically a bigger/more mobile Niang, but like Niang I think he has to become a fairly high level open shooter to be a positive because his defense is going to be lacking.

His perimeter defense is pretty terrible though. Way too upright. Niang can at least get in a stance now. Can Sandro learn that? If he can, he can be a better Niang.

 

[idiot]

Seems like a good small ball 5 type, at least offensively. I think he's basically a bigger/more mobile Niang, but like Niang I think he has to become a fairly high level open shooter to be a positive because his defense is going to be lacking.

His perimeter defense is pretty terrible though. Way too upright. Niang can at least get in a stance now. Can Sandro learn that? If he can, he can be a better Niang.

We see things slightly differently, I guess (though I don't watch enough to really be sure). I see your point about uprightness, but I kind of liked his hip flexibility. I was a bit more impressed with Sandro's defense than with Wieskamp's (given the differing positional expectations). But surely this will be one of the key questions going into the NBA for both of them.

If he can turn into a better Niang, that's a useful player.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Damn... @Saint Cy of JFC Hopefully your guy gets his life in order. Nice prospect so hopefully he gets straightened out.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Damn... @Saint Cy of JFC Hopefully your guy gets his life in order. Nice prospect so hopefully he gets straightened out.

2nd year in a row now that Toronto drafts my 2nd round sleeper crush and they have something derail their career.

Terrence Davis ended up being an abuser and Harris is into some kind of drugs. It's crazy that the former gets to play basketball with no real direct consequences and the other is banned for life. Nearly 100% of sane people know that the former is far worse.

Also kind of hate that the NBA doesn't come out right and just say what he got caught with. It leads to people speculating the worst kind of stuff, when the reality might be that he just got randomly tested the day after taking some LSD.

 

[LoPo]

Your esuggesting a large pile of **** for one of our best players. Kuzma isnt anywhere near a slight step back. He's a James Harden 5 step back travel no call kind of step back from Bojan.

Kuzma aint out here D'ing anyone up. At least Bogey can get tough on dudes. Kuzma is a better rebounder for sure, but he isnt a game changer and he likely wouldnt be in our closing 5 (the only area the Jazz have trouble rebounding from because they were elite all year outside of that)

2 1st rounders and an NBA starter is a large pile **** for a 32 year old shooter who doesn't do anything else at a high level?

At some point, we have to think two or three moves ahead. We need youth. We aren't trading Joe. We are going to try to bring back Conley. Don is the only young player on the entire roster. And I don't have faith in #30 doing all that much for us. #22 has a chance in this rather strong draft.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

2 1st rounders and an NBA starter is a large pile **** for a 32 year old shooter who doesn't do anything else at a high level?

At some point, we have to think two or three moves ahead. We need youth. We aren't trading Joe. We are going to try to bring back Conley. Don is the only young player on the entire roster. And I don't have faith in #30 doing all that much for us. #22 has a chance in this rather strong draft.

You're someone who is constantly talking about Mitchell and how we should make Mitchell happy. You can say he's just a shooter, but that "Just a shooter" has averaged 18.5 ppg his 2 years here. You love to dismiss dudes just to try and craft some weird narratives. You absolutely can not trade him just for some late round picks and a replacement level player. You got to get a defensive talent. Not a guy you (erroneously I might add) think can play defense. it's got to be a guy who know can defend his *** off.

You really think trading a guy like Bogey for a dude like Kuzma, a late 1st rounder, and a first rounder 5 YEARS FROM NOW is going to make him happy? That's the kind of move that is going to make him demand a trade, or even worse, just flat out leave when he's a UFA.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

2nd year in a row now that Toronto drafts my 2nd round sleeper crush and they have something derail their career.

Terrence Davis ended up being an abuser and Harris is into some kind of drugs. It's crazy that the former gets to play basketball with no real direct consequences and the other is banned for life. Nearly 100% of sane people know that the former is far worse.

Also kind of hate that the NBA doesn't come out right and just say what he got caught with. It leads to people speculating the worst kind of stuff, when the reality might be that he just got randomly tested the day after taking some LSD.

I guess part of the difference is you can't settle a failed drug test out of court and pay it hush money. I agree completely... didn't check back in to see if Davis was convicted but I'm sure he will be celebrated with Rose and others if he plays well enough.

I wonder if all the cocaine in the 80s NBA is the reason it is so harsh.

 

[LoPo]

You're someone who is constantly talking about Mitchell and how we should make Mitchell happy. You can say he's just a shooter, but that "Just a shooter" has averaged 18.5 ppg his 2 years here. You love to dismiss dudes just to try and craft some weird narratives. You absolutely can not trade him just for some late round picks and a replacement level player. You got to get a defensive talent. Not a guy you (erroneously I might add) think can play defense. it's got to be a guy who know can defend his *** off.

You really think trading a guy like Bogey for a dude like Kuzma, a late 1st rounder, and a first rounder 5 YEARS FROM NOW is going to make him happy? That's the kind of move that is going to make him demand a trade, or even worse, just flat out leave when he's a UFA.

I don't know what kind of relationship Don has with Kuzma. I'm making the assumption that since they are in the same draft class and age, they might have a connection. It might make Don happy. It might be a Royce situation where they push each other. I don't know.

Bojan is a fantastic shooter, but he is aging. Even he said in the postseason interviews that he has to work on rebounding more. Has there ever been any evidence of a player approaching his mid-30's substantially increasing his rebounding?

Last year, Kuzma played less minutes per game than Bojan, but he still got over 2 more rebounds a game. They had almost exactly the same EFG%. Similar PER. This is while the Lakers had a **** show of a season. His averages this year, still comparable to Bojan, were the worst of his career. Probably because LeBron is declining and the LA roster sucked especially without AD. Bojan had the benefit of being the 4th best player on a highly productive regular season team. How many more open looks and points does Kuzma get in our offense?

I'm not doing this trade straight up 32 year old Bojan for 25 year old Kuzma. I'm only doing this trade if the right guy we want is there at #22. Plus, we get a first rounder in 2026.

I don't know why I'm spending so much time trying to convince you. You don't know what you're talking about it and just looking to attack people.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

I don't know what kind of relationship Don has with Kuzma. I'm making the assumption that since they are in the same draft class and age, they might have a connection. It might make Don happy. It might be a Royce situation where they push each other. I don't know.

Bojan is a fantastic shooter, but he is aging. Even he said in the postseason interviews that he has to work on rebounding more. Has there ever been any evidence of a player approaching his mid-30's substantially increasing his rebounding?

Last year, Kuzma played less minutes per game than Bojan, but he still got over 2 more rebounds a game. They had almost exactly the same EFG%. Similar PER. This is while the Lakers had a **** show of a season. His averages this year, still comparable to Bojan, were the worst of his career. Probably because LeBron is declining and the LA roster sucked especially without AD. Bojan had the benefit of being the 4th best player on a highly productive regular season team. How many more open looks and points does Kuzma get in our offense?

I'm not doing this trade straight up 32 year old Bojan for 25 year old Kuzma. I'm only doing this trade if the right guy we want is there at #22. Plus, we get a first rounder in 2026.

I don't know why I'm spending so much time trying to convince you. You don't know what you're talking about it and just looking to attack people.

Is Donovan going to be happy just because you trade for his buds who are mediocre basketball players while you are giving away top shelf talent on a discount? You can't even believe this stuff you're saying if you think Donovan is the player he is. You are doing some major mental gymnastics here. I'm a Kuzma fan and and you are just making **** up to make **** up at this point. If any player you disliked on our roster put up the ******** he put up in the playoffs, you'd be calling for their head and asking to trade them for Jonathon Simmons.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

The amount of serious mental gymnastics you have to go through to be like "Oh this player severely underperformed because he had to play with the greatest playmaker in the history of the NBA" then call me out for not knowing what I'm talking about is insanity.

 

[LoPo]

Is Donovan going to be happy just because you trade for his buds who are mediocre basketball players while you are giving away top shelf talent on a discount?

Bojan's career
14.6 ppg
.546 EFG%
3.5 rpg
39% 3pt
1.5 apg

Kuzma's career
15.2 ppg
.52 EFG%
5.2 rpg
34% 3pt
1.9apg

I love how you are trying to make it out that Kuzma is some scrub and Bojan is an All Star. They aren't that far apart. Kuzma has a comparable career and he hasn't even hit his prime.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Bojan's career
14.6 ppg
.546 EFG%
3.5 rpg
39% 3pt
1.5 apg

Kuzma's career
15.2 ppg
.52 EFG%
5.2 rpg
34% 3pt
1.9apg

I love how you are trying to make it out that Kuzma is some scrub and Bojan is an All Star. They aren't that far apart. Kuzma has a comparable career and he hasn't even hit his prime.

You will really do anything to craft a narrative.

Yes, assuming Kuzma has the exact same career trajectory and improvement curve (highly unlikely) that Bojan does, Kuzma might one day be a starter level basketball player.

 

[LoPo]

You will really do anything to craft a narrative.

Yes, assuming Kuzma has the exact same career trajectory and improvement curve (highly unlikely) that Bojan does, Kuzma might one day be a starter level basketball player.

So Kuzma isn't even a starter level player now? Who is crafting a narrative?

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