Utah Jazz sign second-round pick Joel Bolomboy

[Stoked]

Name 5 teams with a better offseason

Hell name 3

God the trolls on this board are so damn annoying


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Log isn't trolling.

This is actually my biggest beef. We didn't even take a step closer to a championship. We took a step sideways, maybe a half step forward. Again. Yet another year with all the same platitudes. But it won't be long and we'll lose Hayward. Then favors. As they search for the ring we don't seem to really care about. Nothing about these moves or this upcoming season is exciting to me. Nothing. So Yay, I guess, that we got a replacement for Burke who is a little bit better. And some vets that can do some things. Yay. I guess. It's just been too many years of mediocrity. I'm ready to really see them try to shake things up and either get us into the top 3 or bottom 3. But hell I just want to see us do SOMETHING!

This was not a side step or a half step forward. This was a major step forward. It clearly puts the Jazz into the next tier. Depending on your rankings it may have even moved the Jazz up 2 tiers.It's not the championship tier but the Jazz have clearly moved forward. And did so in a way that still gives them flexibility going forward.

The Jazz did do something, a major something. This was a fantastic offseason where the Jazz addressed every single need.

Shooting? Check
Vet/Playoff experience? Check
Defense? Check
Maintain cap flexibility? Check
Not kill chemistry? Check
Improve the bench? Check
Ditch Burke? Check
Improve the PG play? Check
Get healthy? Check

Other than non of them being a superstar, which Utah wasn't going to get this year anyways, there is no legit way to really critique this teams offseason moves.

Hypothetical question for you:

Which is closer to a championship, 50 wins and getting to second round of the playoffs or 40 wins and missing the playoffs?

This, major step forward.

 

[silesian]

Shooting? Check
Vet/Playoff experience? Check
Defense? Check
Maintain cap flexibility? Check
Not kill chemistry? Check
Improve the bench? Check
Ditch Burke? Check
Improve the PG play? Check
Get healthy? Check

I'd like to accuse you of plagiarism, but I'm too lazy to find my old post.

 

[Stoked]

I'd like to accuse you of plagiarism, but I'm too lazy to find my old post.

Eh, many of said this before. Glad I'm not alone in seeing the good that was done this offseason.

 

[Thee Jazz Fan]

I'm not saying we are now #2 in the west, but if certain players take a step up in their progression and the newly acquired players don't lay eggs we could be #2 in the west. That alone would jump us into the title conversation without really being contenders in that no one is beating GS. With that said, if offense improves and late 4th quarter defense improves, we may have something.

 

[Thee Jazz Fan]

Log. Just curious to know what u think the Jazz should've done to improve title chances?

 

[Stoked]

I'm not saying we are now #2 in the west, but if certain players take a step up in their progression and the newly acquired players don't lay eggs we could be #2 in the west. That alone would jump us into the title conversation without really being contenders in that no one is beating GS. With that said, if offense improves and late 4th quarter defense improves, we may have something.

I know there are differences between the teams/players/coaching but I'd love to see this GSW team go the way of the Kobe/Shaq/Malone/Payton Lakers.

 

[LogGrad98]

Hypothetical question for you:

Which is closer to a championship, 50 wins and getting to second round of the playoffs or 40 wins and missing the playoffs?

I will answer your question fish since you are one of the few here that are interested in actual discourse. Then I will really answer the question.

Of course making the playoffs is closer than not. It gives you an actual chance to win everything if the cards fall just right.

Now to really answer that question, ask Deron Williams et al who got slapped by the Spurs in the conference finals how close they got to winning the ring. No closer than whoever finished last that year realistically speaking. Then it went downhill from there. I get that the current moves are to incrementally improve us as a team, I am just tired of incrementally never going anywhere. Really the org is shooting for enough wins to fill the seats and get enough TV appearances to keep some money flowing. I do not believe they are committed to winning it all, just to winning enough.

So here is a counterpoint question: how often has "close" or "closer" put a trophy on a shelf? And are you, you personally fish, satisfied with the status quo? That is just out of curiosity.

I used to be happy to see them make moves like they did this year. I have lost confidence in the "rebuilding" process we have been in for, what, 6 years now? Or is it 7 or 8? As I said I think the FO is determined to win as many games as possible as cheaply as possibly and are not committed to winning it all.

 

[LogGrad98]

Hell name 3



Log isn't trolling.



This was not a side step or a half step forward. This was a major step forward. It clearly puts the Jazz into the next tier. Depending on your rankings it may have even moved the Jazz up 2 tiers.It's not the championship tier but the Jazz have clearly moved forward. And did so in a way that still gives them flexibility going forward.

The Jazz did do something, a major something. This was a fantastic offseason where the Jazz addressed every single need.

Shooting? Check
Vet/Playoff experience? Check
Defense? Check
Maintain cap flexibility? Check
Not kill chemistry? Check
Improve the bench? Check
Ditch Burke? Check
Improve the PG play? Check
Get healthy? Check

Other than non of them being a superstar, which Utah wasn't going to get this year anyways, there is no legit way to really critique this teams offseason moves.



This, major step forward.

Well thought-out post, thanks Stoked. And whoever you plagiarized.

I agree that we addressed a lot of needs. The issue is there were so many to address (side-note: it is impossible to address injuries, let's hope we avoid so many of those this next season), and to what level did we address them. Is our shooting now world-class, or is it league average adequate? We got a couple of vets with some playoff experience, but all are realistically peeking over the top of the hill if not outright headed down, how much of a plus is that really? If there is some number line we could add to all this, and 0 is the center point, then in those categories where we were negative, did we just move closer to 0, or did we really make a jump. Be honest about it too. And a few of these remain to be seen. Chemistry? We have been bitten on that front more than once with a new guy who brought vet playoff experience. Get healthy? Sure we get a single player back after season-ending injury, but during the season last year we were something like in the top 3 teams in the league for games lost to injury, NOT counting Exum.

While I agree we made strides in all of these areas, I question how big those strides were, for one thing.

But really what all my rants have been about is that it is getting very old watching us do the same damn thing every single year. A few years ago we added some vets with playoff experience, one who went on to win a ring (Jefferson) proving they were not total crap, and more than one who has gone on to have solid impacts on their NEXT teams. But we were somewhat hopeful when they came in (and more critical, as there was some vocal opposition on this board), but mostly it was viewed as a "solid" move. A solid move that got us nowhere.

I am ready to watch the front office go nuts, throw everything at the wall to see what sticks, and, as I have stated in other posts, move us solidly either into the top 3 or bottom 3. Go for the gold. Stop *****-footing around and do something different. I would at least like to have read somewhere something like KD went to the Warriors despite the fact that the Jazz threw everything but the kitchen sink at him. Something to generate some headlines that we are hitting away, not just bunting again. I know the options this season were limited, but maybe a little shake-up would light a fire. Let the team know everyone is up for grabs if they don't put it in gear and really hit the ground running. But I will be a pretty disenchanted fan to see another just-miss lower teens pick. Time to **** or get off the pot.

 

[Stoked]

I will answer your question fish since you are one of the few here that are interested in actual discourse. Then I will really answer the question.

Of course making the playoffs is closer than not. It gives you an actual chance to win everything if the cards fall just right.

Now to really answer that question, ask Deron Williams et al who got slapped by the Spurs in the conference finals how close they got to winning the ring. No closer than whoever finished last that year realistically speaking. Then it went downhill from there. I get that the current moves are to incrementally improve us as a team, I am just tired of incrementally never going anywhere. Really the org is shooting for enough wins to fill the seats and get enough TV appearances to keep some money flowing. I do not believe they are committed to winning it all, just to winning enough.

So here is a counterpoint question: how often has "close" or "closer" put a trophy on a shelf? And are you, you personally fish, satisfied with the status quo? That is just out of curiosity.

I used to be happy to see them make moves like they did this year. I have lost confidence in the "rebuilding" process we have been in for, what, 6 years now? Or is it 7 or 8? As I said I think the FO is determined to win as many games as possible as cheaply as possibly and are not committed to winning it all.

Not directed at me but I want to answer anyways (shocker I know).

I truly do not see, nor understand those who do, this as the status quo. This is the continuation of a build of a team that they are trying to win a championship with. Utah is unlikely to land a superstar. But having a good team that a Superstar could come in and lead increases our chances.

Now I wish this year had been last year but aside from a very select few teams Utah is right up there.

It seems like you are looking at it as a two tier league.

1. True contenders
2. Mediocrity

I don't see it that way. Utah is making solid moves to get this team into the playoffs and get that experience. Than you see how you measure up and change what you can to get over that hump. This is exactly where we want to be (short of being title contenders of course).

A superstar is not coming here just to come here. So we have to find other ways to get to the peak. Through the draft, coaching and smart team building is our most likely chance to do that.

 

[Stoked]

Well thought-out post, thanks Stoked. And whoever you plagiarized.

I agree that we addressed a lot of needs. The issue is there were so many to address (side-note: it is impossible to address injuries, let's hope we avoid so many of those this next season), and to what level did we address them. Is our shooting now world-class, or is it league average adequate? We got a couple of vets with some playoff experience, but all are realistically peeking over the top of the hill if not outright headed down, how much of a plus is that really? If there is some number line we could add to all this, and 0 is the center point, then in those categories where we were negative, did we just move closer to 0, or did we really make a jump. Be honest about it too. And a few of these remain to be seen. Chemistry? We have been bitten on that front more than once with a new guy who brought vet playoff experience. Get healthy? Sure we get a single player back after season-ending injury, but during the season last year we were something like in the top 3 teams in the league for games lost to injury, NOT counting Exum.

While I agree we made strides in all of these areas, I question how big those strides were, for one thing.

But really what all my rants have been about is that it is getting very old watching us do the same damn thing every single year. A few years ago we added some vets with playoff experience, one who went on to win a ring (Jefferson) proving they were not total crap, and more than one who has gone on to have solid impacts on their NEXT teams. But we were somewhat hopeful when they came in (and more critical, as there was some vocal opposition on this board), but mostly it was viewed as a "solid" move. A solid move that got us nowhere.

I am ready to watch the front office go nuts, throw everything at the wall to see what sticks, and, as I have stated in other posts, move us solidly either into the top 3 or bottom 3. Go for the gold. Stop *****-footing around and do something different. I would at least like to have read somewhere something like KD went to the Warriors despite the fact that the Jazz threw everything but the kitchen sink at him. Something to generate some headlines that we are hitting away, not just bunting again. I know the options this season were limited, but maybe a little shake-up would light a fire. Let the team know everyone is up for grabs if they don't put it in gear and really hit the ground running. But I will be a pretty disenchanted fan to see another just-miss lower teens pick. Time to **** or get off the pot.

The only real way to address injuries is avoid injury plagued players and improve your depth and hope. For the most part Utah has done this.

The older vets will give our core playoff experience and most are on short (1-2 year contracts). Than they will be the playoff vets and we can bring in the pieces missing at that time.

As for shooting, I'd say above league average but not yet elite.

As for moving into the top 3, I think we all agree that we want to be there. But it is extremely hard to get there at all and even hard for a team like Utah. The FO put is in the group right below them IMO and in our best chance in a long time to get into that elite group of true contenders.

It will never be easy or quick to jump into the true elite one season to the next for Utah. But I truly feel this is our best chance we have had to get there since the end of the 98 season.

I agree that the FO should let the team know that we are in the pursuit of a title and nothing less is acceptable.

But with this team you know have an attractive offer to throw in with that kitchen sink at a Superstar. You have elite D, good shooting, play makers, youth, speed and hunger.

 

[LogGrad98]

Realistically it is a 2-tier league.

And I agree we need to make a team that a super-star would want to join, but unless that is the target I don't see much this season to wet my panties over. Modest improvements are nice and all, we can win a few more games and maybe get to the playoffs. But that will be about it. And that is the status-quo I was referring to. Maybe a cycle is a better term. We put together a group of scrappy youngsters, they get everyone excited, they go nowhere, we add some "vets" with "play-off experience", they again go nowhere. Our scrappy youngsters become too expensive (e.g. Milsap and Jefferson together) and we either let them go or we make trades for picks. Then we put together a new group of scrappy youngsters and get excited. Wash and repeat.

 

[LogGrad98]

duplicate post....still having problems with full in-boxes or whatever that was causing these?