Trade Rumors Involving the Jazz

[LogGrad98]

Here is the comparison of Steph to Mitchell for their first 5 seasons per game averages, from BBall reference:



And here is the same comparison of Mitchell to Monta Ellis for their first 5 years:



Now, here they are in their 5th season, for comparison sake of where they got to by their 5th season in the league. Had to run separately because I won't pay $8 to subscribe to stathead.




Definitely a tighter fit to Curry for the first 5 seasons of their careers.

Ellis had a surprisingly good 5th season. But his 5th season he lead the GSW to a 32-50 record, and even worse the season before, at 31-51, which allowed them to draft Curry. He averaged at or over 20 ppg for 6 straight seasons and 6 assists for 4 seasons but never was selected to an all-star game. Mainly because GS sucked at that time.

Of course, in his 5th season, Curry lead his team to a 54-28 record, and a first round exit in his 5th season, and in his very next season lead the team to a 65-17 record and their first championship and his first of 2 consecutive MVPs. I have a hard time seeing Mitchell making that same jump. But you never know I guess.

And Mitchell in his 5th season lead the Jazz to a 56-26 record and a first round exit. What will he do in his 6th season? MVP like Curry? For some reason I just don't see that happening. He may be closer to Curry at the same point in their careers, than he is Ellis, but I just don't see him taking that same leap Curry did in leading a team to such an impressive record and a finals appearance, just one season after he showed he won't play defense when it counts and is the worst closer in the NBA for a star player. Just don't see it.

 

[RandyForRubio]

I could be wrong here... but isn't Beasley more of a spot up shooter guard with decent defense than an iso type player Clarkson is?

Oh. Now you want to look at more than PPG, RPG, and APG. How the turntables have turned.

 

[Elizah Huge]

This has just been painful to read. A lot of people are down on Mitchell and I get it. He’s really ****ing good though. He’s also not Steph. Can we end it at that please.

 

[LoPo]

Oh. Now you want to look at more than PPG, RPG, and APG. How the turntables have turned.

Jeez. Really?

I've been saying for years that I wish Don was allowed to play more PG 3 years ago. It's why I hated the Conley trade (for many reasons). At PG, I think we had a title window we just wasted. HOWEVER, I still have faith in Don and this new supporting cast. I think Beverley, Vanderbilt, Beasley, Clarkson, Bojan, Kessler and company could make a run. Of course I would hold out hope that Conley could be turned into a front court asset that addresses that area.

 

[Elizah Huge]

Jeez. Really?

I've been saying for years that I wish Don was allowed to play more PG 3 years ago. It's why I hated the Conley trade (for many reasons). At PG, I think we had a title window we just wasted. HOWEVER, I still have faith in Don and this new supporting cast. I think Beverley, Vanderbilt, Beasley, Clarkson, Bojan, Kessler and company could make a run. Of course I would hold out hope that Conley could be turned into a front court asset that addresses that area.

The only run this currently constructed team is going on is to the play-in game. If we were serious about building around Donovan we would have went out and got Ayton and then used assets from the Gobert deal. It’s not happening. He’s going to get traded. It sucks but it’s reality and is what is best for us going forward.

 

[MT Steve]

you just highlighted why TS% is a superior stat to eFG. what his injury limited was his athleticism - his TS% jumped so much once he got healthy because he was able to get to the line. his FT rate jumped by about 50% from his first four seasons to the rest of his career. you can't have a complete picture of offensive efficiency if you ignore a guy's ability to shoot and make FTs.

I don't disagree with anything you're saying - I'm just referring to the jump in his EFG% specifically.

 

[Coach Ellis]

I love Donovan Mitchell, but the writing’s on the wall. . . I think his exit is inevitable at this point and it’s best to move on while player and team are still on good terms with each other. I still think, when it’s all said and done that it ends up being 6 picks, 2 swaps, a couple young players and salary matching.

Let Adidas, CAA and the NY fans and media bring the pressure for Leon Rose and James Dolan to come around to that position. Adding Mitchell would be like printing money for the Knicks this year - regardless of how successful the team is.

Another reason to do it now is to avoid the risk of injury before a final deal can be made. It feels like something happens before training camp, but who knows when that actually is.

 

[RandyForRubio]

Jeez. Really?

I've been saying for years that I wish Don was allowed to play more PG 3 years ago. It's why I hated the Conley trade (for many reasons). At PG, I think we had a title window we just wasted. HOWEVER, I still have faith in Don and this new supporting cast. I think Beverley, Vanderbilt, Beasley, Clarkson, Bojan, Kessler and company could make a run. Of course I would hold out hope that Conley could be turned into a front court asset that addresses that area.

I’m just laughing at how you switch your argument for whatever is convenient to what you want the answer to be. You argue like I did back in high school.

 

[The Thriller]

Yeah it will be ugly if we trade Mitchell and keep Beverley for a tank year. He will give the new coach all he can handle. Could be damn ugly.

Yes. Especially since he’s probably older than our coach. Lol. Isn’t our guy something like 35 yrs old? I don’t blame Beverley. He’s got a lot of mileage on those tires and this team should absolutely suck for the foreseeable future. I have no problem trading Beverley to a contender for a draft pick. Think he’d bet us a first rounder or just second rounder?

 

[Engorged On Unborn Gore]

Maybe I'm in the minority here, but I feel like the temper tantrum we just witnessed in defense of DM was better than the last five pay-per-views I participated in. Truly a delicious display of grandstanding and self delusion.

Let my vote be cast in hopes that LoPo stays on this forum forever!

 

[Coach Ellis]

With the Mitchell to Knicks deal currently stalled, I think the Jazz should make a push to trade for Westbrook.

Conley, Clarkson, and Bogdanovic to the Lakers for Westbrook, the Lakers 27 1st round pick (unprotected) and multiple future 2nd round picks (don’t care how many, when or for what value) plus some cash to help offset the immediate buyout.

A.) This gives the Jazz good to great value (depending on that unprotected pick) for three guys who are all 30+ years old and clearly on their way out.

B.) It allows the team to mend some fences with Westbrook by facilitating a quick buyout and letting him go to a team he wants to play for asap.

C.) It keeps the Jazz as the topic of conversation in sports media for having pulled off yet another massive trade this off-season. That also helps to keep the expectations of what they’re eventually going to get from the Knicks sky high.

D.) It can serve as the first domino to fall in the logjam we’re currently seeing. As soon as the Jazz work out a deal with LA, the NY media is going to want some action and attention too. Going ahead with this deal first should put more pressure on the Knicks to match it with their own big move - conveniently teed up and ready for them to pull the trigger.

E.) It also saves the Jazz at least $8.5 million off the salary cap - which can be combined with a Trade Exceptions to add a player in a deadline cap dump to help a team skirt the luxury tax - acquiring another asset in the process.

 

[Elizah Huge]

With the Mitchell to Knicks deal currently stalled, I think the Jazz should make a push to trade for Westbrook.

Conley, Clarkson, and Bogdanovic to the Lakers for Westbrook, the Lakers 27 1st round pick (unprotected) and multiple future 2nd round picks (don’t care how many, when or for what value) plus some cash to help offset the immediate buyout.

A.) This gives the Jazz good to great value (depending on that unprotected pick) for three guys who are all 30+ years old and clearly on their way out.

B.) It allows the team to mend some fences with Westbrook by facilitating a quick buyout and letting him go to a team he wants to play for asap.

C.) It keeps the Jazz as the topic of conversation in sports media for having pulled off yet another massive trade this off-season. That also helps to keep the expectations of what they’re eventually going to get from the Knicks sky high.

D.) It can serve as the first domino to fall in the logjam we’re currently seeing. As soon as the Jazz work out a deal with LA, the NY media is going to want some action and attention too. Going ahead with this deal first should put more pressure on the Knicks to match it with their own big move - conveniently teed up and ready for them to pull the trigger.

E.) It also saves the Jazz at least $8.5 million off the salary cap - which can be combined with a Trade Exceptions to add a player in a deadline cap dump to help a team skirt the luxury tax - acquiring another asset in the process.

I don’t think the Lakers do a deal like that. They are likely looking for savings instead of adding more salary. The extra they’d get from this trade would add like 40M to their salary and luxury tax payment.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I don’t think the Lakers do a deal like that. They are likely looking for savings instead of adding more salary. The extra they’d get from this trade would add like 40M to their salary and luxury tax payment.

We can however... improve their current roster, take Westbrook off their hands, and save them some money... without hurting their FA plans next year. I will be pretty disappointed/shocked if we aren't the team that becomes the facilitator here and gets a couple nice draft picks for our trouble.

 

[Coach Ellis]

I don’t think the Lakers do a deal like that. They are likely looking for savings instead of adding more salary. The extra they’d get from this trade would add like 40M to their salary and luxury tax payment.

Fine. If that’s really an issue for them, get LA to add Talen Horton-Tucker and Stanley Johnson the deal and they end up saving cash and cap.

 

[Elizah Huge]

We can however... improve their current roster, take Westbrook off their hands, and save them some money... without hurting their FA plans next year. I will be pretty disappointed/shocked if we aren't the team that becomes the facilitator here and gets a couple nice draft picks for our trouble.

We can save them a very nice amount while sending expiring contracts. It’s a win-win.

 

[margodydek]

Would you do something like this?

 

[PresidioTrojan]

View attachment 12827
Would you do something like this?

I'd do it. Kill 4 birds with one stone.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

View attachment 12827
Would you do something like this?

Fo sho... though I think it favors Knicks a smidge because I think Randle's deal is pretty negative. Its fair for us so I don't care too much about the Lakers. I could see them wanting Bev or JC or Vando and wanting no Randle.

 

[Elizah Huge]

View attachment 12827
Would you do something like this?

Sure, but again I highly doubt Lakers want to add salary like that.

 

[SoberasHotRod]

View attachment 12827
Would you do something like this?

I'm not sure how the win projections are calculated, but the Lakers go up by 10 wins. That's pretty good. I'm guessing it's mostly based off of moving away from Westbrook and Adding Conley and Bogey.