Jazz Offseason Plan

[Handlogten's Heros]

It kind of sucks but is this the general feeling of most at this point? I'm not sure this is the front office or ownerships approach, I really do think they'd like him here much longer than that, but the conversation of what to do with the roster changes a lot if the feeling is he's leaving in 2 years regardless.

I don’t think it’s even a front office blame thing... I think it’s just an NBA problem. Unless the stars are gathering in your market then they are likely not staying here longer than you have team control. The situation here has to be so good that it’s a no brainer... even then sometimes it doesn’t work out.

 

[NUMBERICA]

It’s kind of a tough article to read... especially for those of us that see the obvious mistakes... state the mistakes they are making and then get called armchair GMs by the “lolz guis”.

They didn’t push for Batum. Something they regret. Pretty damn obvious we needed a wing... pretty damn obvious he would have been a good candidate if motivated... we also had the BAE which is not much more than the minimum but we had it available... now we aren’t sure of the Taxpayer MLE is enough (it likely is not enough as LA likely rolls it out to retain him). Tony says the front office shouldn’t be blamed for not pursuing him... I guess we are to blame? Maybe Obama? No reason was stated.

So the DL “is a lazy *** who is not aggressive or proactive” crowd gets a point.

Then he talks about how we need a point guard this season to help with wear and tear on Mike and Joe. Says they “unwittingly” burned Joe out in March and April playing him so many minutes at point guard. It’s crazy that the coaching staff and front office did this “unwittingly” when this board full of degenerates, morons, and mouf breathers very “wittingly” said this was a problem.

It really just sucks that we had a lot of the big stuff in place... we needed to do a few more obvious things and not make obvious mistakes and our season could have been extended. No idea if it means a title but we didn’t give ourselves the best shot we could and it wasn’t close. I think this is like the third or fourth time in the DL era that they didn’t fill obvious holes/needs and then regret it and the media is like “can’t blame them... how could they have known these obvious things would obviously happen... ain’t their fault”.

If there's a term for when a journalist's single priority is to make sure they don't embarrass the people they are covering because those people are their sources, Tony Jones would be the picture in the wikipedia page. The dude is a shill of the highest order.

Anyway, yeah. The Batum thing... ****. Can any of the prognosticators that were saying 'he'd be the 9th guy, he'd be supplanting Niang - a guy who is probably not an NBA player when the moment matters. Even a cooked Batum would be better, but I basically guarantee he isn't. He's demonstrated that his situation matters greatly to him and it reflects in his play,' get a voice, even a teeny tiny one? The more glimpses we get to observe how the sausage is made in FOs, the more I'm convinced they're just some lucky people.

So now they're going to prioritize getting Batum now that he will be several times more expensive, will likely require multiple years that he wouldn't have last year, and which will be yet another roadblock on developing anybody that might be worth a **** that they get in the draft (though I suspect that the Jazz trade out or down to get off Favors' deal that not-at-all coincidentally features many of the same drawbacks as would Batum's hypothetical deal).

If I was Donovan, I'd be biding my time here.

 

[Jazzbot]

Well the other problem with waiting a year is that Conley would be another year older (and likely another year of missing playoff games since it seems pretty clear his hamstring condition is degenerative) which might make his contract negative-value, Bojan would be an expiring, and again, another year to add and develop talent would be lost. I hope they understand that they're gambling the longer they wait (again, assuming they really think they have a chance at retaining Donovan).

If they basically just double-down, the next-most sensible thing is to aggressively blow up the team in 2.5 years.

I'm sorry, y'all, this years playoffs confirmed every concern I had in dramatic fashion and I just don't see this build getting there and I think is just ****ing around.

I think they're currently playing with the fire of "do we dare take a slight step back and Donovan possibly asks for a trade next offseason" and "staying good while trying to totally pivot at some point to try and convince him to stay". It's a difficult situation, and the real problem is, we were too good too soon with Donovan, and its created a situation where we may be stuck in the same spot, or start declining right as you need to convince him to stay. So long as Donovan (and Rudy for the most part) are on the roster the Jazz are going to be a solid team, but solid isn't going to be good enough.

 

[Elizah Huge]

It’s kind of a tough article to read... especially for those of us that see the obvious mistakes... state the mistakes they are making and then get called armchair GMs by the “lolz guis”.

They didn’t push for Batum. Something they regret. Pretty damn obvious we needed a wing... pretty damn obvious he would have been a good candidate if motivated... we also had the BAE which is not much more than the minimum but we had it available... now we aren’t sure of the Taxpayer MLE is enough (it likely is not enough as LA likely rolls it out to retain him). Tony says the front office shouldn’t be blamed for not pursuing him... I guess we are to blame? Maybe Obama? No reason was stated.

So the DL “is a lazy *** who is not aggressive or proactive” crowd gets a point.

Then he talks about how we need a point guard this season to help with wear and tear on Mike and Joe. Says they “unwittingly” burned Joe out in March and April playing him so many minutes at point guard. It’s crazy that the coaching staff and front office did this “unwittingly” when this board full of degenerates, morons, and mouf breathers very “wittingly” said this was a problem.

It really just sucks that we had a lot of the big stuff in place... we needed to do a few more obvious things and not make obvious mistakes and our season could have been extended. No idea if it means a title but we didn’t give ourselves the best shot we could and it wasn’t close. I think this is like the third or fourth time in the DL era that they didn’t fill obvious holes/needs and then regret it and the media is like “can’t blame them... how could they have known these obvious things would obviously happen... ain’t their fault”.

Lolz DL is a professional. Why aren’t you working for the Jazz then genius? You really think professionals like them messed up the cap math? Lolz Batum is washed along with Craig and Tucker. You are obsessed with washed players. Lolz bunch of JF posters correctly predicting problems and issues think they’re smarter than DL.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Well the other problem with waiting a year is that Conley would be another year older (and likely another year of missing playoff games since it seems pretty clear his hamstring condition is degenerative) which might make his contract negative-value, Bojan would be an expiring, and again, another year to add and develop talent would be lost. I hope they understand that they're gambling the longer they wait (again, assuming they really think they have a chance at retaining Donovan).

If they basically just double-down, the next-most sensible thing is to aggressively blow up the team in 2.5 years.

I'm sorry, y'all, this years playoffs confirmed every concern I had in dramatic fashion and I just don't see this build getting there and I think is just ****ing around.

The other option is the go all the way the **** in. This is the dangerous option but it’s the option that gets us the youth and players we need...

What this looks like... Favs and a 2024 1st (unprotected... start with top 10 and negotiate down to close the deal) for Lu Dort and Kenrich Williams. Saves some money and gets you cheap athletic production and Lu is under team control... so if he develops into something more he’s restricted... we’d have some salary freeing up then. Add a pick swap in 2025 if that closes the deal. Presti has a thousand picks but he knows he needs to tank one more year. Lu has great value because he is so cheap and productive... something they don’t get the full benefit of because their cap space is only used as dumping grounds.

Getting vets will help but long term Donovan is looking around and no on is really on his timeline. Lu is... pray you nail the puck this year... then maybe you are in bizness.

 

[NUMBERICA]

I think the Clips offer him the same amount and he stays. Unless he hates them for some reason... it seems like he was happy there cuz he played his *** off.

The good news is maybe we offer him more, so he comes here and suddenly becomes the Charlotte version because it's not as fun for an NBA player to live in Utah than to live in LA.

 

[Jazzbot]

I don’t think it’s even a front office blame thing... I think it’s just an NBA problem. Unless the stars are gathering in your market then they are likely not staying here longer than you have team control. The situation here has to be so good that it’s a no brainer... even then sometimes it doesn’t work out.

It just sucks, because if you knew he would stay for a bit longer and give you like a 4-5 year window, I think they could successfully pivot and break through. But the 2-3 year window is just not enough given the market. It's why Dame or Giannis is exactly the type of star you have to have to make a lot of the moves necessary. Now Portland didn't do enough for Dame, and the Bucks are finally reaping the benefits of going all in. If you were the front office and knew Donovan would be a bit patient you could do what's necessary to give him a roster that fits him better and probably break through and he's plenty a good enough number 1 you would have a legitimate chance, I'm just not sure that's the feeling around the organization or if they feel confident enough in Donovan's commitment to the organization to just put every asset you have out there and go all in on a pivot around him. I think they want to keep him pretty bad, but I don't think Donovan's given any real indication he's "loyal".

 

[NUMBERICA]

The other option is the go all the way the **** in. This is the dangerous option but it’s the option that gets us the youth and players we need...

What this looks like... Favs and a 2024 1st (unprotected... start with top 10 and negotiate down to close the deal) for Lu Dort and Kenrich Williams. Saves some money and gets you cheap athletic production and Lu is under team control... so if he develops into something more he’s restricted... we’d have some salary freeing up then. Add a pick swap in 2025 if that closes the deal. Presti has a thousand picks but he knows he needs to tank one more year. Lu has great value because he is so cheap and productive... something they don’t get the full benefit of because their cap space is only used as dumping grounds.

Getting vets will help but long term Donovan is looking around and no on is really on his timeline. Lu is... pray you nail the puck this year... then maybe you are in bizness.

For any of the clowns in the FO that trawl this board for ideas, plz try this one.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

If there's a term for when a journalist's single priority is to make sure they don't embarrass the people they are covering because those people are their sources, Tony Jones would be the picture in the wikipedia page. The dude is a shill of the highest order.

Anyway, yeah. The Batum thing... ****. Can any of the prognosticators that were saying 'he'd be the 9th guy, he'd be supplanting Niang - a guy who is probably not an NBA player when the moment matters. Even a cooked Batum would be better, but I basically guarantee he isn't. He's demonstrated that his situation matters greatly to him and it reflects in his play,' get a voice, even a teeny tiny one? The more glimpses we get to observe how the sausage is made in FOs, the more I'm convinced they're just some lucky people.

So now they're going to prioritize getting Batum now that he will be several times more expensive, will likely require multiple years that he wouldn't have last year, and which will be yet another roadblock on developing anybody that might be worth a **** that they get in the draft (though I suspect that the Jazz trade out or down to get off Favors' deal that not-at-all coincidentally features many of the same drawbacks as would Batum's hypothetical deal).

If I was Donovan, I'd be biding my time here.

It’s so funny... professionals should be able to project what the needs will be and add protections against those needs. It’s easy to say after the fact... yeah that guy is good. Batum in Charlotte was not motivated... they told him he was out of the rotation... he wasn’t old but that guy gonna look washed when that’s how you treat him.

Even if they didn’t get Batum... Craig, Bazemore types were out there. Even if you feel you needed a backup 5 there were some options like Jamychal Green that could be really beneficial (and we cheaper) than blowing the whole wad on Favs. Especially when you had to know a money crunch was coming.

Pros see this stuff before it happens... not react to a ****** situation after the fact... and when they throw they hands up like “well what can we do now this bed is made” wellllll who made the bed?

 

[homeytennis]

It makes you wonder who and what were driving things personnel wise. I thought the team was going to the extreme to avoid the luxury tax. with all the bizarre roster moves paying teams to take players off the Jazz hands. Then there was the cutting of NWG. I cheered it at the time but thought the timing was weird given his sterling play in the preseason. There was some fallout from the Gonzaga community including a prominent Jazz alum and then NWG's subsequent play in Europe. I'm thinking maybe Quin wasn't the guy that jettisoned him along with the waiving of Jeff Green. If things were as toxic between Quin and DL as has been written, nothing would surprise me.

 

[NUMBERICA]

I think Rudy ends up on the block before season ends. Not in a we need to trade him mode, but almost a Melo Deron situation with him and Simmons maybe. We see what they uncover in their effort to trade him and maybe see something that works for us. Nothing good pops up and we will wait and see what happens. If he was trade eligible I think we’d be looking.

You sign Conley, hopefully find a good use for taxpayer MLE, look to save some money on Favs or maybe JC and Bojan... see how it looks and if it looks bad you move Mike or Rudy and part of that deal is you’d be trying to cut 10M or so from the budget. I didn’t see Ryan going 60M into the tax for a 2nd round exit. Tax is determined by end of year salary so you can get a look before you decide to slash the budget.

Yeah, most of this is more-or-less where I've landed. I'm just squirming in my seat cuz this team is obviously not that close. If they couldn't close the deal in the most open path to the Larry O'Brien Trophy probably ever, why would basically the same team BUT A YEAR OLDER get any closer in a more-crowded field?

It's fine. It's fine.

 

[oneye]

Mike is getting older, at the same time, CP3 is older, has had a lot of injury issues and at age 36 has looked great this year. It’s very possible Mike will be fine over the next few years, but he’s for sure getting to a point it’s questionable.