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Collier Starting Over Keyonte: Are We Happy?

Handlogten's Heros said:
You don’t bench guys you are about to trade. Key hasn’t played well and has been given more grace than any prospect. Tough love is justified if this is what it is.
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Never said to bench Sexton I said wait till after he’s traded then just move Collier to the starting 5 in a short week or two.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Would be cool to see Harkless start at the 2. Harkless/Collier can be a positive defensive backcourt.
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He’s a come off the bench type of guy. If he was 6-5, ya, but he’s small for a 2. I’d start Juzang over him. Decent defender that can shoot the lights out. Let Harkless be a junk yard dawg type player off the bench.
 
I'm fine with it. I still think Keyonte has a higher ceiling (at PG, and/or off the ball) but if this is just part of his development arc, so be it. Looks like he'll still get plenty of minutes regardless.

Keyonte's struggles (regression?) this year has me slightly surprised. The lack of improvement in overall efficiency (shooting, especially finishing in the paint/getting to the line) will need to change if he's going to stick, either here or anywhere. That said, he's barely 21, so I'm not ready to make any broad-stroke statements about his long-term potential.

In the meantime, it will be good to see what Collier brings to the table as a starting PG. I still think he projects as a backup PG on a playoff/title contender but might as well give him run and see what we have there.
 
Thee Idiotic Minivan K said:
Never said to bench Sexton I said wait till after he’s traded then just move Collier to the starting 5 in a short week or two.
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Ehhh... do it now and send a message. Good hell... if he's pissed off about it and can't handle the push back then sorry. Its a good message with an easy out in a couple weeks if he plays harder and a move is made. He's rewarding Collier for doing something right here or just trying to find a great combo. Nothing about how Key has played really screams "unbenchable".

Sometimes kids need coddling. Sometimes they need a punishment.
 
Thee Idiotic Minivan K said:
He’s a come off the bench type of guy. If he was 6-5, ya, but he’s small for a 2. I’d start Juzang over him. Decent defender that can shoot the lights out. Let Harkless be a junk yard dawg type player off the bench.
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Harkless's current DBPM would put him in the top 10 of all DBPM. Only other perimeter players with that high of DBPM are Dyson Daniels, Cason Wallace, Kris Dunn, and Amen Thompson. His size is basically irrelevant when compared to Juzang, he plays bigger.
 
KqWIN said:
I think playing with Lauri is best to make him look good, is it really that important for him to play with him to develop?

FWIW, Key is playing better without Lauri on the court this year.
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I don't really know, but I think so. I want him to have enough talent around him that he can learn to get others involved in the offense, but also have enough space to operate and not have too much on his shoulders.
 
bigmike said:
I'm fine with it. I still think Keyonte has a higher ceiling (at PG, and/or off the ball) but if this is just part of his development arc, so be it. Looks like he'll still get plenty of minutes regardless.

Keyonte's struggles (regression?) this year has me slightly surprised. The lack of improvement in overall efficiency (shooting, especially finishing in the paint/getting to the line) will need to change if he's going to stick, either here or anywhere. That said, he's barely 21, so I'm not ready to make any broad-stroke statements about his long-term potential.

In the meantime, it will be good to see what Collier brings to the table as a starting PG. I still think he projects as a backup PG on a playoff/title contender but might as well give him run and see what we have there.
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I think Keyonte has gotten better, but he doesnt play hard. His biggest improvement is his body language.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Harkless's current DBPM would put him in the top 10 of all DBPM. Only other perimeter players with that high of DBPM are Dyson Daniels, Cason Wallace, Kris Dunn, and Amen Thompson. His size is basically irrelevant when compared to Juzang, he plays bigger.
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And yeah, Im super high on Harkless. His playstyle is potentially an ideal 5th man. Elite defense, can shoot, rebounds and plays hard. His G-League stats suggest he's potentially able to do something with the ball in his hands off a tilted defense.

I'll also point out Harkless has looked visibly injured since that hard fall on his *** the other game, and he's still playing great defense. Shouldn't really be prioritizing defensive liabilities on the wing just because they are a couple of inches taller.
 
Keyonte isn't a natural PG. He's better when he plays off the ball and can focus on scoring or simple plays. He's been making real progress in working with Walker in pick-and-roll, but he's too slow at processing to run a fast and free offense. So if you think of him as more of a 2-guard then it's really Sexton who is starting over him. That makes sense given how well Sexton usually plays and that the Jazz are currently shopping him.

I think the future will be Keyonte starting at the 1, but he'll be next to a big guard or wing who initiates the offense. I still see Collier as a backup longer term, although Collier seems to be improving by the day.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
And yeah, Im super high on Harkless. His playstyle is potentially an ideal 5th man. Elite defense, can shoot, rebounds and plays hard. His G-League stats suggest he's potentially able to do something with the ball in his hands off a tilted defense.

I'll also point out Harkless has looked visibly injured since that hard fall on his *** the other game, and he's still playing great defense. Shouldn't really be prioritizing defensive liabilities on the wing just because they are a couple of inches taller.
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Harkless needs to refine how he scores in the NBA vs. the Gleague, but he has the potential to be the new Wesley Matthews.
 
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