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Game thread: Game #24 : Utah Jazz at Indiana, Tuesday 02/07/2012 5:00 PM MST

siromar said:
The game was lost because of Corbin's spineless subs to give away the game, and Jefferson for giving away the game. The rest played just fine. It had nothing to do with whatever you said about road games or being tired.
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So 2nd night of back-to-backs and fighting from a huge deficit are complete non-factors?

I agree I didn't like Corbin's subbing. I felt like he left Howard out for far too long when he should have put Bell or Hayward in.
 
The Pacers had more offensive firepower at the PG and wing positions. I think that was the difference in the game.

Jefferson basically matched Hibbert.
Millsap had a pretty good game, as much as you can expect.
Our bench bigs did better than their bench bigs.
Granger and Paul George outplayed our starting wings a bit.
Darren Collison went off for 25 pts. on 10/14 shooting.
Our PGs got outscored 30 - 11.

That's the difference in a 5-pt. loss.

Yes, there are times we should rebound better, but that's what happens when you play Millsap and Jefferson for their offensive capabilities. By and large, our PGs get outscored every night because they simply can't deliver scoring consistently.
 
Gotta bring the effort and focus from the start. Cannot dig huge deficits in any game... But especially on the road since the other team's crowd will be rocking...

And we still need a starting PG. Devin Harris is horrible. I'd much rather have Ronnie Price. At least Price could dunk sometimes and make a good play on defense. They both have about the same range and PG skills/vision.
 
Cyrone Torbin said:
So 2nd night of back-to-backs and fighting from a huge deficit are complete non-factors?

I agree I didn't like Corbin's subbing. I felt like he left Howard out for far too long when he should have put Bell or Hayward in.
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I understand that back-to-back games are often a factor, but you never point out how it was a factor in THIS game. Maybe starters were tired from playing yesterday (if you can call what they did playing), but the Jazz were winning and had the momentum midway through the 4th quarter. As soon as Corbin subbed the whole bench, it was clear that the momentum shifted and that the Jazz were going to lose.
 
On the whole, great effort, liked the comeback, back to backs on the road are tough, especially against a team like the Pacers, so it's hard to get too upset.
 
Jefferson and Millsap can't sustain the energy, defense and rebounding that Kanter and Favors can coming off the bench. They get tired and are under a lot of pressure to score, as they are the most consistent offensive players we have. The Jazz really need another go-to scorer so that there is more balanced effort amongst the players on both ends.
 
I'm really losing my patience with Ty as far as the second unit goes. 1) Stop trying to run low post offense through Favors. Teaching him to play the post is for the offseason. He's death to the offense because once he gets the ball, he's going up with it no matter what the shot clock says; 2) Run more PnR on the second unit. Post Howard more. Even when the 2nd unit played well in the 3/4, they mostly did it with D.
 
Also, we have to start staggering the big men minutes. It's not hard. Kanter/Favors should play, at most, 5 total minutes together per half.
 
As far as the first unit goes, we will always have trouble so long as we have two wings who don't create offense. Hayward can stay, but Bell is murder. I'm tired of watching him make a few jumpshots and pretending that he's doing "his part." We need another wing who can do something out there to take pressure off Al/Sap. I nominate Howard. But it's ridiculous how bad our offense constantly bogs down watching the ball move around on the perimeter by guys who don't want to drive.
 
billyshelby said:
As far as the first unit goes, we will always have trouble so long as we have two wings who don't create offense. Hayward can stay, but Bell is murder. I'm tired of watching him make a few jumpshots and pretending that he's doing "his part." We need another wing who can do something out there to take pressure off Al/Sap. I nominate Howard. But it's ridiculous how bad our offense constantly bogs down watching the ball move around on the perimeter by guys who don't want to drive.
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Guys who don't want to drive AND cannot shoot.

That's a real issue. Hayward and Bell are lucky to nail (any) threes in a game. That's killing us.

The 3 point shot is a real weapon that most teams use. If you were to combine a few strong 3 point shooters with our inside game, you're looking at a very potent offense.

Now we're seeing that even despite Memo's difficulties on defense, why we kept him all those years. Despite Korver being the least athletic player in the league, why he was so important.
 
It's not just 3-ptrs. You saw how effective Collison was by being able to pull up and hit a 20-ft shot at any time. We just don't have that outside shooting ability right now, so the defense backs off, cuts off the passing lanes, collapses on Jefferson and Millsap, and make those two make 1-on-1 moves. Jefferson and Millsap are really good at creating offense for themselves, they're go-to players, but it seems like they have to do all the work on both ends. It's like Harris and our wings can literally take a rest when we're on offense. Then you wonder why Jefferson is late to get to a rebound. It's because he has to score against two or three players on every other possession.
 
The Thriller said:
Guys who don't want to drive AND cannot shoot.

That's a real issue. Hayward and Bell are lucky to nail (any) threes in a game. That's killing us.

The 3 point shot is a real weapon that most teams use. If you were to combine a few strong 3 point shooters with our inside game, you're looking at a very potent offense.

Now we're seeing that even despite Memo's difficulties on defense, why we kept him all those years. Despite Korver being the least athletic player in the league, why he was so important.
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I agree
I think Korver would be our starter if he were still with this team and we would be a better team. If he fed the ball to our bigs no one would leave him to double team. This team needs some one to keep defense honest and spread the floor so bad right now. One reason we are playing worse is because teams are packing it in and leaving the 3 ball line open.
 
Chris Paul killed us in the LAC game. Monta and Steph Curry killed us in the GSW game. Jeremy freaking Lin killed us in the Knicks game. Darren Collison hurt us tonight. Our PG has to be able to score and put pressure on the defense in order to compete in this league. Otherwise we're playing 4 on 5 every night. The Jazz are like -15 every night at the PG position and are probably -5 or -10 at the SG position. It puts an awful lot of pressure on Millsap and Jefferson to outplay the other teams' front court, not by a little, but by a lot.
 
Our inability to hit 3's is not what's killing us. What's killing us is wings who can't create offense. What's killing us is a PG who likes to take early clock jumpers. The offensive sets are pretty familiar -- guys pass the ball around all over the place, nothing happens, and then Al gets the ball. We break that up by running a few PnR's every now and then, and in the 1st we did get a few transition buckets. But without a backcourt that can or will press a defense, we're stuck with dumping down low and living post to post.
 
billyshelby said:
Our inability to hit 3's is not what's killing us. What's killing us is wings who can't create offense. What's killing us is a PG who likes to take early clock jumpers. The offensive sets are pretty familiar -- guys pass the ball around all over the place, nothing happens, and then Al gets the ball. We break that up by running a few PnR's every now and then, and in the 1st we did get a few transition buckets. But without a backcourt that can or will press a defense, we're stuck with dumping down low and living post to post.
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Right. I'm not even opposed to a guard taking a jumper 5 or 10 seconds into the shot clock. It's a question of whether that guard can make the jumper. The Jazz just don't seem to have that weapon right now.
 
Big Al failing is not a bad thing. Do we really want someone blocking Kanter next year?
Either Sap, or Big Al has to go.

To me it's looking more and more like Sap, and Kanter should be our starters.
 
I really thought they'd pull it off. But after they got up by three and the immediately gave up an And 1 it was like watching crushing doom...damn near made me cry.
 
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