Hayward awarded for his defense

[Darkwing Duck]

Got any actual evidence? Since you don't like defense stats since you've used none so far, describe what percentage of the 2552 minutes Afflalo played and how they compared to whatever percent of the 2187 minutes McLemore played this year.

 

[Game6Conley]

Got any actual evidence? Since you don't like defense stats since you've used none so far, describe what percentage of the 2552 minutes Afflalo played and how they compared to whatever percent of the 2187 minutes McLemore played this year.

Since when did Real Plus-Minus and PER not take into account some defensive statistics? why are you trying to imply that I'm avoiding these awful points your making in defense of Ben McLemore?

The context that Afflalo was brought up in was not about his defense, it was about him being one of the 5 worst rotation players in the league, which is preposterous. You've attempted to focus solely on defense to serve your argument, as anything related to offense clearly separates AA from the 5 worst rotation players in the league.

But continue on. Humor me;

state your case that McLemore is a superior defender, if its so obvious I'm sure you can throw together a few paragraphs or a bulleted list. Bring all the evidence you can find.

 

[Game6Conley]

describe what percentage of the 2552 minutes Afflalo played and how they compared to whatever percent of the 2187 minutes McLemore played this year.

sure, ill repeat myself if you didnt catch it the first time.

Afflalo was worse than Ben McLemore? whos offensive win shares were a negative number, and scored 8.8 points on 8.3 shots 37% from the field 32% from 3, Ast/TO ratio below 1 in the same type of minutes as Harkless and Aminu.

18.2 ppg, 3.6 rebs, 3.4 assists, .5 stl, 1.7 to's on 46% from the field, and 43% from 3 on 4.1 attempts are the stats of a bottom five rotation player in the NBA?

 

[Darkwing Duck]

And his defense stats cancel out all those offensive stats.

 

[Game6Conley]

And his defense stats cancel out all those offensive stats.

So in your estimation, McLemores vastly superior defense outweighs both his own offensive limitations, and the proficiency of Afflalo's offense when comparing their worth as rotation players?

 

[Darkwing Duck]

So in your estimation, McLemores vastly superior defense outweighs both his own offensive limitations, and the proficiency of Afflalo's offense when comparing their worth as rotation players?

That's what the stats show.

Not that I actually really care one way or the other. When you actually look at the stats and how one's team plays with the player on and off the court, it's at least reasonable to make the argument that Afflalo was one of the worst 5 wings in the league.

 

[Game6Conley]

That's what the stats show.

Not that I actually really care one way or the other. When you actually look at the stats and how one's team plays with the player on and off the court, it's at least reasonable to make the argument that Afflalo was one of the worst 5 wings in the league.

What stats show hes a vastly superior defender, where are they? wtf are you looking at. im calling total bs, your making this **** up. your claims are totally unsubstantiated

post Afflalo's stats next to McLemores.

then make a big deal about a bunch of marginal differences, thats basically what your argument boils down to.

Im ashamed to see an Earthbound related sig attatched to this argument.

Their defensive ratings were exactly the same last season, 112. wheres the great divide in defense you speak of? Ben McLemores steal% was a whopping 1% his block% was 0.7

 

[Darkwing Duck]

Afflalo's -6 defensive on/off split was probably the worst in the league. McLemore was -3. Terrible, but not catastrophic. In comparison, Afflalo was slightly positive offensively on/off, while McLemore was -2.5. Both end around -5 and change.

 

[Game6Conley]

Afflalo's -6 defensive on/off split was probably the worst in the league. McLemore was -3. Terrible, but not catastrophic. In comparison, Afflalo was slightly positive offensively on/off, while McLemore was -2.5. Both end around -5 and change.

and that pivotal indicator is your great divide, its not all that much, like i said its marginal, McLemore cant be a vastly better defender if hes bad too, sorry bud that doesn't work.

so your argument is now one of a kid claiming to be the skinniest at fatcamp. which doesnt work because afflalo is considerably more efficient on offense.

if you think the marginal difference in that one stat out weighs all the other evidence, then thats on you, its not enough to disprove all the similar defensive statistics that are bad. do you have any other evidence or is on/off the one stat youve got?

most advanced metrics on defense show that they are similarly bad? no?

where else is the separation defensively, to me theres multiple areas of Afflalo's offense that are much better than McLemore, and ill detail those soon, but i cant let you off the hook with 1 stat, theres too many defensive metrics that are near identical.

 

[Game6Conley]

even the stat you use proves part of my point, Mclemore was a net negative on both ends of the floor... Afflalo is atleast contributing positively on offense(on an awful offensive team). dont give me the Afflalo's bottom of the league bs, they are both near the bottom of the league on many defensive metrics.

McLemore is close to the bottom of the league in FG% and 3pt% also. you discount those stats.. how?

Arron Afflalo was 8th in the league in 3pt %. that difference is not marginal.

 

[zman1527]

This part was interesting too:

Richard Jefferson was a much worse wing player for Utah this season, in every way. Heck, Jefferson probably was one of the four or five worst rotation players in the league this season.

Didn't he start every game? Ah, Ty had such a eye for talent, eh?

 

[MVP]

https://www.82games.com/1314/ROLRTG8.HTM

Based on this McLemore was absolutely worst player in NBA last season. Even worse than Kanter.

 

[fishonjazz]

This part was interesting too:



Didn't he start every game? Ah, Ty had such a eye for talent, eh?

I remember raja bell was one of the worst players in the entire league during his last stint with the jazz.

For corbin, if you were old enough then it didnt matter how bad you suck

 

[MVP]

I remember raja bell was one of the worst players in the entire league during his last stint with the jazz.

For corbin, if you were old enough then it didnt matter how bad you suck

Same with J.Howard. He screwed so badly playing him right after knee surgery in playoffs, that was such a disaster chucking/matador defense display by him and yet Corbin did not had it in him not to play him.

 

[franklin]

Typical Utah apologists coming out to support the white guy by blaming his obvious-to-everyone-else defensive deficiencies on the black coach.