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Is Joe Johnson off the Jazz Tradable Assets List?

Saint Cy of JFC said:
They own NYC and Brooklyn 2nd round picks this year. Those will both certainly be top 40. Does that not make you pause at all?
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Not even for a second. The Jazz aren't tanking, and should be doing their best to acquire talent. JJ is easily one of the top 8/9 players on the roster, and thus would get significant minutes in a playoff rotation. No way I give him up for 2nd round picks unless he asks me to. I'd even prefer to keep him beyond this season if the price is right.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
And Philly has a handful of great 2nd round picks, they are better than low level assets


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Saint Cy of JFC said:
Is going to Philly where they have a shot of being very good in a weak conference getting shafted?

JJ came to Utah in a similar position as to what Philly is currently in. If JJ does enjoy the mentor role then he would love going to Philly.

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How are the 2nd rounders gonna be good ones if Philly is very good in a weak east? Philly being good makes the picks bad right?

Edit: you explained that they have ny, and bk picks.
 
Cy, you're underestimating the team chemistry component, which I strongly believe it can win you a few games every season.
 
I will reiterate my position here because it is the correct one... there are three situations in which JJ could be traded... 1 we need his salary in a bigger deal like a kevin love trade. 2 it looks like we have no shot at the playoffs by the trade deadline. 3 he requests out to a contender.

The scenario where we are in the playoff hunt and trade a valuable rotation player for a couple seconds is dumb. I also doubt philly or another team with valuable seconds would give them up for a half season rental.

So unless we suffer a serious injury before the all star break or make a major trade we will have JJ.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Joe Johnson isnt on the team past this year.... If you can get value for him, you do it.
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JJ isn't on the team past this year because two years is how long the Jazz wanted him. He's filling a gap during our development. Things might have changed because of Wayward leaving but I think JJ still fills the role we wanted. If the Jazz wanted him for two years and didn't expect to have him longer then I'm sure they're not worried about trying to get some 2nd round pick for him. If they can get something big by including him in a trade that's fine. If they trade just JJ and only get a 2nd for him then that makes no sense.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
I will reiterate my position here because it is the correct one... there are three situations in which JJ could be traded... 1 we need his salary in a bigger deal like a kevin love trade. 2 it looks like we have no shot at the playoffs by the trade deadline. 3 he requests out to a contender.

The scenario where we are in the playoff hunt and trade a valuable rotation player for a couple seconds is dumb. I also doubt philly or another team with valuable seconds would give them up for a half season rental.

So unless we suffer a serious injury before the all star break or make a major trade we will have JJ.
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If we are on the outside looking in of the playoff hunt does that change your mind? Like we are a few games out of the 8th seed and the 7th seed is a few games ahead of the 8th seed, so we are basically fighting for a likely 8th seed and 4 game sweep to the Warriors. Would you prefer to make the playoffs then or lean heavily on the young players instead and get a lottery pick (or possibly also make the playoffs)?

Also, I'm confused how it could be dumb for us to trade JJ to Philly for the Brooklyn and NYC 2nd rounders, but it's also dumb for Philly to do it. Both teams kind of have the same ceiling and floor (that's probably wrong, Philly's floor is much lower if Embiid gets injured, like he has shown a propensity to do) of being a possible 5 seed or fighting to get to the 7th/8th seed. Further, Philly is going to have a maximum of 6 draft picks next year, so them dealing a handful of 2nd rounders just to help them make the playoffs for the first time in ages isnt out of the question. Hinky would never do it, but Colangelo might.
 
JJ is also on this team for just 2 years because of finances. If Utah keeps Hood and Exum, there may not be enough dollars to keep him. Then again, if Favs leaves, maybe JJ comes back for less money...if DL can't find a good replacement for Favors. It really makes no sense to go into the luxury tax.

As for a trade, I'd leave it up to JJ. If he wants to go to a contender, you grant his wish. But I doubt a contender would give up their first. So that means a late 2nd.

Of course, you'd trade him in a package for a starting PF or SF.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
If we are on the outside looking in of the playoff hunt does that change your mind? Like we are a few games out of the 8th seed and the 7th seed is a few games ahead of the 8th seed, so we are basically fighting for a likely 8th seed and 4 game sweep to the Warriors. Would you prefer to make the playoffs then or lean heavily on the young players instead and get a lottery pick (or possibly also make the playoffs)?

Also, I'm confused how it could be dumb for us to trade JJ to Philly for the Brooklyn and NYC 2nd rounders, but it's also dumb for Philly to do it. Both teams kind of have the same ceiling and floor (that's probably wrong, Philly's floor is much lower if Embiid gets injured, like he has shown a propensity to do) of being a possible 5 seed or fighting to get to the 7th/8th seed. Further, Philly is going to have a maximum of 6 draft picks next year, so them dealing a handful of 2nd rounders just to help them make the playoffs for the first time in ages isnt out of the question. Hinky would never do it, but Colangelo might.
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If we are 2 or 3 games out at the much earlier trade deadline throwing in the towel won't happen. We'd have to be 2 or 3 games out with a key injury that won't let us make up those games to persuade us.

Philly has Covington, saric, Simmons as guys that play the combo forward role... if healthy why clutter it with JJ. They don't need the playoffs for progress.

Some trades can be dumb for both teams. I think we'd be dumb to get a couple seconds for a key contributor if we are a fringe team. Gobert is ants to win now so we neuter the team and piss him off for a couple seconds? JJ is important for us as he's one of our few guys who can just go get a bucket and because he can play the stretch 4. I don't know if that is a need philly has but we sure do. I also think we could use the playoff cash money to buy a second rounder. They are available every year for purchase.

It just seems like a stretch to say we should do it... I think it's doubtful he is moved unless one of the scenarios from my earlier post hit.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
If we are 2 or 3 games out at the much earlier trade deadline throwing in the towel won't happen. We'd have to be 2 or 3 games out with a key injury that won't let us make up those games to persuade us.

Philly has Covington, saric, Simmons as guys that play the combo forward role... if healthy why clutter it with JJ. They don't need the playoffs for progress.

Some trades can be dumb for both teams. I think we'd be dumb to get a couple seconds for a key contributor if we are a fringe team. Gobert is ants to win now so we neuter the team and piss him off for a couple seconds? JJ is important for us as he's one of our few guys who can just go get a bucket and because he can play the stretch 4. I don't know if that is a need philly has but we sure do. I also think we could use the playoff cash money to buy a second rounder. They are available every year for purchase.

It just seems like a stretch to say we should do it... I think it's doubtful he is moved unless one of the scenarios from my earlier post hit.
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1. I dont think JJ being traded means the Jazz are throwing in any sort of towel (Hell it could mean Favors is playing so well that minutes for JJ are hard to find)
2. I get what you are saying on the Philly having enough combo-ish forwards thing, but they really only have 1 SF and none of them approach JJ's shooting level.
3. I would disagree on the Sixers not needing the playoffs for progress (or at least it's very obvious that is not management's feeling, which is more important than what you or I think they should do). They didnt pay JJ Redick a 1 year 22 million dollar deal to not make the playoffs.


If they got JJ they could have their best lineup be:

Fultz
Redick
Johnson
Simmons
Embiid

Or if they needed more defense they could play Covington at the 2. Or if they wanted to be smaller they could slide Simmons to center and play Johnson at the 4. Johnson would give them versatility while maintaining shooting on the court which they don't have with their other players.

Johnson could play the exact same role for them as he does us and he would have the same kind of intangible benefit that so many people around here seem to value so highly.

I think Johnson would benefit the Sixers more at this point because they are a team that really needs the veteran presence more than the Jazz, as our core has now grown to be veterans themselves. And as I said, they have 6 picks this year (potentially if they convey the Laker's pick) and I think 6 again next year. They, unlike us, have a huge draft asset pool that need to start using to bring success to their team.
 
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