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The Holy War 2017

jazzman12 said:
All I can say to this statement is....WOW. Utah has won 17 of the last 24 rivalry games. Lavell was 3-5 in his last 8. Crowton was 1-3. Bronco 3-7, and Kilani 0-2. It's been a mighty long time since a BYU coach has had an above .500 stretch vs Utah. In fact, over the last 30 years, Utah's played above .500 football in the rivalry. Lavell struggled to beat Utah in the last decade of his career and every BYU coach since has been able to muster even a .500 record vs Utah. The tide in this rivalry absolutely began to turn 25+ years ago.

The fact of the matter is that BYU absolutely dominated the rivalry in the Lavell era until McBride was hired. McBride basically brought Utah back to the point where they could play BYU evenly (he was 1 game under .500 vs BYU during his Utah tenure) and since the Urban/Whitt era, we have seen Utah take a firm grasp of the series (Utah's 11-3 vs BYU since the Meyer hiring).

I constantly hear BYU fans talk about getting back to the Lavell era dominance of the rivalry, but I just don't see it happening. Hell, even with all the games Lavell won against Utah, the Utes still enjoy nearly a 30 win advantage in the overall series. To say that it's just been the last 7 years in which Utah has separated from BYU just isn't true.
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dat new recruiting doe. NEAR TOTAL FAITH BECAUSE OF TEH EVIDENCE.
 
NAOS said:
It sounds like you're saying that Utah 'didn't play like crap' (i.e. they were good), and BYU played poorly, and yet it was still a close game. In other words, it sounds like a strange backdoor-style silver lining for BYU fans. Which is funny.

Every account of the game suggests that Utah was guilty of plenty of unforced/self-inflicted errors which, despite the wide gap in talent between teams, put the game in jeopardy. <--- that is one fool-proof definition of playing poorly. There are others. But, yeah, that's one.
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This was my point that he was arguing about with me. Utah played poorly because the talent gap and the way the game was played should have been a 3 TD+ win for Utah. That they only won by 6 despite those factors means they played poorly IMO.
 
gregbroncs said:
This was my point that he was arguing about with me. Utah played poorly because the talent gap and the way the game was played should have been a 3 TD+ win for Utah. That they only won by 6 despite those factors means they played poorly IMO.
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Count me in. That game definitely wasn't Utah playing a good, complete game. Defense was great, special teams wasn't good considering the long kick return BYU had, Oline was good in pass pro, bad in the run game, RB's weren't good and also gave up a fumble, WR's were good, Huntley was good. For me it comes down to penalties and the "pick" play Utah got called for. I'm sure BYU fans will disagree but there's no way that was a penalty. On the replay you can literally watch the outside BYU DB hesitate on which WR to cover and make the mistake of covering the inside WR. He had as much to do with creating contact as Utah's WR did. Horrible, horrible call that cost Utah a TD. Other than that, Utah's discipline has been astoundingly bad. The amount of penalties in the first 2 games has got to be a school record. They absolutely have to clean it up by the time conference play rolls around.
 
jazzman12 said:
Count me in. That game definitely wasn't Utah playing a good, complete game. Defense was great, special teams wasn't good considering the long kick return BYU had, Oline was good in pass pro, bad in the run game, RB's weren't good and also gave up a fumble, WR's were good, Huntley was good. For me it comes down to penalties and the "pick" play Utah got called for. I'm sure BYU fans will disagree but there's no way that was a penalty. On the replay you can literally watch the outside BYU DB hesitate on which WR to cover and make the mistake of covering the inside WR. He had as much to do with creating contact as Utah's WR did. Horrible, horrible call that cost Utah a TD. Other than that, Utah's discipline has been astoundingly bad. The amount of penalties in the first 2 games has got to be a school record. They absolutely have to clean it up by the time conference play rolls around.
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IMO, that wasn't a pick route. That was two BYU DB's covering the same guy. It was a pick route that BYU ran.
 
jazzman12 said:
Count me in. That game definitely wasn't Utah playing a good, complete game. Defense was great, special teams wasn't good considering the long kick return BYU had, Oline was good in pass pro, bad in the run game, RB's weren't good and also gave up a fumble, WR's were good, Huntley was good. For me it comes down to penalties and the "pick" play Utah got called for. I'm sure BYU fans will disagree but there's no way that was a penalty. On the replay you can literally watch the outside BYU DB hesitate on which WR to cover and make the mistake of covering the inside WR. He had as much to do with creating contact as Utah's WR did. Horrible, horrible call that cost Utah a TD. Other than that, Utah's discipline has been astoundingly bad. The amount of penalties in the first 2 games has got to be a school record. They absolutely have to clean it up by the time conference play rolls around.
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Nobody was arguing that utah played a good complete game. Just that they didn't play like crap. Defense, special teams, huntley, the receivers all played too well for the team as a whole to have played like crap.
The refs making a bad call on the pick play doesn't mean that was utah playing like crap imo.... I think that was a good play that the crappy pac12 official blew.

It was a road, rivalry game played with tons of young replacement players with a new offense in the 2nd game of the year. I expected lots of mistakes from the utes. Apparently most ute fans expected a nearly flawless performance and blowout win despite the fact that that almost never happens and Vegas had this game as basically a pick em.
 
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fishonjazz said:
Nobody was arguing that utah played a good complete game. Just that they didn't play like crap. Defense, special teams, huntley, the receivers all played too well for the team as a whole to have played like crap.
The refs making a bad call on the pick play doesn't mean that was utah playing like crap imo.... I think that was a good play that the crappy pac12 official blew.

It was a road, rivalry game played with tons of young replacement players with a new offense in the 2nd game of the year. I expected lots of mistakes from the utes. Apparently most ute fans expected a nearly flawless performance and blowout win despite the fact that that almost never happens and Vegas had this game as basically a pick em.
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I don't expect the Utes to play flawless, but I also think it's fair to call them out for the penalties and lack of discipline. I also think that because of those issues, its fair for Ute fans to come away from that game underwhelmed with the performance. Hell, I forgot to add the countless snaps that were at Huntley's feet that seemed to disrupt the timing of their plays all night long.

I knew it would be ugly to an extent- it always is. That being said, BYU is having offensive struggles that probably rank right up there as some of the worst offensive production in school history. You gotta put a team away in that situation. It seemed like every time Utah put themselves in a position to step on their throat and put the game to bed, a bad snap, a fumble, turnover on downs, or a penalty would inevitably pop up in those moments and breath life back into BYU.

A rivalry win is a rivalry win. I'll never look down on winning 7 straight in this series. But looking forward to the rest of the season, Utah hasn't been good so far and certainly isn't anywhere near where they need to be if they hope to compete in conference. The problems they have are correctable, so I'm not saying the sky is falling, but I certainly think what we saw last Saturday was closer to crap than it was good.
 
On 2nd thought, why am I arguing that the utes looked ok?
You ute fans are right. I agree with you, the utes suck.
 
jazzman12 said:
Wow, nobody said they suck. Way to change the narrative.
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Really, I thought I had.

Utes suck, feel better?



I was talked into watching this game with friends. I can honestly say this was the most boring football game I have watched in a long time. Both teams looked ****ty. Utes qb looked like he has potential. The best player on the field for either team was a Ducks cast off. The only player worth anything for byu was the middle linebacker. Honestly Utah might be pretty bad this year if this game came down to dropped passes by byu to win the game.

Utah had more talent, played better and won the game. That doesn't happen often in this rivalry. Although Utah gave byu a dream scenario. Down by 6 with a couple timeouts, the ball and enough time in the clock to win the game. To bad byu has a ****ty line, no play makers on offense, no receiver with hands, a really really bad offensive coordinator(seriously a 12 year old kid playing Madden could do a better job) and a quarterback that's meh at best.

Hopefully for Utah's sake they just played down to their competition. Which I honestly think might have been the case. It's hard to play well against a team that inept.
 
At least we have this to fall back on :)

https://www.deseretnews.com/article...and-in-the-latest-Best-Colleges-rankings.html
"U.S. News ranks Brigham Young University 61st overall among national universities... Utah ranked 110th (tie) in national universities."

"The rankings were based on points given quantitative and qualitative measures on 15 indicators in seven different, weighted measures. The seven include graduation and retention rates (22.5 percent), undergraduate academic reputation (22.5 percent), faculty resources (20 percent), student selectivity (12.5 percent), financial resources (10 percent), graduation rate performance (7.5 percent) and alumni giving rate (5 percent)."
 
colton said:
At least we have this to fall back on :)

https://www.deseretnews.com/article...and-in-the-latest-Best-Colleges-rankings.html
"U.S. News ranks Brigham Young University 61st overall among national universities... Utah ranked 110th (tie) in national universities."

"The rankings were based on points given quantitative and qualitative measures on 15 indicators in seven different, weighted measures. The seven include graduation and retention rates (22.5 percent), undergraduate academic reputation (22.5 percent), faculty resources (20 percent), student selectivity (12.5 percent), financial resources (10 percent), graduation rate performance (7.5 percent) and alumni giving rate (5 percent)."
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U.S. news is an idiot!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
colton said:
At least we have this to fall back on :)

https://www.deseretnews.com/article...and-in-the-latest-Best-Colleges-rankings.html
"U.S. News ranks Brigham Young University 61st overall among national universities... Utah ranked 110th (tie) in national universities."

"The rankings were based on points given quantitative and qualitative measures on 15 indicators in seven different, weighted measures. The seven include graduation and retention rates (22.5 percent), undergraduate academic reputation (22.5 percent), faculty resources (20 percent), student selectivity (12.5 percent), financial resources (10 percent), graduation rate performance (7.5 percent) and alumni giving rate (5 percent)."
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Yeah, but school rankings are arbitrary and a joke. Plus the numbers are self reported for this ranking...
 
I was at ABG's in Provo for the Provo pride event tonight. The event was fun but it was pretty fun running into a bunch of very drunk Wisconsin fans in Provo, UT. The drunkest city in the US just showed up at the most sober city in the US and had a great time... I hope.
 
I've resigned myself to the fact that BYU's football team is simply awful this year. But congrats to the women's volleyball team for the victory over the Utes yesterday. :)
 
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