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Perrennial Playoff Contender or Championship?

orangello

orangello

Well-Known Member
Playoff Contender or Championship?

I am pumped to have the NBA season come to fruition again. I have been on this board nonstop since Saturday morning. I am happy to see that people are coming out of the wood works and putting in their opinions on the upcoming season for the Jazz. After reading through a lot of posts and gaining more perspective, it seems like there are two divisions of fans on this website, playoff fans and championship fans.

Let me explain, some are pushing for the right pieces to get to the playoffs this year and others are saying be patient and gather together picks and cap space in order to make a solid run at a championship. I am on the be patient side of things. This is how I see the contribution of the current players as well as the potential FA that the Jazz can sign. I will value them in two categories, playoffs and championship.

Harris
Playoffs: Yes
Championship: No

Bell
Playoffs: Possibly
Championship: Yes

Miles
Playoffs: Yes
Championship: No

Hayward
Playoffs: Yes
Championship: Yes

Burks
Playoffs: Unsure
Championship: Unsure

Evans
Playoffs: Yes
Championship: Possibly

Favors
Playoffs: Yes
Championship: Yes

Millsap
Playoffs: Yes
Championship: Yes

Jefferson
Playoffs: Yes
Championship: Possibly but more towards No

Okur
Playoffs: Unsure
Championship: Unsure

Kanter
Playoffs: Unsure
Championship: Unsure


Free Agents

Watson
Playoffs: Yes
Championship: Yes

AK
Playoffs: Yes
Championship: Yes

Price
Playoffs: No
Championship: No

I would give reasons why but I hate when OP's are too long and this one is too long. What is everyone's thoughts on this?
 
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I think there are nights--typically 1 out of 4--when CJ Miles goes off and takes over the game in the 2nd half. So unless we bring in another player with that kind of offensive potential (sporadic as it is) or get a gem back in a trade, I think you keep him to try to be our version of Jamal Crawford.

Millsap is a valuable bench player, but relies on a favorable match-up to make a difference (See Scola, Luis)

AK: I think this has run it's course, although we have to acknowledge that he hits a good share of his jumpers now. The problem is that his injuries make him too unreliable.

Watson: Why people get excited about him, I'll never know.

Okur: I think at this point in his career, he may be just a 3-pt. specialist, but it will be interesting to see how he looks in camp.
 
I'm definitely on the "be bad for a while, if it means a championship later on" team. I really don't understand why anyone wouldn't be down for that. I guess most Jazz fans are so used to a stable franchise that the idea of suddenly rebuilding is very frightening. But that's what's happening. Rebuilding. Not regrouping. Not reloading. TOTAL REBUILD MODE. That means missing the playoffs at least one more year, getting more guys from the lottery, and letting them develop as individual players and as a unit. I'm very excited to see this all play out, I just don't know how to get the casual fans to understand this concept and give their full support. Oh well, it should be fun anyway.
 
spycam1 said:
I'm definitely on the "be bad for a while, if it means a championship later on" team. I really don't understand why anyone wouldn't be down for that. I guess most Jazz fans are so used to a stable franchise that the idea of suddenly rebuilding is very frightening. But that's what's happening. Rebuilding. Not regrouping. Not reloading. TOTAL REBUILD MODE. That means missing the playoffs at least one more year, getting more guys from the lottery, and letting them develop as individual players and as a unit. I'm very excited to see this all play out, I just don't know how to get the casual fans to understand this concept and give their full support. Oh well, it should be fun anyway.
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+1
 
I think the goal has to be to make the Finals. Getting to the playoffs and winning a round doesn't really do it for me. We have to be in the process of building towards something greater.

I think the Jazz are actually making some surprisingly aggressive moves to improve the young talent base. If you look at how they were willing to let players like Brewer, Matthews, Korver, and now AK leave, you can see that they aren't willing to just make the playoffs.
 
"Bell Championship: Yes" voided the entire rest of the list. Thanks for playing.
 
LogGrad98 said:
"Bell Championship: Yes" voided the entire rest of the list. Thanks for playing.
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I thought that too. How the hell does Bell help us win a championship? Is he going to clothesline someone hard in game 1 and then get suspended for the rest of the series, because that would be about as helpful as I could see him being.
 
I want a championship. Anything else is simply losing. There is no way that AK or Bell would be significant pieces to a championship team because the Jazz are 2 or 3 years away if all the young guys pan out.
 
Would everyone freak out if traded Jefferson or Millsap for draft picks and filler? We could end up with 6 lottery picks from the last two drafts (Hayward, Favors, Burks, Kanter, GS pick and new pick)
 
LogGrad98 said:
"Bell Championship: Yes" voided the entire rest of the list. Thanks for playing.
Click to expand...

The reason that I included him as a yes was not because of his playing ability. I included him because of his veteran presence in the locker room and on the practice court. I could see him playing some spot minutes but nothing significant.

Bell is a good locker room guy. I remember hearing stories about the Miracle in Miami (and almost every game of the road trip actually) where Bell kept people believing that they could still win the game. Someone like that if very beneficial to a young team. They don't have to play any significant minutes but their experience can make a difference. That is why I included Bell.
 
Qman said:
Would everyone freak out if traded Jefferson or Millsap for draft picks and filler? We could end up with 6 lottery picks from the last two drafts (Hayward, Favors, Burks, Kanter, GS pick and new pick)
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Jefferson, No. Millsap, Yes.
 
Playoffs don't do it for me unless we go deep. I'd rather do crazy/exciting things than just be a 'good' team forever. Roll the dice (with some smarts behind it) and go for the gold.
 
PKM said:
Playoffs don't do it for me unless we go deep. I'd rather do crazy/exciting things than just be a 'good' team forever. Roll the dice (with some smarts behind it) and go for the gold.
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Couldn't agree more. A first round exit, especially with this draft coming up, is worse than a losing record.
 
Put me in for playoffs. The West is going to have a down year this year. I think if we can sneak into the playoffs we have a chance to upset anyone. Gone are the days of LA killing us year in year out. I think if we add Granger to our core and take away Millsap, assuming we gel and are coached well, have a chance to do something exciting.

I'm all for getting lotto picks, but at some points you have to make a move forward or you just become the Timberwolves.
 
Cyrone Torbin said:
Put me in for playoffs. The West is going to have a down year this year. I think if we can sneak into the playoffs we have a chance to upset anyone. Gone are the days of LA killing us year in year out. I think if we add Granger to our core and take away Millsap, assuming we gel and are coached well, have a chance to do something exciting.

I'm all for getting lotto picks, but at some points you have to make a move forward or you just become the Timberwolves.
Click to expand...

Love the optimism. I still think we have too may 'if's' that we need to get sorted out this year. A couple of which you named above.
 
Catchall said:
I think there are nights--typically 1 out of 4--when CJ Miles goes off and takes over the game in the 2nd half. So unless we bring in another player with that kind of offensive potential (sporadic as it is) or get a gem back in a trade, I think you keep him to try to be our version of Jamal Crawford.
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The problem is, he doesn't just take the other 3 nights off. He sucks it up in a big way. He shoots poorly, makes poor decisions, and helps us lose. No thanks. Even if that 1 out of the 4 games he was a combination of Jordan/Wade/Stockton/Malone he would not be worth it.

(1 out of 4 games is extremely generous. He had several very crappy stretches last year. Sure, he got points, but in a way most often detrimental to the team.)
 
It should be obvious that every fan wants a championship. Nobody actually roots for 2nd place.

There certainly are some who like the idea of the team performing poorly in order to acquire higher picks. There are several reasons I disagree with this, that I've gone into many times. In short IMO developing the team as a whole is more important than looking forward to lottery picks, the team has plenty of young talent already, AND we have GS's pick anyways.

I'm also against taking advantage of the flexibility the club has right now as opposed to sustaining that until we know what we have in regards to the current group of players. If that means a losing record so be it, but I wouldn't want to gamble on an assumption right now. It's possible a trade @ midseason wouldn't be unreasonable or something minor like moving Bell but any big move that isn't landslide in favor of Utah would very likely be a mistake this year.

Finally, sorry, but I hate your list. If Luke Walton has two rings every player on our roster could get one too.
 
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