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My take on what the Jazz should do this season & in the future

karl malone

Well-Known Member
First & foremost, thank you to all of those who provide information & insight in the seemingly never-ending (but hopefully soon-ending) conversation on how to get the Utah Jazz that elusive, first NBA championship. Also, I apologize in advance for the length of this post.

As everyone on this site knows, the Jazz have assembled one of the best collections of young talent throughout the entire league. What is unknown is how this front office should use that collection of assets to best position this franchise to win it's first title.

Also common knowledge is the fact that, in this current NBA, it is extremely difficult to win a championship without a "superstar" or two. As a small market team, acquiring just one of those caliber of players is equally difficult. While Utah may yet already have it's superstar, it is far too early to tell & far too risky to count on.

While the Jazz have made large contractual commitments to Gordon Hayward, Derrick Favors, & Alec Burks, they also having young players such as Rudy Gobert & Dante Exum, both of whom represent the team's best chance at having it's own, homegrown superstar(s). Obviously, there are also several other young talented players, such as Enes Kanter, Trey Burke, & Rodney Hood, who may have potential roles with the team.

Due to the current state of the NBA, it has become clear that teams (especially those of the small market nature) are best off being either a legitimate championship contender or a legitimate contender for the #1 pick in the NBA draft. The Jazz realized this a few years ago & decided to attempt to be the latter type of franchise, although they appear to have done too good of a job acquiring talent as they have been good enough to not get that necessary, surefire superstar, yet bad enough to remain in the lottery.

This roster was not assembled to compete this year, but instead assembled to develop into one that potentially could. From what I've seen, given a legitimate bench that includes a key veteran or two, this group of young talent could potentially do just that in the future. But, being a small market team, the Jazz need to give themselves the best opportunity to do that by stockpiling assets, which they have certainly done. Now, while players such as Kanter & Burke could provide tremendous value off of the bench, it is clear that the roster contains certain players at their positions whom not only arguably have more talent, but also seemingly fit better alongside the other key pieces of the team.

I would have also included Burks in this list if it weren't for what I suspect to be an untradable contract extension due to his injury - although I do believe he can (& will) be an ideal sixth man on a contending team. I would include Rodney Hood as well if not for his injury & currently (I suspect) low trade value. If not for their injuries & inability to contribute this year, I would be in favor of trading both - not because I don't value either player, but because of what I believe to be the best option for the team going forward. Which brings me to my next point . . .

Due to the increasingly rapid growth of what seems to be the core of the future team - hayward, favors, gobert, & (hopefully soon) exum - the window to acquire one last potential star appears to be quickly closing. It is this reason that I think the best move going forward is to extract as much potential, future assets as possible by dealing burke, kanter, & booker. While I certainly believe that all of those players could contribute as key role-players off of the bench, both in the future as well as the present (which they are doing & while is valuable, is much less so to a lottery bound team such as this one), I firmly believe that those players would provide more value through whatever non-contributing (to this year's team) assets that they would bring back in return.

All in all, this is a long-winded way of saying that I believe the front office should gut the roster (aside from exum, hayward, favors, gobert, burks, & hood) & throw in the towel of what has clearly become a lost season, rather than continuing to essentially be the lottery version of what they were with millsap & jefferson. Call it tanking or whatever you'd like, but I believe that this team would be best suited by making one last attempt to position itself to draft another potential star to play either pg (with exum sliding to the 2) or on the wing alongside hayward at the 2 or 3, depending on who is available (ideally a potentially elite scorer such as De'Angelo Russell), & then fill out the rest of a bench built around burks & hood using any remaining assets - whether it be in this draft or a future one (preferably this one in order to speed up our ascent to contention by allowing the key members of the team to build as much chemistry as quickly as possible).

I know that most of this is recycled information, & apologize for that, but without having any say in the moves that this front office makes, I would rather repeat what most of you are assuredly already aware of than do nothing; not that any of this will make a difference. For what it's worth, I have faith in this front office & trust whatever moves they make (or dont) going forward. I would just hate to watch as another Jazz team comes up an impact player short of realizing it's ultimate goal, which is what I think will be the likely outcome should the team stand pat & continue developing it's current group of players.

Regardless of what happens from this point forward, I will do everything within my power to see the Utah Jazz win an NBA championship, or die trying. Go Jazz!
 
Karl gotta write what Karl gotta write.

I think there is one thing missing from Karl's plan. Bench Snyder for the rest of the season. Just say he's going to rehab or for anger management treatment. Then hire Corbin once the Kings fire him. Tank complete!

At this point, there is ZERO chance the Jazz get a top-4 pick. Even season-ending injuries to Hayward and Favors probably wouldn't be enough to land the Jazz behind Minnesota, Lakers, Philly and New York. Is the talent at #5 significantly better than that at #9? I'd say the pool is very much like last season. WE spent half the draft thread arguing over Randle, Gordon, Stauskas, Smart, etc. with our pick (assuming Exum would be off the board). Not sure who the top-4 will be, but assume Okafor, Mudiay. Russell and Towns? That leaves Johnson, Hezonja, Porzingas, Booker, Lyles, Winslow, WCS, Turner Oubre, Looney, etc. in the next tier (not in order and I'm sure I missed a few).

Get rid of Kanter AND Booker? Who gets the minutes behind Derrick and Rudy? WHEREVER Utah finishes there will be a good prospect available. And who knows, maybe that pick is dealt along with another asset for a shooter. I am in agreement on facilitating trades and getting future picks. But I'm against turning a position of great strength (the bigs) into an area without any depth by getting late 1st's or early 2nd's for Booker and Kanter. They are more valuable than that.
 
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Well stated. The fact that you can put together a cohesive sentence, let alone a well stated position, puts you in rarified air around here.
 
Karl Malone says

First & foremost, thank you to all of those who provide information & insight in the seemingly never-ending (but hopefully soon-ending) conversation on how to get the Utah Jazz that elusive, first NBA championship. Also, Karl Malone apologizes in advance for the length of this post.

As everyone on this site knows, the Jazz have assembled one of the best collections of young talent throughout the entire league. What is unknown is how this front office should use that collection of assets to best position this franchise to win it's first title.

Also common knowledge is the fact that, in this current NBA, it is extremely difficult to win a championship without a "superstar" or two. As a small market team, acquiring just one of those caliber of players is equally difficult. While Utah may yet already have it's superstar, it is far too early to tell & far too risky to count on.

While the Jazz have made large contractual commitments to Gordon Hayward, Derrick Favors, & Alec Burks, they also having young players such as Rudy Gobert & Dante Exum, both of whom represent the team's best chance at having it's own, homegrown superstar(s). Obviously, there are also several other young talented players, such as Enes Kanter, Trey Burke, & Rodney Hood, who may have potential roles with the team.

Due to the current state of the NBA, it has become clear that teams (especially those of the small market nature) are best off being either a legitimate championship contender or a legitimate contender for the #1 pick in the NBA draft. The Jazz realized this a few years ago & decided to attempt to be the latter type of franchise, although they appear to have done too good of a job acquiring talent as they have been good enough to not get that necessary, surefire superstar, yet bad enough to remain in the lottery.

This roster was not assembled to compete this year, but instead assembled to develop into one that potentially could. From what Karl Malone has seen, given a legitimate bench that includes a key veteran or two, this group of young talent could potentially do just that in the future. But, being a small market team, the Jazz need to give themselves the best opportunity to do that by stockpiling assets, which they have certainly done. Now, while players such as Kanter & Burke could provide tremendous value off of the bench, it is clear that the roster contains certain players at their positions whom not only arguably have more talent, but also seemingly fit better alongside the other key pieces of the team.

Karl Malone would have also included Burks in this list if it weren't for what Karl Malone suspects to be an untradable contract extension due to his injury - although Karl Malone does believe he can (& will) be an ideal sixth man on a contending team. Karl Malone would include Rodney Hood as well if not for his injury & currently (Karl Malone suspects) low trade value. If not for their injuries & inability to contribute this year, Karl Malone would be in favor of trading both - not because Karl Malone don't value either player, but because of what Karl Malone believes to be the best option for the team going forward. Which brings Karl Malone to Karl Malone's next point . . .

Due to the increasingly rapid growth of what seems to be the core of the future team - hayward, favors, gobert, & (hopefully soon) exum - the window to acquire one last potential star appears to be quickly closing. It is this reason that Karl Malone thinks the best move going forward is to extract as much potential, future assets as possible by dealing burke, kanter, & booker. While Karl Malone certainly believes that all of those players could contribute as key role-players off of the bench, both in the future as well as the present (which they are doing & while is valuable, is much less so to a lottery bound team such as this one), Karl Malone firmly believes that those players would provide more value through whatever non-contributing (to this year's team) assets that they would bring back in return.

All in all, this is a long-winded way of saying that Karl Malone believes the front office should gut the roster (aside from exum, hayward, favors, gobert, burks, & hood) & throw in the towel of what has clearly become a lost season, rather than continuing to essentially be the lottery version of what they were with millsap & jefferson. Call it tanking or whatever you'd like, but Karl Malone believes that this team would be best suited by making one last attempt to position itself to draft another potential star to play either pg (with exum sliding to the 2) or on the wing alongside hayward at the 2 or 3, depending on who is available (ideally a potentially elite scorer such as De'Angelo Russell), & then fill out the rest of a bench built around burks & hood using any remaining assets - whether it be in this draft or a future one (preferably this one in order to speed up our ascent to contention by allowing the key members of the team to build as much chemistry as quickly as possible).

Karl Malone knows that most of this is recycled information, & apologizes for that, but without having any say in the moves that this front office makes, Karl Malone would rather repeat what most of you are assuredly already aware of than do nothing; not that any of this will make a difference. For what it's worth, Karl Malone has faith in this front office & trust whatever moves they make (or dont) going forward. Karl Malone would just hate to watch as another Jazz team comes up an impact player short of realizing it's ultimate goal, which is what Karl Malone thinks will be the likely outcome should the team stand pat & continue developing it's current group of players.

Regardless of what happens from this point forward, Karl Malone will do everything within his power to see the Utah Jazz win an NBA championship, or die trying. Go Jazz!

Corrections made are in bold :)
 
OP: I think the Jazz are already quietly shopping several players, including Kanter, Burke and possibly even Favors, simply to gauge what their perceived value around the league. Once the draft positions are set, I'm guessing the Jazz will offer players, their current pick and future picks in an effort to move up to grab somebody. The most extreme example of this would be to move even Favors as part of an effort to get Russell. Conventional wisdom would say that you're right, that this draft is the last, best chance for the Jazz to be able to draft a star player. However, any trades involving picks in this upcoming draft would happen just prior to the draft itself, or during the draft.

As for the rest of the season, I think the Jazz will try to keep their win total under control. Honestly, I think the fact that Millsap and Ingles are getting so many minutes and the fact Burke is allowed to launch as many shots as he does is testament to the fact that the Jazz aren't trying hard to win. That said, Gobert has surprised and Hayward has taken a big step forward. This has turned would-be losses to teams like Sacramento and Denver into wins.

If the Jazz end up with a draft position in the top 8, and they are unable to move up in the lottery, they might still draft a very good player in the likes of Mario Hezonja or Stanley Johnson.
 
OP: I think the Jazz are already quietly shopping several players, including Kanter, Burke and possibly even Favors, simply to gauge what their perceived value around the league. Once the draft positions are set, I'm guessing the Jazz will offer players, their current pick and future picks in an effort to move up to grab somebody. The most extreme example of this would be to move even Favors as part of an effort to get Russell. Conventional wisdom would say that you're right, that this draft is the last, best chance for the Jazz to be able to draft a star player. However, any trades involving picks in this upcoming draft would happen just prior to the draft itself, or during the draft.

As for the rest of the season, I think the Jazz will try to keep their win total under control. Honestly, I think the fact that Millsap and Ingles are getting so many minutes and the fact Burke is allowed to launch as many shots as he does is testament to the fact that the Jazz aren't trying hard to win. That said, Gobert has surprised and Hayward has taken a big step forward. This has turned would-be losses to teams like Sacramento and Denver into wins.

If the Jazz end up with a draft position in the top 8, and they are unable to move up in the lottery, they might still draft a very good player in the likes of Mario Hezonja or Stanley Johnson.

Offer anyone not named Favors, Hayward, Gobert or Exum.
 
Honestly, if you wanted to restart the tank and not be obvious about it, you would just trade Burke for a pick or an injured player. Replace Burke with Ian Clarke and the Jazz would lose at a greater clip, because as bad as Burke is, we can all remember what life is like without a legitimate PG. The upside it that I don't think ANYONE is going to be all "Oh noes!! we traded Trey Burke!" We don't need to trade Booker or Kanter who could be valuable pieces in order to drop more games.

The worst that could happen is that relying too heavily on Exum actually causes him to bust out. That wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing.
 
Keep posting Karl Malone. Try talking in the third person though. Its more entertaining. Also, I liker the part about how they should gut the team other than, you know, other than keeping half of the team in hay, exum, faves, Gobert, hoodie, and Burks.
 
Karl Malone mad! Don't you ever let Karl Malone see anyone making fun of Karl Malone again!
Or Karl Malone whoop yo ***! :mad:

Burgers are ready...
 
Karl Malone appreciates the many replies . . .

In all seriousness, thank you for the well thought-out responses.

Due to posting via phone, I was unable to explain my p.o.v. as thoroughly as I would have preferred to (which is prob a good thing due to the length of the original post).

To expand, my stance of wanting to trade Kanter, Burke, & Booker is based almost solely on the affect it would have on our draft position rather than the assets we would acquire; & while I agree with the poster who suggested that the difference in talent level between lottery picks outside of the top 4 is minimal, I believe that any team that would be willing to move out of the top 4 would only do so if it had identified "it's guy" somewhere in that 5-10 range & could still acquire him (on top of whatever other assets are included), so having the #5 pick vs the #10 pick (for example) could potentially be the difference in whether or not the hypothetical deal occurs. So maybe it's not worth giving up valuable assets for less than their actual worth, but irregardless, at this point, I personally would not be comfortable committing 10+ mil to Kanter (although I may feel differently were it not for the Burks extension). I would rather receive a late 1st for him than get stuck paying another player who I am not convinced fits within our future starting 5. Twenty plus million is far too much $ to be paying 2 (ideally) bench players, although I do believe both players are capable of starting with the right type of players surrounding them (which I do not believe our current roster projects to do).

As far as Burke & Booker go, while I do believe that both players may be worth retaining due to the fact that both can be done so without contributing significant $ to, I do not believe that trading just Kanter ascends (or rather descends) our draft pick to that 5/6 range. As much as I'd like to assure that we have a high energy role player such as Booker coming off of the bench (just as I felt with DMC last yr) or a backup PG as talented as Burke, I strongly feel that missing out on the final piece of our (potentially) Detroit Pistons-esqe (championship team) caliber starting 5 would be much more difficult to overcome than trading away key (yet still replaceable) bench contributors.

As much as I do not want to see this team lose a single game, let alone a lot of them, what is the point of winning any of them if you never had a legitimate chance at winning the last one? (I know, I'm being dramatic/hyperbolic)

What it comes down to is that, even with maximum development/improvement, I don't see a championship caliber team in:

pg-exum/burke
sg-burks/draft pick (in #8-12 range) or hood
sf-hayward/hood or draft pick
pf-favors/booker
c-gobert/kanter

Instead, I see a team that is close but no(t smoking the celebratory) cigar, such as the ones we had with stockton/me/etc & dwill/boozer/etc (not to compare the 2 as the former almost assuredly would have won at least 1 championship had it not been for MJ). Obviously, it is extremely difficult & nearly impossible to predict the future careers of athletes who are still prohibited from enjoying an alcoholic beverage, let alone how those future careers will fit/coincide with one another. I just hope this front office decides to swing for the fences rather than settle for the sure fire extra-base hit with the hopes of getting lucky & stretching it into an inside the park hr.

P.S. Karl Malone apologizes for the baseball analogy as well as yet another extremely lengthy post.
 
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You need an editor, the first 7 or so paragraphs said basically the exact same thing. You also could have just said: Trade non essential players, tank for one last shot at a superstar.

I disagree with the strategy, mainly because, for this particular rebuild my rooting for losses days are over. The draft pick is what it is, at the end of the year I'll obviously be more happy if it's higher. But I'm not cheering for a loss. (Also have a strange feeling we are gonna get top 3 lotto pick.)

Good first post though. Stick around.
 
You need an editor, the first 7 or so paragraphs said basically the exact same thing. You also could have just said: Trade non essential players, tank for one last shot at a superstar.

I disagree with the strategy, mainly because, for this particular rebuild my rooting for losses days are over. The draft pick is what it is, at the end of the year I'll obviously be more happy if it's higher. But I'm not cheering for a loss. (Also have a strange feeling we are gonna get top 3 lotto pick.)

Good first post though. Stick around.

I have the same feeling. I really hope we get one of Russell, towns or mudiay.
 
we used to coin core 4 alot- Hayward, Gobert, Favors and Exum anyone outside that Id be fine with using to trade up that said very rare you move up too many picks- I remember that trade with Portland where we netted Deron, most we might be able to move up 1-3 picks the way we are going now we might be picking 10-13? we might be losing alot of games but competing and learning from these losses, Im excited about the future here
 
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