Gun control a comparison US vs Russia

[Stoked]

How about requiring a GPS locator chip embedded in all new weapons, somewhere in the metal so it cannot be removed without destroying the functionality of the gun, like the one we had put in our dog that has now found her twice? Doable, passes the cost along to the consumer, can be use to monitor weapons in general or track known weapons or do location sweeps of felons who are not allowed to possess weapons. Idk, just a though. There is lots of opportunity to abuse this of course, but it might be a starting point.

Could also make far stricter consequences for people who use guns in crime, such as mandatory prison sentences with no opportunity for parole for at least 15 years or similar (pretty sure there is already something similar in some states, tltg) Or let's make a registry like the sex offender registry for people who commit crimes using guns.

The toughest thing about policing all of this is the sheer number of weapons already out there, which makes it nearly impossible to establish any course of action like this, unless we want to use martial law to round them all up, then we are justifying using them the way the founding fathers thought we might need to in the first place.

For that to really mean something you need to change prison. No more cable tv, much more work. You are their as punishment and it should be harsh and difficult. It should make you never want to go back. Tent city AZ...

 

[LogGrad98]

For that to really mean something you need to change prison. No more cable tv, much more work. You are their as punishment and it should be harsh and difficult. It should make you never want to go back. Tent city AZ...

Well I agree with this regardless of the gun control situation. Prison should not be a resort in any way shape or form. I like the idea of prisons providing for things like education and personal development, but get rid of the gym equipment, cable or sat tv, movies, games, anything like that. They can read all they want, maybe even offer classes to get a GED or help get a degree, and counseling should be available in some way, but that should be about it. Let them participate in activities that might help them re-enter society in a meaningful way, not just as a hulk with prison tats and connections.

 

[Stoked]

Well I agree with this regardless of the gun control situation. Prison should not be a resort in any way shape or form. I like the idea of prisons providing for things like education and personal development, but get rid of the gym equipment, cable or sat tv, movies, games, anything like that. They can read all they want, maybe even offer classes to get a GED or help get a degree, and counseling should be available in some way, but that should be about it. Let them participate in activities that might help them re-enter society in a meaningful way, not just as a hulk with prison tats and connections.

I completely agree.

 

[♪alt13]

Well I agree with this regardless of the gun control situation. Prison should not be a resort in any way shape or form. I like the idea of prisons providing for things like education and personal development, but get rid of the gym equipment, cable or sat tv, movies, games, anything like that. They can read all they want, maybe even offer classes to get a GED or help get a degree, and counseling should be available in some way, but that should be about it. Let them participate in activities that might help them re-enter society in a meaningful way, not just as a hulk with prison tats and connections.

I think we put too many different types of offenders into one system. I find it disturbing that the person that kicks a dog, the person that commits a sexual assualt, and the person that sells pot all get labeled a felon.

We should create a pariah class of crimes above and beyond felony these people belong in a punitive prison.

I do think that the remainder of felons in our system(the ones that haven't committed unpardonable crimes)have just made a series of poor decisions that have had a negative impact on their character. These people belong in a corrections facility.

 

[LogGrad98]

I think we put too many different types of offenders into one system. I find it disturbing that the person that kicks a dog, the person that commits a sexual assualt, and the person that sells pot all get labeled a felon.

We should create a pariah class of crimes above and beyond felony these people belong in a punitive prison.

I do think that the remainder of felons in our system(the ones that haven't committed unpardonable crimes)have just made a series of poor decisions that have had a negative impact on their character. These people belong in a corrections facility.

I like the idea. The cost is a huge hurdle. Maybe we could make it a graduation system. Perform certain things and you can cut time off your sentence, and you get more privileges. The sentencing can be the same, but if you are a rapist you have to do more "stuff" to become eligible for parole than if you got in a bar fight or were caught with some doobage, or to get to watch TV or play video games, or use gym equipment, etc. And the amount of time a sentence can be reduced would be determined by what you do to improve. Complete your GED could cut 2 years off a 5 year sentence, or 5 off a 15, or something like that. Complete counseling or learn a trade gets more of a reduction to a predetermined minimum (cannot go below 2 years for a felony, for example, or cannot go below 50% of the original sentence to account for harder crimes). Something like that may be workable and the people who don't want to put in the effort just spend their allotted time.

 

[moevillini]

Seems to me that part of the problem in the whole gun rights/gun ownership debate is that gun owners and advocates for gun ownership are the only ones who would have to give something up if stricter ownership laws were in effect - this is not something that can easily be turned into a "quid pro quo" situation where each side gives up a little bit of what they want to get to a compromise.

I guess that's true about a lot of the intractable issues in our society. I think it's easier to take steps to try to find a compromise position if each side has a little something to lose. Or maybe I'm just talking nonsense.

 

[♪alt13]

I like the idea. The cost is a huge hurdle. Maybe we could make it a graduation system. Perform certain things and you can cut time off your sentence, and you get more privileges. The sentencing can be the same, but if you are a rapist you have to do more "stuff" to become eligible for parole than if you got in a bar fight or were caught with some doobage, or to get to watch TV or play video games, or use gym equipment, etc. And the amount of time a sentence can be reduced would be determined by what you do to improve. Complete your GED could cut 2 years off a 5 year sentence, or 5 off a 15, or something like that. Complete counseling or learn a trade gets more of a reduction to a predetermined minimum (cannot go below 2 years for a felony, for example, or cannot go below 50% of the original sentence to account for harder crimes). Something like that may be workable and the people who don't want to put in the effort just spend their allotted time.

If we overhauled the entire criminal justice system overnight then yes it would be costly. I suggest(to start) we simply create this class of crimes. The only cost would be to tradition. We all recognize that there are more than six degrees of crime and that there are definitely more than three degrees that deserve prison time. We would give judges, juries, prosecutors, and most importantly legislators more options.
I first thought that this would be a good idea when the Utah state legislature enhanced animal cruelty to a class 3 felony. From one perspective animal cruelty is definitely worse than having an ounce of marijuana(class A misdemeanor) but from another it is definitely not as bad as aggravated assault(level 3 felony).

 

[Stoked]

If we overhauled the entire criminal justice system overnight then yes it would be costly. I suggest(to start) we simply create this class of crimes. The only cost would be to tradition. We all recognize that there are more than six degrees of crime and that there are definitely more than three degrees that deserve prison time. We would give judges, juries, prosecutors, and most importantly legislators more options.
I first thought that this would be a good idea when the Utah state legislature enhanced animal cruelty to a class 3 felony. From one perspective animal cruelty is definitely worse than having an ounce of marijuana(class A misdemeanor) but from another it is definitely not as bad as aggravated assault(level 3 felony).

Depends on the case. If it is severe enough than yeah I can consider them the same.

 

[♪alt13]

Depends on the case. If it is severe enough than yeah I can consider them the same.

Irregardless of my examples, do you think our criminal classification system is adequate to distinguish between all the possible crimes.
Colorado for instance has 6 levels of felonies.

 

[Stoked]

Irregardless of my examples, do you think our criminal classification system is adequate to distinguish between all the possible crimes.
Colorado for instance has 6 levels of felonies.

No. Another reason I do not like mandatory sentencing. I do believe that Judges should be reviewed by a council and if found to render heinous judgements they can be disbarred. (such as that Montana (?) judge that gave a teacher 30 days for hooking up with a 14 year old student)

 

[LogGrad98]

No. Another reason I do not like mandatory sentencing. I do believe that Judges should be reviewed by a council and if found to render heinous judgements they can be disbarred. (such as that Montana (?) judge that gave a teacher 30 days for hooking up with a 14 year old student)

I thought the age of consent in montana is 12. Either way that is insane. A week of probation would have been plenty. Unless it was a guy teacher and a girl student in which case it should have been life in prison and mandatory blunt trauma castration at a minimum.

 

[LogGrad98]

If we overhauled the entire criminal justice system overnight then yes it would be costly. I suggest(to start) we simply create this class of crimes. The only cost would be to tradition. We all recognize that there are more than six degrees of crime and that there are definitely more than three degrees that deserve prison time. We would give judges, juries, prosecutors, and most importantly legislators more options.
I first thought that this would be a good idea when the Utah state legislature enhanced animal cruelty to a class 3 felony. From one perspective animal cruelty is definitely worse than having an ounce of marijuana(class A misdemeanor) but from another it is definitely not as bad as aggravated assault(level 3 felony).

Depends on the case. If it is severe enough than yeah I can consider them the same.

This is the other big challenge, getting people to agree on the legislation and which crimes are worse than others.