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Should We Reward Good Students?

One Brow said:
When I see reliable evidence Mormonism is true, I'll accept it. Meanwhile, I'll take your question as a compliment. Thank you.
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In that case, when I see reliable evidence that JimLes and yourself are correct, then I'll accept it. Until then, tough luck.



/do you see how pointless this is? I hope you do. It's just a continual circle. Pointless.
 
Hantlers said:
At some point one realizes that the continual arguing is pointless.
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If you have an alternative way to describe the contents of your post, besides "The truths disgusts you, and you're taking it out on the messenger.", I'll read it. My interpretation could be due to a lack in my imagination. Show where you were really reacting to the ideas in the post, if you can.
 
One Brow said:
When I see reliable evidence Mormonism is true, I'll accept it. Meanwhile, I'll take your question as a compliment. Thank you.
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What will you accept as reliable evidence?
 
LogGrad98 said:
Wise words.

I have found it to generate the best productivity and general satisfaction among my employees to set goals with them that are within their reach, stretches them individually, contributes to the overall success of the organization, and then identify and reinforce the right behaviors to help them reach those goals. If they have a part in the goal setting and buy into what we are trying to do, then it builds more personal satisfaction in each of them. This also allows for their individual differences and lets them grow in ways meaningful to them that still has an impact on the bottom line. Of course it cannot always be that way, but if that is the general framework in which we operate then telling them to "work hard" gives them not only a frame of reference, but also a clear understanding of what hard work and good results look like, as well as the rewards that are thereby attainable.

I think this same general idea would work well for students too. We have used this method with our kids generally and they seem to have gotten more out of school, even when they weren't the top kid in the class. Even with our 17 year old who is dealing with epilepsy and struggles mightily to even perform at basic passing levels. At least he knows what hard work can get him, what it means to work hard, and how to translate that into his personal circumstances. I think that is half the battle.
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I agree. And the major point I see in your post here is that people need individual attention -- implied in some of the other posts here, but not yet said this clearly and directly. Of course, giving everyone the individual attention they need in order to help guide them and tailor their goals and expectations appropriately is a difficulty all its own. It's why class size is such a big deal, because too large a class means less individual attention.

Also, managing people is hard, and few people do it well. In my experience most managers see themselves as the higher rung on the totem pole that is there to make high-level decisions that their workers can't handle, but what a manager is supposed to do is to help their employees do their own work. The manager serves the employees, rather than the other way around. That's just what managing is.

As for teachers, well, they basically are managers and need the exact same set of skills -- except that they're paid less money, appreciated less for doing it, are required to work harder and do more than most other kinds of managers, and have a more important job than just about any other managers in the world.

No wonder we're so screwed up.

EDIT:

This scene from The West Wing comes to mind: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ND_a8rA67VA&t=39s
 
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You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to AtheistPreacher again.
 
LogGrad98 said:
What will you accept as reliable evidence?
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I don't think I could list every possible item. The actual golden plates, with an ancient age confirmed by some testing method, would be impressive. Consistently accurate knowledge that extended beyond the local libraries Smith could access, perhaps.
 
One Brow said:
This was never a fact. There have always been people working 80 hours a week and having little or nothing to show for it at the end of the year.
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Bull ****. BULL ****. UTTER BULL ****. I hate this thinking. Show me ONE person that works 80 hours a week in America, is smart with their money, that ends the year with nothing. You can't. Because it is impossible to work 80 hours a week, live within your means and have nothing. IT CAN'T BE DONE.

What a crock of ****. LOL. Lame, one brow. I tend to agree with a lot of what you say, but this is preposterous. Let's say you made $7.25/hr and worked 80 hours a week. That is over $30,000 a year. Your taxes would be approx $2,000. That leaves you with $28,000 a year cash. That is $2300 a month. Let's say you spend $450 on groceries ($15 a day). You have a roommate on a decent 2 bedroom apartment ($500/month). You pay utilities, phone, tv, internet ($200/month). Laundry is $60 a month. Now, if you were smart, you would live close to public transport or walk to work ($100 month). Clothes ($50 month). That all adds up to $1360 a month. You still have ONE THOUSAND DOLLARS A MONTH LEFT OVER.

That means, for someone making $14/hr, could easily save $12,000 a year if they lived frugally and within their means.
 
green said:
Bull ****. BULL ****. UTTER BULL ****. I hate this thinking. Show me ONE person that works 80 hours a week in America, is smart with their money, that ends the year with nothing. You can't. Because it is impossible to work 80 hours a week, live within your means and have nothing. IT CAN'T BE DONE.
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What a meaningless statement. If you work one hour a week for $1, and "live within your means", you'll have money left over. It just that you won't have much by the way of "within your means".

green said:
What a crock of ****. LOL. Lame, one brow. I tend to agree with a lot of what you say, but this is preposterous. Let's say you made $7.25/hr and worked 80 hours a week. That is over $30,000 a year. Your taxes would be approx $2,000. That leaves you with $28,000 a year cash. That is $2300 a month. Let's say you spend $450 on groceries ($15 a day). You have a roommate on a decent 2 bedroom apartment ($500/month). You pay utilities, phone, tv, internet ($200/month). Laundry is $60 a month. Now, if you were smart, you would live close to public transport or walk to work ($100 month). Clothes ($50 month). That all adds up to $1360 a month. You still have ONE THOUSAND DOLLARS A MONTH LEFT OVER.
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How do I feed my (let's say two of the same gender, but it's often more or one of each) kids? That's another $500 for rent and $200 for utilities that I no longer have a roommate to pay, another $30 in laundry, another $20 in clothes, another $250 in groceries. That's the whole budget. We still haven't accounted for daycare/school supplies. Also, I don't have a car.

Now, I can cut back by moving to a worse neighborhood, buying lower quality groceries, etc. However, as a parent, I'm going to choose the best neighborhood I can manage to keep my kids safe, and feed them as well as I can. So, I'd rather have $0 left and live in eastern Belleville than $500 and live in East St. Louis.
 
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