Your off-season grades for D.L. and the Jazz (Poll)
- Thread starter Release the Kraken
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Most of the time they turn into 2nd round picks, if he's on court it means he's making bad decisions and taking lots of bad shots. He's not exactly a ball hawk at the other end either.
D
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Discounting Hayward, Donovan Mitchell plus Rubio make us an A
two solid wing pick ups were what I was waiting on
yea I'm optimistic just cuz, we didn't overspend on Hill, retained Ingles. NWG and Bradley might be two f ups tho
two solid wing pick ups were what I was waiting on
yea I'm optimistic just cuz, we didn't overspend on Hill, retained Ingles. NWG and Bradley might be two f ups tho
fishonjazz
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Players have been known to improve doe.
Plus he can always give away some picks with burks later anyway. In fact maybe burks gets more valuable without even touching the floor cause some teams seek out expiring contracts.
Maybe in 2 years the jazz can trade him to someone who wants an expiring contract and actually get something for him.
I think a lot of people are sleeping on the impact Ricky Rubio has, especially the ones predicting the Jazz to finish below .500. I think if he has a great coach and is given reigns, he has near star impact. Getting him for a late future first was an absolute steal.
I don't fault DL for making his best effort to keep Hayward, even though it ended up costing us opportunities at better SF's in free agency. He made the best out of everything that he had control over, which doesn't include Hayward's decision.
I don't fault DL for making his best effort to keep Hayward, even though it ended up costing us opportunities at better SF's in free agency. He made the best out of everything that he had control over, which doesn't include Hayward's decision.
I wrote this different times during the season, huge miscalculation by the Jazz front office.
The people that think the Jazz should've traded Hayward to Boston mid-season have apparently already forgotten how stingy Ainge was over trading any decent assets for Paul George or Jimmy Butler.
If they knew they were going to get Hayward in free agency, why would they give up good assets for him a few months earlier?
If they knew they were going to get Hayward in free agency, why would they give up good assets for him a few months earlier?
Handlogten's Heros
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He did what he could on Hayward. I like all the other deals.
I'd say a B right now, but if he can get Hood and Exum extended on decent contracts... say less than $30M or less annually combined.
I'd say a B right now, but if he can get Hood and Exum extended on decent contracts... say less than $30M or less annually combined.
It makes sense what you wrote but if they really knew it then Hayward has been unfair towards the Jazz.
Handlogten's Heros
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I'm kind of sure this is the case. Stevens and G would have dinner and stuff when visiting. You don't think they ever discussed this stuff.
I think he's known which way he was leaning for a long time. I also don't think we should have traded him unless he told us he was out.
Trade Hayward and forget 50 wins and the 2nd round of the playoffs. It was a good season. Typical off-season. Hopefully Rudy and someone else can become the uber talented and hardworking Jazz-lifers the team's been looking for since Stockton and Malone. I think Hayward will continue to be great and even improve at Butler as I feel he has a tremendous dedication to his craft these days. Just didn't have that Jazz loyalty. The model remains the same. Management meticulous and methodical as ever - really impressed by this current GM and head coach.
Release the Kraken
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Well I kind of assumed that a B- would be virtually the same as a C+. Course my main reference was music where a C sharp is the same as a D flat (key of C). Course by that logic, in the key of A I'd have to go two and one half, three and one half giving me only a C sharp (-) only.....never mind, next time, sorry about that
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Douchebag K
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If DL thought there was a reasonable and realistic chance Hayward would stay he had to roll the dice. He was looking at a potential 60 win team. It'll be interesting to hear him interviewed a bit further down the road as to what he was being told.
regarding Ingle's contract .. you're discounting the fact that he's now likely to be a starter for us this year. I'm living in 2017-18 As far as Lyles goes that's a bummer, i had high hopes for him as well but if you have a guy who completely drops his bundle when the going gets tough, that's not something that a professional sports team can tolerate. Shame really. Maybe when he grows up he might develop a work ethic, and he may not be a bust. But his attitude from all reports was pretty shocking for a young pro athlete.
Ya Hill was the perfect fit, when i heard Rubio i was a bit meh .. but i think he'll be a terrific player for us as long as his shooting is something like last year.
The singular thing i'm really excited about for next season is i think the team chemistry looks to be awesome. All these guys brought in seem to be very much invested in TEAM unlike Sprayward and Spill who were thinking about themselves. I think we'll be fun to watch.
Release the Kraken
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Excellent reading, thx for the feedback. Everybody backed up their opinions well as far as I could tell.
So anyway, I gave DL and the Jazz B+ as I said before. Excellent draft moves. I mean we biach slapped Denver again!!! But it's not just Mitchell that I think we scored big on, I may be the biggest fan around here of Mr Bradley. I think he's going to be an impact player as well when he completely grows into his body. He's just so fundamentally sound, got all the low post moves, keeps the ball up, great offensive rebounder. He just reminds me so much of a young Tim Duncan it's not even funny. So there's that.
As some of you have said, I thought the FO should have been a little more prepared, a little less complacent about the possibility of Hayward leaving. If they had of been maybe we could have worked out a sign and trade or at least picked off a top FA ourselves like Porter or Gallinari. That being said, DL really surprised me in the eleventh hour of free agency with the pieces he did pick up. Maybe it's for the best that we didn't spend a lot on one guy but instead got three guys that can improve our depth considerably at three different positions. Udoh's going to be a beast off the bench - what an upgrade over Whithey. I absolutely love the Jerebko pick-up. I think he's going to be the best stretch four we've had since Marvin Williams and I think he's better than Williams. I'm sure Sefolosha will be fine, but I can't deny that I would have been happier with Mbah a Moute who had better numbers last year, is younger and signed for less money. Course I've seen a lot more of Mbah a Moute than Sefolosha the last couple years living here in Nevada where we get the LA feeds with the package.
Regarding Ingles, I really think we paid market value or perhaps slightly below. I think we're a little spoiled here with what he's been getting and perhaps a little pejorative regarding his abilities. It doesn't help that he used to go by Slow Mo either. Other teams know how good this guy really is, maybe more than some Jazz fans do.
Rubio? Guy's kind of a question mark to me, but then so was Hill when he arrived last season. I know he's a great passer and plays great D, just a little concerned about him sticking that J when teams sag off. Still he's in some rarified air when it comes to assists and steals along with Stock and Paul and he's kind of an international sensation so I'm reserving judgement.
B+ and I predict we make the playoffs.
So anyway, I gave DL and the Jazz B+ as I said before. Excellent draft moves. I mean we biach slapped Denver again!!! But it's not just Mitchell that I think we scored big on, I may be the biggest fan around here of Mr Bradley. I think he's going to be an impact player as well when he completely grows into his body. He's just so fundamentally sound, got all the low post moves, keeps the ball up, great offensive rebounder. He just reminds me so much of a young Tim Duncan it's not even funny. So there's that.
As some of you have said, I thought the FO should have been a little more prepared, a little less complacent about the possibility of Hayward leaving. If they had of been maybe we could have worked out a sign and trade or at least picked off a top FA ourselves like Porter or Gallinari. That being said, DL really surprised me in the eleventh hour of free agency with the pieces he did pick up. Maybe it's for the best that we didn't spend a lot on one guy but instead got three guys that can improve our depth considerably at three different positions. Udoh's going to be a beast off the bench - what an upgrade over Whithey. I absolutely love the Jerebko pick-up. I think he's going to be the best stretch four we've had since Marvin Williams and I think he's better than Williams. I'm sure Sefolosha will be fine, but I can't deny that I would have been happier with Mbah a Moute who had better numbers last year, is younger and signed for less money. Course I've seen a lot more of Mbah a Moute than Sefolosha the last couple years living here in Nevada where we get the LA feeds with the package.
Regarding Ingles, I really think we paid market value or perhaps slightly below. I think we're a little spoiled here with what he's been getting and perhaps a little pejorative regarding his abilities. It doesn't help that he used to go by Slow Mo either. Other teams know how good this guy really is, maybe more than some Jazz fans do.
Rubio? Guy's kind of a question mark to me, but then so was Hill when he arrived last season. I know he's a great passer and plays great D, just a little concerned about him sticking that J when teams sag off. Still he's in some rarified air when it comes to assists and steals along with Stock and Paul and he's kind of an international sensation so I'm reserving judgement.
B+ and I predict we make the playoffs.
Release the Kraken
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So David Aldridge had us at #21 in the league (bottom ten) for offseason rankings - http://www.nba.com/morning-tip-da-2017-offseason-rankings-bottom-10-teams
So I'm assuming, based on thirty teams, that's about a D grade Kind of dismisses Ingles in the section entitled unnamed small forward and gives Hill the nod over Rubio in scoring (agree) and defense (disagree).
21. UTAH JAZZ
2016-17 RECORD: 51-31, lost in Western Conference semifinals
ADDED: G Ricky Rubio (acquired from Minnesota); G Thabo Sefolosha (two years, $11 million); F Jonas Jerebko (two years, $8.2 million); F Ekpe Udoh (two years, $6.5 million); G/F Royce O’Neal (three years, $3.8 million); G Donovan Mitchell (No. 13 pick, 2017 Draft); C Tony Bradley (No. 28 pick, 2017 Draft; Rights acquired from Lakers)
LOST: F Gordon Hayward (signed with Boston); G George Hill (signed with Sacramento); F Trey Lyles (traded to Denver); F Tyler Lydon (Draft rights traded to Denver); G Josh Hart (Draft rights traded to Lakers); C Thomas Bryant (Draft rights traded to Lakers); F Boris Diaw (waived); C Jeff Withey (renounced)
RETAINED: F Joe Ingles (four years, $52 million)
THE KEY MAN: Unnamed Starting Small Forward. No one is going to make up Hayward’s 21.9 points, 5.4 boards and 3.5 assists by himself. Coach Quin Snyder could go traditional and pick Sefolosha, a starter on several good Oklahoma City teams through 2014, or go small(er) ball with the likes of Rodney Hood at the three. He could, conceivably, even opt for 71-year-old Joe Johnson in a pinch. The point is, the Jazz will have to depend on several folks throughout the lineup -- and not just at small forward -- to replace what Hayward brought to the table every night.
THE SKINNY: No matter the spin -- and Utah did very well after July 4 to fill out its roster -- losing an All-Star and franchise player in Hayward cancels out any notion that the Jazz had a “good” offseason. Rubio, acquired before Hayward left, is a valid replacement player for the departed George Hill at the point; Rubio’s a better passer (though Hill is a better scorer and defender). Jerebko is a smart and tough player. Sefolosha is still a plus defender. Udoh had a great season playing abroad. And keeping Ingles in the fold was key. But Hayward did so many seen and unseen things to lift Utah to where it was when he left -- a team that was ready to be a perennial top-four squad in the west. He had become a go-to guy, a beast of a scorer, a more than willing rebounder, a leader, all of it. It’s a gut punch, pure and simple. Maneuvering on Draft night to get Mitchell could turn out to be huge; he was electric at the Summer League and looks like he could play rotation minutes immediately. And maybe Joe Johnson’s got a few more Iso Joes in him. But Utah’s taken a step back. Bottom line.
So I'm assuming, based on thirty teams, that's about a D grade Kind of dismisses Ingles in the section entitled unnamed small forward and gives Hill the nod over Rubio in scoring (agree) and defense (disagree).
21. UTAH JAZZ
2016-17 RECORD: 51-31, lost in Western Conference semifinals
ADDED: G Ricky Rubio (acquired from Minnesota); G Thabo Sefolosha (two years, $11 million); F Jonas Jerebko (two years, $8.2 million); F Ekpe Udoh (two years, $6.5 million); G/F Royce O’Neal (three years, $3.8 million); G Donovan Mitchell (No. 13 pick, 2017 Draft); C Tony Bradley (No. 28 pick, 2017 Draft; Rights acquired from Lakers)
LOST: F Gordon Hayward (signed with Boston); G George Hill (signed with Sacramento); F Trey Lyles (traded to Denver); F Tyler Lydon (Draft rights traded to Denver); G Josh Hart (Draft rights traded to Lakers); C Thomas Bryant (Draft rights traded to Lakers); F Boris Diaw (waived); C Jeff Withey (renounced)
RETAINED: F Joe Ingles (four years, $52 million)
THE KEY MAN: Unnamed Starting Small Forward. No one is going to make up Hayward’s 21.9 points, 5.4 boards and 3.5 assists by himself. Coach Quin Snyder could go traditional and pick Sefolosha, a starter on several good Oklahoma City teams through 2014, or go small(er) ball with the likes of Rodney Hood at the three. He could, conceivably, even opt for 71-year-old Joe Johnson in a pinch. The point is, the Jazz will have to depend on several folks throughout the lineup -- and not just at small forward -- to replace what Hayward brought to the table every night.
THE SKINNY: No matter the spin -- and Utah did very well after July 4 to fill out its roster -- losing an All-Star and franchise player in Hayward cancels out any notion that the Jazz had a “good” offseason. Rubio, acquired before Hayward left, is a valid replacement player for the departed George Hill at the point; Rubio’s a better passer (though Hill is a better scorer and defender). Jerebko is a smart and tough player. Sefolosha is still a plus defender. Udoh had a great season playing abroad. And keeping Ingles in the fold was key. But Hayward did so many seen and unseen things to lift Utah to where it was when he left -- a team that was ready to be a perennial top-four squad in the west. He had become a go-to guy, a beast of a scorer, a more than willing rebounder, a leader, all of it. It’s a gut punch, pure and simple. Maneuvering on Draft night to get Mitchell could turn out to be huge; he was electric at the Summer League and looks like he could play rotation minutes immediately. And maybe Joe Johnson’s got a few more Iso Joes in him. But Utah’s taken a step back. Bottom line.
Douchebag K
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I beg to differ with part of your post. Clearly Rudy was and is our franchise player.