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3 way trade Jazz/Celtics/T'Wolves

da ThRONe

da ThRONe

Active Member
Jazz-send- G. Hayward and 2014 23th pick
Celtics-send- G. Wallace, J. Green, J. Sullinger, 2014 6th pick, 2014 17th pick, 2015 1st round pick, 6ers 2015 top 14 protected pick, Kings 2015 2nd round pick, Nets 2016 1st round pick. Nets 2017 draft swap rights,
T'Wolves-send- K. Love, and 2014 13th pick

Jazz-receive- G. Wallace, 2014 13th pick, and Nets 2016 1st round.
Celtics-receive- K. Love, G. Hayward, C. Budinger and 2014 23th pick
T'Wolves-receive- J. Green, J. Sullinger, 2014 6th pick, Boston unprotected 2015 1st round pick, 6ers top 14 proctected 2015, Kings 2nd round pick, Nets 2017 draft swap rights.

Jazz- Hayward at best is a number 3 guy on a team. Which is great if you have a true #1 and #2 player on the roster. I don't think the Jazz will be built to win that way. So they avoid having to overpay for Hayward so they S&T him away to Boston who won't mind paying Hayward and reuniting him with his former college coach. Eating Wallace contract won't be great this season, but with Jefferson, Biedrins and potentially Williams coming off the books Utah will have plenty of cap space to do so, and while Wallace contract is awful this season it will likely have some value as an expiring the following year. The team turns the 23th 1st rounder into the 13th and get the Nets 2016 pick. With the age and injury issues of that team 2016 pick could end up very high.

Celtics- They get two guys they covet in the same transaction. While they give up a great deal of assets to do so Boston is thrilled to secure Love and happy to add Hayward as well. In the process they trade Wallace's awful contract making space for the both Hayward and Love new deals.

T'Wolves- Are in a tough spot. They need to trade Love, but most teams aren't going to want to send them the assets that justify a trade without knowing Love will be there long term. Boston is one of the few teams that trade for Love without any fear that they can't sign Love long term. Minnesota gets a big in Sullinger that basically has the same play style and skill set as Love. While suring up their whole at the 3 with Jeff Green. They turn the 13th pick into the 6th pick. That pick gives them the chance to take the BPA as they really would be expecting a stud and will have all their holes in the starting line-up filled.

Jazz-draft- 5th -Aaron Gordon. He may not be the best prospect at 5, but what he projected to do at an amazing level is what the Jazz need most defense. The fact that he can be your secondary ball handler makes up for losing Hayward.

- 13th- Gary Harris. Again he adds the much need primeter defense this team is lacking. If Kanter is on the court you are going to need great primeter defenders. Plus Harris has shown an ability to knock down 3's for floor spacing, and has the potential to put the ball on the floor to get his

Celtics-draft- 23th -T.J. Warren. He's a guy who can score without the ball and can play with Boston's new big 3 of Love/Rondo/Hayward. If Warren is gone I can see them reaching for a Glenn Robinson with this pick.

T'Wolves-draft- 6th- Noah Vonleh- T'Wolves have so many options here if they don't love(no pun intended) Rubio anymore they may want to go Smart here, if they want some insurance for Sullinger they may go Randle here, I think names like Saric, Staukas, McDermott, and Young will all be in play here depending on who the Wolves fall in love with. Ultimately I think they settle on Vonleh he's a nice combo of skill and athleticism and he may be skilled enough to play the 3.

-17- Rondey Hood- I think he'll be the BPA at this pick. I'd say Lavine is in consideration if he's still here as well.

Jazz 2014-15 roster

Burke/Garrett
Harris/Burks
Gordon/Wallace
Favors/Evans
Kanter/Gobert

Celtics 2014-15 roster

Rondo/Pressley
Hayward/Bradley
Budinger/Bogans
Love/Bass
Olynyk/Faverani

T'Wolves 2014-15 roster

Rubio/Barea
Martin/Shved
Green/Mbah a Moute
Sullinger/Vonleh
Pekovic/Dieng
 
da ThRONe said:
They can S&T Hayward he's a restricted free agent. Meaning that Utah has his rights until the decline to match any offers for Hayward. My Pelicans got Tyreke Evans in a S&T from the Kings.
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But can't trade him PRIOR to the free agency period. The Tyreke Evans trade was agreed to on July 5th, but couldn't become official until July 10th. It is against NBA rules to talk to FA's about contracts before July 1st. The draft occurs June 24th. So Utah cannot S&T Hayward as part of any draft day trade.

Now what IS legal is to do a deal AFTER the free agency period. Then you can do a S&T and include the rights to a drafted player.
So essentially Jazz give up what was a 9th pick and has become a pretty good player in Hayward for a 13th pick and a likely very-late pick in 2016? AND they take on a terrible contract in Wallace? Sorry, but expirings have very little value nowadays. You must be a Celtics fan because Boston absolutely ^&%$# Utah AND Minnesota in this deal.
 
Core4 said:
But can't trade him PRIOR to the free agency period. The Tyreke Evans trade was agreed to on July 5th, but couldn't become official until July 10th. It is against NBA rules to talk to FA's about contracts before July 1st. The draft occurs June 24th. So Utah cannot S&T Hayward as part of any draft day trade.

Now what IS legal is to do a deal AFTER the free agency period. Then you can do a S&T and include the rights to a drafted player.
So essentially Jazz give up what was a 9th pick and has become a pretty good player in Hayward for a 13th pick and a likely very-late pick in 2016? AND they take on a terrible contract in Wallace? Sorry, but expirings have very little value nowadays. You must be a Celtics fan because Boston absolutely ^&%$# Utah AND Minnesota in this deal.
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Or maybe I'm not as high on Hayward as you are.

Again the deal can be in place and agreed upon. Each team would draft each others player and finalize the trade after the deadline. Which is the only way Boston could give up this year pick and next years pick.
 
da ThRONe said:
Or maybe I'm not as high on Hayward as you are.

Again the deal can be in place and agreed upon. Each team would draft each others player and finalize the trade after the deadline. Which is the only way Boston could give up this year pick and next years pick.
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1. Only the draft choices can be discussed and agreed upon. There can be absolutely ZERO communication with Hayward or his agent before July 1st. Otherwise, the deal will be nixed and penalties imposed.

2. That's a lot of moving pieces for a deal to be contingent upon, especially when it involves Love, who is being pursued by a number of teams. Again, remember we only hold the restricted rights to Gordon. It's likely he'd want to go to Boston, but what if his agent comes back with, "hey, Gordon wants the MAX to go to Boston; otherwise, we'll sign a deal with Phoenix (or LA, etc.)." Because a trade has been "agreed to" among three teams, Hayward has all the leverage. But Boston could then decide a MAX contract isn't what they can pay, given the salaries of Love and Rondo. And the deal falls apart.

3. Given the above, teams aren't going to draft 2014 picks they MIGHT trade according to another team's needs. Because if the deal falls apart due to any number of factors (Hayward deciding he doesn't like Boston, wants more money, or simply decides to sign elsewhere or Minnesota getting a better deal for Love, etc), then 3 teams are left with picks they didn't necessarily want.
 
Core4 said:
1. Only the draft choices can be discussed and agreed upon. There can be absolutely ZERO communication with Hayward or his agent before July 1st. Otherwise, the deal will be nixed and penalties imposed.

2. That's a lot of moving pieces for a deal to be contingent upon, especially when it involves Love, who is being pursued by a number of teams. Again, remember we only hold the restricted rights to Gordon. It's likely he'd want to go to Boston, but what if his agent comes back with, "hey, Gordon wants the MAX to go to Boston; otherwise, we'll sign a deal with Phoenix (or LA, etc.)." Because a trade has been "agreed to" among three teams, Hayward has all the leverage. But Boston could then decide a MAX contract isn't what they can pay, given the salaries of Love and Rondo. And the deal falls apart.

3. Given the above, teams aren't going to draft 2014 picks they MIGHT trade according to another team's needs. Because if the deal falls apart due to any number of factors (Hayward deciding he doesn't like Boston, wants more money, or simply decides to sign elsewhere or Minnesota getting a better deal for Love, etc), then 3 teams are left with picks they didn't necessarily want.
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Good post...you explained it very well. But unfortunately we'll still see another million posts proposing Hayward be included in a draft day deal to move up to a higher pick. At least some people "get it".
 
da ThRONe said:
Jazz-send- G. Hayward and 2014 23th pick
Celtics-send- G. Wallace, J. Green, J. Sullinger, 2014 6th pick, 2014 17th pick, 2015 1st round pick, 6ers 2015 top 14 protected pick, Kings 2015 2nd round pick, Nets 2016 1st round pick. Nets 2017 draft swap rights,
T'Wolves-send- K. Love, and 2014 13th pick

Jazz-receive- G. Wallace, 2014 13th pick, and Nets 2016 1st round.
Celtics-receive- K. Love, G. Hayward, C. Budinger and 2014 23th pick
T'Wolves-receive- J. Green, J. Sullinger, 2014 6th pick, Boston unprotected 2015 1st round pick, 6ers top 14 proctected 2015, Kings 2nd round pick, Nets 2017 draft swap rights.

Jazz- Hayward at best is a number 3 guy on a team. Which is great if you have a true #1 and #2 player on the roster. I don't think the Jazz will be built to win that way. So they avoid having to overpay for Hayward so they S&T him away to Boston who won't mind paying Hayward and reuniting him with his former college coach. Eating Wallace contract won't be great this season, but with Jefferson, Biedrins and potentially Williams coming off the books Utah will have plenty of cap space to do so, and while Wallace contract is awful this season it will likely have some value as an expiring the following year. The team turns the 23th 1st rounder into the 13th and get the Nets 2016 pick. With the age and injury issues of that team 2016 pick could end up very high.

Celtics- They get two guys they covet in the same transaction. While they give up a great deal of assets to do so Boston is thrilled to secure Love and happy to add Hayward as well. In the process they trade Wallace's awful contract making space for the both Hayward and Love new deals.

T'Wolves- Are in a tough spot. They need to trade Love, but most teams aren't going to want to send them the assets that justify a trade without knowing Love will be there long term. Boston is one of the few teams that trade for Love without any fear that they can't sign Love long term. Minnesota gets a big in Sullinger that basically has the same play style and skill set as Love. While suring up their whole at the 3 with Jeff Green. They turn the 13th pick into the 6th pick. That pick gives them the chance to take the BPA as they really would be expecting a stud and will have all their holes in the starting line-up filled.

Jazz-draft- 5th -Aaron Gordon. He may not be the best prospect at 5, but what he projected to do at an amazing level is what the Jazz need most defense. The fact that he can be your secondary ball handler makes up for losing Hayward.

- 13th- Gary Harris. Again he adds the much need primeter defense this team is lacking. If Kanter is on the court you are going to need great primeter defenders. Plus Harris has shown an ability to knock down 3's for floor spacing, and has the potential to put the ball on the floor to get his

Celtics-draft- 23th -T.J. Warren. He's a guy who can score without the ball and can play with Boston's new big 3 of Love/Rondo/Hayward. If Warren is gone I can see them reaching for a Glenn Robinson with this pick.

T'Wolves-draft- 6th- Noah Vonleh- T'Wolves have so many options here if they don't love(no pun intended) Rubio anymore they may want to go Smart here, if they want some insurance for Sullinger they may go Randle here, I think names like Saric, Staukas, McDermott, and Young will all be in play here depending on who the Wolves fall in love with. Ultimately I think they settle on Vonleh he's a nice combo of skill and athleticism and he may be skilled enough to play the 3.

-17- Rondey Hood- I think he'll be the BPA at this pick. I'd say Lavine is in consideration if he's still here as well.

Jazz 2014-15 roster

Burke/Garrett
Harris/Burks
Gordon/Wallace
Favors/Evans
Kanter/Gobert

Celtics 2014-15 roster

Rondo/Pressley
Hayward/Bradley
Budinger/Bogans
Love/Bass
Olynyk/Faverani

T'Wolves 2014-15 roster

Rubio/Barea
Martin/Shved
Green/Mbah a Moute
Sullinger/Vonleh
Pekovic/Dieng
Click to expand...

How do you not have Burks starting? You have a rookie starting over him!
 
akirac73 said:
Good post...you explained it very well. But unfortunately we'll still see another million posts proposing Hayward be included in a draft day deal to move up to a higher pick. At least some people "get it".
Click to expand...

You are talking as if these type of wink wink deals don't take place all the time.

Also for example if Boston is ok giving Hayward the max then that whole situation becomes extremely less violatile. Boston will be prepared to sign Hayward if they did this deal.
 
da ThRONe said:
Or maybe I'm not as high on Hayward as you are.

Again the deal can be in place and agreed upon. Each team would draft each others player and finalize the trade after the deadline. Which is the only way Boston could give up this year pick and next years pick.
Click to expand...

What if Hayward decides to sign an offer sheet with Phoenix?
 
Darkwing Duck said:
What if Hayward decides to sign an offer sheet with Phoenix?
Click to expand...

OK let's all play naive like teams can't leak information about trades or can't get some type of read on things.

Even if he did Utah can match and trade him at a later date. Hayward would still have no say in the matter. Again it would all hinge on Boston and what they are willing to pay.
 
da ThRONe said:
OK let's all play naive like teams can't leak information about trades or can't get some type of read on things.

Even if he did Utah can match and trade him at a later date. Hayward would still have no say in the matter. Again it would all hinge on Boston and what they are willing to pay.
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Which would blow up your trade, anyway. Hayward could just say no to the contract being negotiated without his party's input. It's not smart to agree to a trade, in this case with three parties, without the consent of a required fourth party. Can't exactly remember the rules, but you can't trade a player (unless it's specifically a sign-and-trade) until December 15 of the year you sign him. That's, what, 6 months after signing? So the Jazz would end up with the player the other teams wanted, which puts the other teams in the same position. There's absolutely NO way that any team is going to agree to draft a player for another team without 100% assurance that a trade would go through, and that cannot happen under any circumstance with restricted free agents, or any free agent.
 
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