What is going on with Collier?

[Tanktastic]

It’s wild how hard some fans here criticize young players just starting their first year. Why expect these kids to run already when they can hardly crawl yet? Learning the NBA ropes takes at least three years for most. Yeah, there are exceptions, but those are rare.

There are players that are solid contributors on solid teams as rookies already. Or at least showing signs of growth. While others are pretty much the worst player in the whole league getting consistent minutes. It's not the expectation to be a star as a rookie, but not embarrass yourself in relation to the rest of the draft class.

Why not try a lineup of summer league and two way players: Potter, Oscar, Davy Jones, Kessler, Juzang, Collier, Cody, Flip, Key and Brice? This would give development. Let Lauri, the two JCs, Svi, Sexton and Eubanks heal their contusions.

Because the players aren't in on it. And the NBA and the Players Association will come down on the franchise should they try.

And losing by 50 every night certainly wouldn't "give development" to anyone. Quite the opposite.

 

[The Jazz Wonderbra]

Collier has flashes as a true point guard. He reads situations well. There is a lot to like about him.

Great frame
Elite speed
Toughness
Exciting defender. He wins battles no one should be winning regularly

There is a lot to not like.

ELITE terrible shooter. I mean, next level bad. He cannot shoot straight. He is left super wide open and has hit the top left corner of the backboard what, 3 times?

The game is coming so fast for him that he somehow manages turnovers when they are almost hard to get.

 

[The Jazz Wonderbra]

Collier at his VERY best could be a light Marcus smart. A pissy, defense first, bowling ball who makes just enough shots to be valuable and who competes on every play.

That is a comp based on his body type, play style, best characteristics... not his per 36 stats.

 

[The Jazz Wonderbra]

He could also EASILY be out of the league like most players in 3 years because he couldn't shoot. But he is definitely getting a chance many dream of but never get.

 

[underdog]

There are players that are solid contributors on solid teams as rookies already. Or at least showing signs of growth. While others are pretty much the worst player in the whole league getting consistent minutes. It's not the expectation to be a star as a rookie, but not embarrass yourself in relation to the rest of the draft class.


Because the players aren't in on it. And the NBA and the Players Association will come down on the franchise should they try.

And losing by 50 every night certainly wouldn't "give development" to anyone. Quite the opposite.

Nah. It’s always been the same. Rookies play like rookies and develop at different paces. We don’t know yet what Cody and Collier will become—solid players or busts. No one knows. To say otherwise, after just a couple of months in, doesn’t make much sense.

 

[jazznik]

Collier has flashes as a true point guard. He reads situations well. There is a lot to like about him.

He reads the situations well?! Collier has one of the highest turnover rates for all NBA players: the only players turning the ball more than him are several clumsy bigs. He constantly misreads the situations and makes wrong passes that nobody can catch.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

He reads situations well.

lmfao

He does not read situations at all.

He's got great downhill speed and strength, that's about it at this point. When he accidentally leverages those to his advantage, he can make a play here and there, but his reads are bottom of the barrel.

He's absolute ***, and that's fine. He was a bad college player who decided to declare because he wanted to go pro. He got lucky he got a guaranteed first round deal. He shouldnt have come out in terms of his development process, but he did, so hopefully it works out, but I doubt the Jazz will give him a huge leash if he doesnt show some significant improvement next year, especially if they draft another PG in next year's draft.

 

[homeytennis]

lmfao

He does not read situations at all.

He's got great downhill speed and strength, that's about it at this point. When he accidentally leverages those to his advantage, he can make a play here and there, but his reads are bottom of the barrel.

He's absolute ***, and that's fine. He was a bad college player who decided to declare because he wanted to go pro. He got lucky he got a guaranteed first round deal. He shouldnt have come out in terms of his development process, but he did, so hopefully it works out, but I doubt the Jazz will give him a huge leash if he doesnt show some significant improvement next year, especially if they draft another PG in next year's draft.

Holy Jared Butler Batman.

 

[jazznik]

One of the things that annoys me about Collier is his frequent probing dribbling inside. He is not Steve Nash: his dribbling is slow and prone to turnovers, he is no threat to explode to the rim or pull up for a jump shot. He usually ends it by passing it back to someone on the perimeter who is not in the greatest position. By contrast, Keyonte is usually waiting with the ball on the perimeter for someone to get open inside or, when he goes in he goes fast and furious and collapses the defense.

 

[homeytennis]

One of the things that annoys me about Collier is his frequent probing dribbling inside. He is not Steve Nash: his dribbling is slow and prone to turnovers, he is no threat to explode to the rim or pull up for a jump shot. He usually ends it by passing it back to someone on the perimeter who is not in the greatest position. By contrast, Keyonte is usually waiting with the ball on the perimeter for someone to get open inside or, when he goes in he goes fast and furious and collapses the defense.

Key ain't no point guard.

 

[jazznik]

Key ain't no point guard.

And that makes the fact that Keyonte is much better than Collier at setting up his teammates and reading the situations especially disappointing.

 

[The Jazz Wonderbra]

By 'reads situations' I mean... he is reading the defenders and trying to play off of them. If you can't see what he is trying to do, then you don't understand basketball. He pulls defenders away from where he wants to pass the ball regularly. He is constantly TRYING to set people up. Keyonte, on the other hand, gets the ball and decides between shoot or drive. A total lack of awareness of others and how to set them up for easy buckets. Collier isn't even hardly ever looking to shoot. He wants to penetrate and dish.

Because he SUCKS at shooting and he really isn't a great threat at the rim either, teams just lay off of him and dare him beat them - even in the paint. So, when he penetrates, he isn't pulling defenders to him and he regularly runs out of options. The option he DOES NOT want (shoot) is the one teams are giving him.

So, he isn't able to play his game at the NBA level, but clearly that ability to read defenders, pull defenders, and set guys up is the style that he WANTS to play. The speed of play is not helping him do it.