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Game Thread Oct 28, 2023 08:00PM MT: Jazz at Suns

Added to Calendar: 10-28-23

John Collins is now 3/11 on 3PAs this season (27%). It's early, but the Jazz may have found a replacement for Rudy Gay.
Trash analysis based on 3 games where he has been one of our best players overall. Hasnt even missed a shot badly as far as I can remember.

Many in here are clearly hoping for him to fail so they get to say "I knew it". Disgusting.
 
I’m not faulting your logic but if that’s the case we might as well trade Laurie for picks and younger assets now. They call Porzingis a unicorn but Laurie is better - more complete. He’s hitting his prime now and there’s no guarantee that he won’t sustain a career altering injury leading our Tank patrol. We’re doing this kid a grave disservice if we don’t start building around him immediately and compete now.
Unless the thunder come at us with a god father offer of picks for Lauri I wouldn't trade him right now. Also we would definitely not being doing him a disservice by staying patient and focusing on our young guys. I swear some of you guys never learn your lesson and always want to take a shortcut to get better regardless of if that shortcut leads to a team that maxes out below a championship contender. I would much rather build this thing right and deal with growing pains over the next couple years with the hope of building a legit championship contender rather than making a couple win now moves for older guys that get us in playoff contention but definitely not championship contention. As long as Lauri sees that there is legit young talent around him that can grow into something then I think he will be fine with staying patient and building the right way. That entails figuring out what we have though and that means giving all our youngsters consistent minutes. If with those minutes they don't look good and aren't showing a lot of potential then that makes the Lauri decision a hell of a lot easier because that signals a more extensive rebuild and that is when you shop Lauri. On the other hand if Keyonte looks like a possible star, Kessler looks really good with those minutes and 2 of Ochai, Hendricks and Sensabaugh show solid role player potential then you know you have some key building blocks in place and you make moves to fill the voids. The process of finding all of those guys minutes is also pretty easy this year with Clarkson and Olynyk being very tradeable and I think we can get a positive asset back for them. Then we move one of THT or Sexton and there are plenty of minutes for everyone.
 
Trash analysis based on 3 games where he has been one of our best players overall. Hasnt even missed a shot badly as far as I can remember.

Many in here are clearly hoping for him to fail so they get to say "I knew it". Disgusting.

I'm being a bit snarky, and yeah, it's early. However, Collins needs to prove to defenses that they should go out and guard him and not just close out. The burden of proof falls on him based on his past. So far, he's one of the reasons why the paint is crowded, since his defender can hedge 10 feet off of him. He hasn't made them pay. I get that he plays defense and rebounds.
 
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I'm being a bit snarky, and yeah, it's early. However, Collins needs to prove to defenses that they should go out and guard him and not just close out. The burden of proof falls on him based on his past. So far, he's one of the reasons why the paint is crowded, since his defender is hedging 10 feet off of him. He hasn't made them pay. I get that he plays defense and rebounds.
Fair enough and I agree about him needing to prove his shot is back.

FWIW, he hasnt missed by much. 2 swishes, 1 lucky make, 1 in-and-out and other misses mainly off of inside rim.

 
I mean the guy is averaging 7/4/1 as a starter shooting 26.9% from the field and 21.4% from 2.

If you’re starting ahead of a rookie who’s more talented than you and you’re not producing that’s what is going to happen. He’s flat out just playing bad. It’s like when NFL teams start an inferior QB when they have a rookie they drafted high who’s better.

I get it. I think THT was mostly good in our second game though, and kind of evenly good and bad in his first game. So he's really only had one really bad game. But yeah, Keyonte is our future point guard, it's clear.

One of my least favorite things on this board is scapegoating though, so I'm not looking forward to that.
 
Unless the thunder come at us with a god father offer of picks for Lauri I wouldn't trade him right now. Also we would definitely not being doing him a disservice by staying patient and focusing on our young guys. I swear some of you guys never learn your lesson and always want to take a shortcut to get better regardless of if that shortcut leads to a team that maxes out below a championship contender. I would much rather build this thing right and deal with growing pains over the next couple years with the hope of building a legit championship contender rather than making a couple win now moves for older guys that get us in playoff contention but definitely not championship contention. As long as Lauri sees that there is legit young talent around him that can grow into something then I think he will be fine with staying patient and building the right way. That entails figuring out what we have though and that means giving all our youngsters consistent minutes. If with those minutes they don't look good and aren't showing a lot of potential then that makes the Lauri decision a hell of a lot easier because that signals a more extensive rebuild and that is when you shop Lauri. On the other hand if Keyonte looks like a possible star, Kessler looks really good with those minutes and 2 of Ochai, Hendricks and Sensabaugh show solid role player potential then you know you have some key building blocks in place and you make moves to fill the voids. The process of finding all of those guys minutes is also pretty easy this year with Clarkson and Olynyk being very tradeable and I think we can get a positive asset back for them. Then we move one of THT or Sexton and there are plenty of minutes for everyone.
So what do you have against the use of paragraphs?
 
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I think THT was mostly good in our second game though, and kind of evenly good and bad in his first game.
The THT experience can't be reduced to individual games or plays. He's a guy who functions in his own little bubble of delusion, following his own set of rules, and has an oversized negative effect on how his team plays. THT doesn't seem to give a ****, which is fantastic 10% of the time. The rest of the time it's terrible.

That also makes him the perfect tank commander for a team that needs one, which is probably something Danny realized early on.
 
I'm being a bit snarky, and yeah, it's early. However, Collins needs to prove to defenses that they should go out and guard him and not just close out. The burden of proof falls on him based on his past. So far, he's one of the reasons why the paint is crowded, since his defender can hedge 10 feet off of him. He hasn't made them pay. I get that he plays defense and rebounds.
Yes, he rebounds, but Collins is one of the worst defenders on this team.

I mean, he's literally never been known as a defender. I have no idea why that rep would suddenly go away when he joins the Jazz.

On offense, I'm more or less happy with him so far, even though though his shooting has been erratic. At least he doesn't do dumb **** like the 3-headed guard monster.
 
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