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Charlie Kirk shot at UVU event

Jazz Spazz said:
I’m admittedly not too many hours into listening to some of these debates with Kirk. Never heard a word of his prior, but thanks to both sides of this stupid argumentative thread I’ve done so.

So far nothing that is him spouting hatred. He had made some dodge, stretch answers/retorts. He does have a mocking tone at times. I’ve also seen him be respectful as well. I’ve seen 10x worse here daily. If his is hate speech, then you people are friggin hitlers yourselves.

One of my thoughts is I won’t necessarily believe stats or facts spouted by Red or Kirk (whoever) without backup. Who knows if I’d be getting “DOL” stats on employment. I say look into everything. It’s easy to accept something conforming with your confirmation biases. Trust no one, check sources, data and conclusions. I do try to check links and sources.

There are so many instances of quoting one thing out of context to twist the message or get a reaction.

Both sides here need to deescalate. Kirk was not the second coming of St John, but he wasn’t Stalin either.

I might respond to a post or two that I disagree with in part or whole, or find intellectually dishonest.

I won’t respond to all the smug, repugnant posts some of you made, and I hope you find shame at some point for them.
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He has made some full-on racist and misogynistic statements though.
 
Jazz Spazz said:
Does calling Trump a rapist and pedophile over and over make you feel right about hating him? Is it about those things? Probably not or you’d say the same crap about Biden, Clinton, or whoever. You pick and choose who you call names and it makes you feel strong?

99% sure there are a boatload of dems, republs, and celebs on that Epstein list.

Don’t act like it’s a one name list. It’s tiring.

I really don’t like Trump but your one sided shtick is tiring. If you call one out, call them all out.
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Who is acting like Trump is the only one? Why should we have to call out others at the same time we call out Trump? I agree with you that they should all be investigated but The Rapist is our current President. He said he was going to release it. If he were innocent he could just release the list to absolve himself. There's plenty of evidence that he's a predator, much of it from his own mouth. Do you think the Epstein list is a "hoax"? I don't understand your reasoning.
 
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Red said:
This sucks. Who’s crushing free speech now? And is it permanent? Is this the way it’s going to be? Liberal voices silenced, period? Bondi said the DOJ will go after anyone for hate speech. Than retracted the threat. After all, hate speech is permitted by the constitution. Are we all enjoying the move to totalitarianism? (And, science is actively working on technologies that can decode brain activity to "read" thought, so maybe we’ll top the Chinese in controlling our citizens?)There’s a term for what ABC has become: collaborators. Cowards. This is how totalitarianism wins. Are we simply walking right into the end of our democracy, beginning with the end of free speech?

Dictators need collaborators. It makes their goals so much easier to reach. And there will always be cowards where $$$ is concerned. $$$ is so much more important than being principled.



www.theguardian.com

‘Censoring you in real time’: suspension of Jimmy Kimmel show sparks shock and fears for free speech

ABC decision over Kimmel comments about Charlie Kirk killing comes hours after Trump-appointed chair of US media regulator threatened broadcaster’s license
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com


In a stunning move, ABC announced Wednesday, Sept. 17 that it was taking "Jimmy Kimmel Live!" off the air indefinitely, after FCC chairman Brendan Carr threatened Kimmel and the network on a podcast over comments Kimmel made about the man charged with shooting Charlie Kirk.

In a year of gutless moves by major media companies, this may be the most gutless. ABC should be ashamed.

Earlier Wednesday, Brendan Carr, the chairman of the Federal Communications Commission, threatened ABC, Disney and Jimmy Kimmel over a Kimmel monologue that included comments about Charlie Kirk, ominously saying, "We can do this the easy way or the hard way."

A quick reminder that Carr is the chairman of the FCC, not a mob boss in a third-rate gangster movie. It's another example of Donald Trump's administration's threats to free speech, or at least free speech that doesn't praise Trump. Anything the president doesn't agree with or takes offense to, you're all out of luck.
———————————————
What happens when comedians are held to higher standards than Vice Presidents?

www.thebulwark.com

First, They Came for Jimmy Kimmel

What happens when comedians are held to stricter standards than vice presidents?
www.thebulwark.com www.thebulwark.com

www.alternet.org

It is happening here — and we just witnessed the moment everything changed

History’s path is never linear. But its turns can be very sharp.It is rare to be able to identify the moment when we can say “this is the point at which everything changed”. So have we reached the point where we can say the United States is in a constitutional crisis? Has American democracy...
www.alternet.org www.alternet.org
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It's really incredible how little organized resistance there is.
 
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Jazz Spazz said:
Does calling Trump a rapist and pedophile over and over make you feel right about hating him? Is it about those things? Probably not or you’d say the same crap about Biden, Clinton, or whoever. You pick and choose who you call names and it makes you feel strong?

99% sure there are a boatload of dems, republs, and celebs on that Epstein list.

Don’t act like it’s a one name list. It’s tiring.

I really don’t like Trump but your one sided shtick is tiring. If you call one out, call them all out.
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I'm calling him out because he's the ****ing President bro. Sorry that it's tiring for you.
 
str8line said:
Who is acting like Trump is the only one? Why should we have to call out others at the same time we call out Trump? I agree with you that they should all be investigated but The Rapist is our current President. He said he was going to release it. If he were innocent he could just release the list to absolve himself. There's plenty of evidence that he's a predator, much of it from his own mouth. Do you think the Epstein list is a "hoax"? I don't understand your reasoning.
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Thats how it comes across. It seems that Trump is a worse predator than the people you support, so some moral high ground? Posts from you make it seem like he’s the only one.

If you don’t like him and disagree with him, great, but this moral high ground isn’t completely honest. I don’t think a “my guy is less of a creep” is the same as I despise his policies etc.

I agree he should release the list. It would help stop the next Epstein and those that used him. Put em all in prison. It’s disgusting.
 
str8line said:
I'm calling him out because he's the ****ing President bro. Sorry that it's tiring for you.
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You and many of the others are tiring because I hate what this is turning you into. Celebrating someone’s assassination, and using their own quotes to attempt to dance on their grave. It’s disturbing, disgusting, revolting. The same as the morons saying similar things about the Minnesota political violence.
So because Trump is a vile human, it’s ok if you are back? If so, he wins.
 
str8line said:
He has made some full-on racist and misogynistic statements though.
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Ok. Link? Nothing I’ve seen so far. I’ve seen different opinions, viewpoints, and approaches but no racism or misogyny yet.

I’ll keep watching more of these, but at some point I’ll just stop.
 
Jazz Spazz said:
Is that the only part of the conversation you and others get stuck on. Pretty cherry pickish from the whole convo.

In the more full conversation he states that the cost of having the second amendment is some of these incidents. Just like the cost of vehicles and roads is 50k deaths a year by vehicle accident. We as a society have decided that cost is worth keeping roads, just as we should for the right to bear arms. Then he goes on to say we should have a reductionist view to do what we can to reduce the deaths.

He give s some of his approach to how, more fathers in homes, more armed guards at schools.

It is a logical argument.

I probably partially agree with him that we need to look at all means to reduce the deaths, but I also think there needs to be efforts made to make automatic and other military type guns locked down.

I also think… how did the war on drugs go? Were drugs stopped from getting into people’s hands? It’s interesting that the same people that oppose the war on drugs want a war on guns.

If someone wants a gun to do some violence, they will get it. Period. Law or no law.

I don’t like the cherry picking and what appears to be misrepresenting to say… Kirk bad, me good!
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Logic will get you nowhere- these are tds retards with full on brain melt
You will be labeled a trumper and a troll and they will block you
They think trump invented lying and otherwise we wouldn't know what it is, especially in politics.
 
str8line said:
Bunch of Kirk quotes here:

www.theguardian.com

Charlie Kirk in his own words: ‘prowling Blacks’ and ‘the great replacement strategy’

The far-right commentator didn’t pull his punches when discussing his bigoted views on current events
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
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Not super helpful. Just the same method of taking one blurb out and ignoring the rest. Some of these blurbs are pretty bad though so I’m curious if context would change anything. Maybe, maybe not. Context and hearing the full thing has helped me understand other quotes from in light of the conversation happening.

About as bad as some of the crap being said here tbh.

It’s not like you just blew my mind with a guardian article written by someone who disliked Kirk. Data point though.
 
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