The article Jimmer fans don't want to read

[billyshelby]

It's amazing how sensitive the Jimmer fans are. I personally think Jimmer will make it as a backup PG in the league. I don't think he will ever start. I think he'll struggle early adapting. I could be real wrong. What I don't understand is the absolute assurance Jimmer will at least be a solid backup. He absolutely could bust. I like his intangibles, but there are real weaknesses in his game.

Even in this draft, Jimmer is not BPA at 12.

 

[Borat]

It's amazing how sensitive the Jimmer fans are. I personally think Jimmer will make it as a backup PG in the league. I don't think he will ever start. I think he'll struggle early adapting. I could be real wrong. What I don't understand is the absolute assurance Jimmer will at least be a solid backup. He absolutely could bust. I like his intangibles, but there are real weaknesses in his game.

Even in this draft, Jimmer is not BPA at 12.

I just don't see 12 guys who are better than Jimmer in this draft. After a core of Irving, Williams, Knight, Kanter, Jonas, Biyombo, Walker, I don't really see anyone who has has less question marks than Jimmer. And perhaps even some of the 7 top guys I named have more question marks...

 

[Jazz4ever]

I really like the idea of having two 40%+ three point shooters in the back court. With Jimmer and Hayward, it would be a reality. If Singleton can hit an NBA three he would be worth the 12th as well. Big if though. He supposedly tweeted he has an upcoming workout with the Jazz, they will have to test him well in that department.

 

[MattMan]

Even in this draft, Jimmer is not BPA at 12.

Ok, who do you think will be BPA at 12 then? Let's have good discussion of what will work and instead of what doesn't.

Singleton, Burks, Thompson.......maybe Brooks? Are they better than Jimmer at 12? I want everyone to look at them as you are looking at Jimmer. Break them down and see if any of these guys have "absolute assurance" that they'll even be a solid backup. I don't think you can. Hell, I don't think you can with Dwill2, is he a 3 or a 4?

I gotta be honest, I don't see an argument that says Jimmer should or shouldn't be the guy to take at 12.

You're right, people are sensitive when it comes to Jimmer, but you're not giving any reasons as to why they shouldn't be.

 

[Borat]

I really like the idea of having two 40%+ three point shooters in the back court. With Jimmer and Hayward, it would be a reality. If Singleton can hit an NBA three he would be worth the 12th as well. Big if though. He supposedly tweeted he has an upcoming workout with the Jazz, they will have to test him well in that department.

Singleton is a College PF, who shot 43% from the floor (horrible stat for a PF) en route to getting 13 ppg as a Junior, who will turn 22 later this year. This guy is end of first round at best, certainly no lottery material.

 

[Gyp Rosetti]

Singleton is a College PF, who shot 43% from the floor (horrible stat for a PF) en route to getting 13 ppg as a Junior, who will turn 22 later this year. This guy is end of first round at best, certainly no lottery material.

He also shot decently (37% I think without looking it up) from three and is the best wing defender in this draft.

 

[Borat]

He also shot decently (37% I think without looking it up) from three and is the best wing defender in this draft.

True, which is why I think he is a first round prospect. But still 43% at PF spot is ridiculously horrendous. And he did not exactly lead NCAA in scoring with 13 ppg. Jimmer is just a so much better prospect.

 

[gomretat]

When I read this article, I was thinking- has an analysis of of teammate shooting percentages and turnover rates been done. IMO Jimmer tried to pass the ball and his teammates failed to convert. So he took more difficult shots agaisnt double and triple teams and made a fair percentage of them.

I really don't worry about Jimmer's passing or scoring. I worry about his defensive ability. But in general he has shown better as a defender and an athlete so maybe he deserves to be a higher pick than projected.

He had several teammates with as good of shooting percentage as his. Jackson dropped the last 3 weeks of the season - likely because of tired legs from playing defense alone out top. Jimmer had folks to dish to.

 

[gomretat]

the stat that startled me is the FGA every 1.7 minutes. does everyone realize how ridonk that is? who is the biggest hucker you can think of in the NBA, because i guarantee he doesn't put up a shot every 1.7 unless his name is kobe. monta ellis isn't that bad. arenas isn't that bad. melo isn't that bad. nobody on the current jazz roster shoots more often than once every 2.2.

adjust his minutes to a more reasonable 20-25 mpg and adjust his minutes-per-FGA to something like 2.5, and his scoring numbers change dramatically. even if he maintained his senior year shooting percentages against NBA defenses, he'd be lucky to average double figures with that type of role. since scoring is really his only specialty, i just wonder if that's enough to use a lottery pick on.

Careful - I have made that very point multiple times and get blasted every time. The other point I have made multiple times that the article reinforces is that his shooting percentages are good, not great. He has great range but has not shot a great percentage.

 

[billyshelby]

Ok, who do you think will be BPA at 12 then? Let's have good discussion of what will work and instead of what doesn't.

Singleton, Burks, Thompson.......maybe Brooks? Are they better than Jimmer at 12? I want everyone to look at them as you are looking at Jimmer. Break them down and see if any of these guys have "absolute assurance" that they'll even be a solid backup. I don't think you can. Hell, I don't think you can with Dwill2, is he a 3 or a 4?

I gotta be honest, I don't see an argument that says Jimmer should or shouldn't be the guy to take at 12.

You're right, people are sensitive when it comes to Jimmer, but you're not giving any reasons as to why they shouldn't be.

My reasons for being skeptical are already out there. In no specific order: age, defense, poor passing statistics. My other concern is the inflated stats across the board considering he handled the ball 90 percent of the time. He "compares" to Evan Turner in that respect. A guy who put up insane stats handling the ball all the time in college, but was infinitely less effective in the pros when he didn't.

As for BPA at 12, it really comes down to your definition of BPA. I mostly base it off ceilings. I personally rate Jimmer's ceiling as strictly limited to backup. There are a lot more than 12 guys in this draft whose ceiling is starter. At 12, I'm rolling the dice on a guy whose ceiling is starter, not a guy who I don't think ever can be one.

 

[gregbroncs]

My reasons for being skeptical are already out there. In no specific order: age, defense, poor passing statistics. My other concern is the inflated stats across the board considering he handled the ball 90 percent of the time. He "compares" to Evan Turner in that respect. A guy who put up insane stats handling the ball all the time in college, but was infinitely less effective in the pros when he didn't.

As for BPA at 12, it really comes down to your definition of BPA. I mostly base it off ceilings. I personally rate Jimmer's ceiling as strictly limited to backup. There are a lot more than 12 guys in this draft whose ceiling is starter. At 12, I'm rolling the dice on a guy whose ceiling is starter, not a guy who I don't think ever can be one.

good post. I agree with all of it.

 

[gregbroncs]

I just don't see 12 guys who are better than Jimmer in this draft. After a core of Irving, Williams, Knight, Kanter, Jonas, Biyombo, Walker, I don't really see anyone who has has less question marks than Jimmer. And perhaps even some of the 7 top guys I named have more question marks...

Some of them probably have more question marks. But all of them have a much higher ceiling. I'm with Billy. I don't want to draft a career backup quality player at 12. Those guys can be had anywhere in the draft. I don't see Jimmer as anything but a career backup.