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Following potential 2012 draftees

Cyrone Torbin said:
My only problem with Miller is that (at least whenever I watched him) his strength was posting up. He always played better with PJ3 out because it allowed him to operate in the high post, where he has a great post game despite being built like a twig. He seemed to struggle/be passive whenever he was asked to play out on the perimeter.
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Interesting. I've always liked his handles and ability to change direction, though. And he's proved to be decent from beyond the arc.
 
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spycam1 said:
His talent is obvious:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_vQDOs4aho&feature=fvsr

I do think there are issues with his motor/heart/whatever, but I still blame most of his lack of production on:

1. Being a freshman surrounded by talented, more experienced players.
2. Having teammates who seemingly don't want to pass to him.
3. Still recovering from is ACL injury.

Don't get me wrong, whoever drafts him is taking a risk. But his upside is top 5 in this draft. We'll be drafting at 8 or 9, and there's obviously no one available that low who matches his potential, other than PJIII, who doesn't fill a need like Miller. And even though I don't think he'll ever reach his potential, I think he'll be a good player. He's worth the risk, IMO.
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Well, my first thought was comparing his H.S. competition to his NCAA competition - and the effect it had on him. But then I thought about how he was used at Baylor, how Jackson and Walton never passed him the ball, and how when he rarely got a shot attempt it was by posting up. Occasionally he hit a 3 pointer, but mainly he was posting up. In the Jazz offense he'll rarely be posting up. If he can just come off screens and take an open jumper that should help, or if he can move without the ball so someone can find him and he can get an easy bucket he should be in a good position to finish. Ugh, I dunno. I don't want another CJ. But I mean, CJ HAS talent - he does - it just goes to sleep every other play. I don't want another one of those.

Maybe it's 'cause it's a new flavor for me but I am getting kinda sweet on Mitchell. But he's probably not coming out anyway. If he does maybe the Jazz can find a way to get a late first and holy hell we can't be adding all these new young players. I don't know - I'm going to bed.

Thanks for posting. The pro-Miller arguments are sound, and keep me from completely disregarding him. ... ... ... ...
 
Cyrone Torbin said:
My only problem with Miller is that (at least whenever I watched him) his strength was posting up. He always played better with PJ3 out because it allowed him to operate in the high post, where he has a great post game despite being built like a twig. He seemed to struggle/be passive whenever he was asked to play out on the perimeter.
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Oh. I never thought he was particularly good at posting up. I just saw that as about the only way he got any offense.
 
spycam1 said:
His talent is obvious:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_vQDOs4aho&feature=fvsr

I do think there are issues with his motor/heart/whatever, but I still blame most of his lack of production on:

1. Being a freshman surrounded by talented, more experienced players.
2. Having teammates who seemingly don't want to pass to him.
3. Still recovering from is ACL injury.

Don't get me wrong, whoever drafts him is taking a risk. But his upside is top 5 in this draft. We'll be drafting at 8 or 9, and there's obviously no one available that low who matches his potential, other than PJIII, who doesn't fill a need like Miller. And even though I don't think he'll ever reach his potential, I think he'll be a good player. He's worth the risk, IMO.
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Nice work.

I'm liking Kendall Marshall and Quincy Miller. I like the idea of Miller a lot more when playing with a pure PG that could have four real options to pass to and could still learn to pick his spots like Jason Kidd has learned (and it has extended his career and even more so extended and created success for the Mavericks). That's a lot of dots to connect, but... that's where I'm at. Also the most comfortable I've felt all year.

Now, if the Jazz only getting up one pick, then this is subject to substantial change.
 
NUMBERICA said:
Nice work.

I'm liking Kendall Marshall and Quincy Miller. I like the idea of Miller a lot more when playing with a pure PG that could have four real options to pass to and could still learn to pick his spots like Jason Kidd has learned (and it has extended his career and even more so extended and created success for the Mavericks). That's a lot of dots to connect, but... that's where I'm at. Also the most comfortable I've felt all year.

Now, if the Jazz only getting up one pick, then this is subject to substantial change.
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Completely agree. This is why I'm sad that it looks like we'll be in the playoffs...we could have gotten our SF and PG in this draft, but now we'll have to choose one or the other.
 
spycam1 said:
His talent is obvious:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_vQDOs4aho&feature=fvsr

I do think there are issues with his motor/heart/whatever, but I still blame most of his lack of production on:

1. Being a freshman surrounded by talented, more experienced players.
2. Having teammates who seemingly don't want to pass to him.
3. Still recovering from is ACL injury.

Don't get me wrong, whoever drafts him is taking a risk. But his upside is top 5 in this draft. We'll be drafting at 8 or 9, and there's obviously no one available that low who matches his potential, other than PJIII, who doesn't fill a need like Miller. And even though I don't think he'll ever reach his potential, I think he'll be a good player. He's worth the risk, IMO.
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If he can regain that level of athletic ability again id love him,this year he was very slow footed and lacked explosion at all..hopefully he regains it..not that he was ever a freakish athlete but at least average..

His jumper also seemed to disappear that he had in high school..though you can say maybe thats because he stepped up a level in competition or it was not playing for a year..
 
PJKino said:
If he can regain that level of athletic ability again id love him,this year he was very slow footed and lacked explosion at all..hopefully he regains it..not that he was ever a freakish athlete but at least average..

His jumper also seemed to disappear that he had in high school..though you can say maybe thats because he stepped up a level in competition or it was not playing for a year..
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I wouldn't say his jumper disappeared--he was shooting over 40% from 3 half way through the season. He just got fewer and fewer possessions as the season progressed.

As for his athletic ability, I see no reason why he wouldn't return to full form. ACL tears usually take 18-24 months to fully recover from, and since he's so young he should have no issues recovering. He'll be about 18 months removed from his injury come draft time (I believe), so it will be interesting to see how he looks in work outs.
 
A thought on Small Forwards:

You're going to have to be able to hold your ground against anyone as a SF. We're entering an era that will probably demand it. You have to get either a real physical specimen and possibly a hell of a matchup as an offensive player (a player LIKE Durant), or a still rather impressive physical specimen that earns their place on the court mostly because of their defense (in the spectrum of Batum and Battier):

Any team hoping to win an NBA championship in the next five years is almost guaranteed to require beating Kevin Durant AND/or Lebron James. That's taking no other SFs into account. You have to be able to matchup if you're serious about a championship in that window.

Pardon me for being the skeptic (and I feel realist) for not feeling that Gordon Hayward is going to outplay OR outmuscle either of them.
 
NUMBERICA said:
A thought on Small Forwards:

You're going to have to be able to hold your ground against anyone as a SF. We're entering an era that will probably demand it. You have to get either a real physical specimen and possibly a hell of a matchup as an offensive player (a player LIKE Durant), or a still rather impressive physical specimen that earns their place on the court mostly because of their defense (in the spectrum of Batum and Battier):

Any team hoping to win an NBA championship in the next five years is almost guaranteed to require beating Kevin Durant AND/or Lebron James. That's taking no other SFs into account. You have to be able to matchup if you're serious about a championship in that window.

Pardon me for being the skeptic (and I feel realist) for not feeling that Gordon Hayward is going to outplay OR outmuscle either of them.
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This is why MKG is particularly appealing to me. Since we're in the West, it's guaranteed that we will have to go through Durant to get back to the Finals, and MKG is a guy I can actually see frustrating him.

This is another reason why it may be a good idea to draft Miller. Not that he's a great defender, but he could at least make it so we aren't COMPLETELY out matched talent-wise at the SF position when facing the Thunder/Heat.
 
It is funny to be so intertwined into this thread. There have been a lot of names that we just dreamed about. Then came the names that we realistically had a shot at. Then there were some breakout performances that made us all stop and look. At this point we have gone back to the names that we realistically have a shot at and we are trying to re-convince ourselves as to why we should get that player.

For the record, I would still be overjoyed with a Miller/Rivers draft. If we only get one pick (which seems more likely) then either player is fine with me. (Not that anyone cares)
 
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