I agree with you but the numbers say otherwise.
Is Gordon Hayward overrated?
- Thread starter Stifle Tower
- Start date
I agree with you but the numbers say otherwise.
l Abach l
Well-Known Member
It's funny how malleable and easily deceived (some members) of a fan base, who watched their team get steamrolled by The GOAT, Michael Jordan, are....
I wonder how that could've happened in just 20 years.. Why would they place their faith in Hayward so easily?? The west is stronger now then it ever was..
Some of y'all act like this dude is Prime Tracy McGrady, he's echelons below...
How'd the standards get this low?? Is Al Jefferson still to blame?? Hayward isn't even close to as good (for Utah) as prime Deron.. How has that been lost in these conversations??
Same folks still trying to spin Hayward conversations into Burks vs Hayward discussions when Burks is already on-board for the next bunch of years, at an agreeable/reasonable salary for his age/talent/role/production.
These are some of the same folks that were breaking teenage Andrew Wiggins chops over lack of Killer Instinct.. right??? These are the people here giving 26 year old, highest-paid on the team, Hayward a pass, even calling him underrated.. It's totally disingenuous.. almost makes me think he's getting the benefit of the doubt because he's 'homegrown' and white..
I wonder if some of you truly see what it takes to actually win in the NBA?? It's much more than stats and efficiency, you still need to, as a team, will it to be so.. With Hayward as the top option on this team, that means 'the others' (who are all young as ****) have the option to make it happen themselves, or defer to Hayward (Or Favors) who aren't all that much better than a coinflip in big spots..
Luckily the FO knows this and has tweaked the roster so it's not set up to be made or broken by Hayward.. He's forced their hand to prepare themselves for him to leave after next season. With Hood here, Burks on a reasonable deal for 3 more seasons, multiple draft picks and capspace, they've done a better job than anyone could've expected.
"Pressure burts pipes, but it also buffs diamonds" Hayward has shown signs of bursting under not even all that much pressure, he's 26.. chances are he' a good, not great player and will remain as such..
Stephen Curry really started to break out near when he was about Haywards age, that's a bigtime outlier though..
Bravo. Incredible post!!!
Not sure how I missed that post. It is a good one.
It's funny how malleable and easily deceived (some members) of a fan base, who watched their team get steamrolled by The GOAT, Michael Jordan, are....
I wonder how that could've happened in just 20 years.. Why would they place their faith in Hayward so easily
Some of y'all act like this dude is Prime Tracy McGrady, he's echelons below...
How'd the standards get this low?? Is Al Jefferson still to blame?? Hayward isn't even close to as good (for Utah) as prime Deron.. How has that been lost in these conversations
Same folks still trying to spin Hayward conversations into Burks vs Hayward discussions when Burks is already on-board for the next bunch of years, at an agreeable/reasonable salary for his age/talent/role/production.
These are some of the same folks that were breaking teenage Andrew Wiggins chops over lack of Killer Instinct.. right??? These are the people here giving 26 year old, highest-paid on the team, Hayward a pass, even calling him underrated.. It's totally disingenuous.. almost makes me think he's getting the benefit of the doubt because he's 'homegrown' and white..
I wonder if some of you truly see what it takes to actually win in the NBA?? It's much more than stats and efficiency, you still need to, as a team, will it to be so.. With Hayward as the top option on this team, that means 'the others' (who are all young as ****) have the option to make it happen themselves, or defer to Hayward (Or Favors) who aren't all that much better than a coinflip in big spots..
Luckily the FO knows this and has tweaked the roster so it's not set up to be made or broken by Hayward.. He's forced their hand to prepare themselves for him to leave after next season. With Hood here, Burks on a reasonable deal for 3 more seasons, multiple draft picks and capspace, they've done a better job than anyone could've expected.
"Pressure burts pipes, but it also buffs diamonds" Hayward has shown signs of bursting under not even all that much pressure, he's 26.. chances are he' a good, not great player and will remain as such..
Stephen Curry really started to break out near when he was about Haywards age, that's a bigtime outlier though..
"But Dante Exum is coming back and Alec Burks isn't injuried any more! 2004 Detroit Pistons baby!"
Ellipse
Well-Known Member
It's funny how malleable and easily deceived (some members) of a fan base, who watched their team get steamrolled by The GOAT, Michael Jordan, are....
I wonder how that could've happened in just 20 years.. Why would they place their faith in Hayward so easily
Some of y'all act like this dude is Prime Tracy McGrady, he's echelons below...
How'd the standards get this low?? Is Al Jefferson still to blame?? Hayward isn't even close to as good (for Utah) as prime Deron.. How has that been lost in these conversations
Same folks still trying to spin Hayward conversations into Burks vs Hayward discussions when Burks is already on-board for the next bunch of years, at an agreeable/reasonable salary for his age/talent/role/production.
These are some of the same folks that were breaking teenage Andrew Wiggins chops over lack of Killer Instinct.. right??? These are the people here giving 26 year old, highest-paid on the team, Hayward a pass, even calling him underrated.. It's totally disingenuous.. almost makes me think he's getting the benefit of the doubt because he's 'homegrown' and white..
I wonder if some of you truly see what it takes to actually win in the NBA?? It's much more than stats and efficiency, you still need to, as a team, will it to be so.. With Hayward as the top option on this team, that means 'the others' (who are all young as ****) have the option to make it happen themselves, or defer to Hayward (Or Favors) who aren't all that much better than a coinflip in big spots..
Luckily the FO knows this and has tweaked the roster so it's not set up to be made or broken by Hayward.. He's forced their hand to prepare themselves for him to leave after next season. With Hood here, Burks on a reasonable deal for 3 more seasons, multiple draft picks and capspace, they've done a better job than anyone could've expected.
"Pressure burts pipes, but it also buffs diamonds" Hayward has shown signs of bursting under not even all that much pressure, he's 26.. chances are he' a good, not great player and will remain as such..
Stephen Curry really started to break out near when he was about Haywards age, that's a bigtime outlier though..
What a bunch of drivel. Hayward IS the best player on this team; the problem is that he isn't a top ten player, maybe not even top 30, in the league. That isn't his problem, it is the team's problem and Lindsay needs to fix it. Dumping Hayward isn't going to make the team better, because it is not at small forward where we are hurting.
We need better options at the 2; Hood is okay for a starter, but I think we can do better than Burks -- hard to say, since Burks seems injured all of the time. And there is no point in even commenting on our point guard play; maybe Exum will fix it and maybe he won't.
I like Favors and Lyles, but I can't help but wonder if Gobert really is our future. Gobert's development regressed from where he ended last year.
So if we want to talk about which player is overrated by the majority of posters on this board, then my vote is for Rudy Gobert!
akirac73
Well-Known Member
Nice try, but you're wrong as usual (unless you're using some sort of unusual parameter for "clutch minutes" skewed to make Hayward look good)
According to NBA.com, 2015-16 REGULAR SEASON CLUTCH TRADITIONAL STATS:
Last 1 minute of the game, score within 5 pts...
Hayward: 39.4% FG, 23.5% 3PT
Hood: 39.1% FG, 26.9% 3PT
(our best clutch player) Burks: 52% FG, 42.9% 3PT
https://stats.nba.com/league/player...ype=Regular Season&Period=4&TeamID=1610612762
Basically, Hayward and Hood are about the same in the clutch. I don't know how the hell you came up with 56% shooting for Hayward...LOL. Nice try.
https://www.nbaminer.com/nbaminer_nbaminer/clutch_player_stats.php?order=alastmin_fgm
And when you run the final minute of game within 5 points on NBA.com it shows Hayward at 50% not 39%. The link you provided shows within 5 points with 5 minutes or less left.
ghsartin
Well-Known Member
Let's be honest. They are all overrated.
Favors, Hayward, Burks, Gobert...
We love them, but they arent what we need them to be. Not yet at least.
If think you are on to something here. I think league-wise they are rated correctly, but as fans we tend to overrate them somewhat. We root for Hayward and hope that he'll carry the team deep into the playoffs, but would be more reasonable to think of him as an smart player who is a borderline all-star but lacks the overall athleticism and shooting touch to be a go-to player. Also, he seems to have peaked. People here usually talk about Favors like he is Anthony Davis but he is older and smaller than Davis, has serious problems with his back and - more important - no inside game whatsoever. Because of his physical ailments, he seems close to his peak also. Burks doesn't seem smart enough to be a good player if he loses some of his athleticism but many people here still seems to hope he turns into Dwyane Wade. I guess we'll find that out for good next year. Gobert is probably going to be the best Jazz center ever - which is not saying much. Both his offense and defense are bound to improve a little with better strenght and conditioning and that's pretty much it. He doesn't seem coordinated enought to be more than a Dikembe Mutombo with better passing and worse post game.
FalseFlagg K
Well-Known Member
of course it's an insane amount of money. 10 million or whatever it's all insane.
Don't let the door hit you on the way out.
So this season Hayward played the second most total minutes, he also traveled the second most distance in the game total in the season. On offense he is running all over the place. Previous season he was 12th and the season before he was 10th in distance traveled for the season. I know he lead the league at a couple points in all three seasons . Even on a per game he is in the top 5 for the past 3 seasons.
Hayward is also getting physically beat up each game. He is always getting grabbed, pushed bumped and everything else.
Simply put it he is getting run ragged and beat down every game. Its no wonder he had no lift at the end of the season. Towards the end most of the time in the paint he was shooting flat footed. In end game situations he looks tired. This team is using and leaning on him more than most if not any team in the NBA does on 1 player. Hayward needs help and he needs to play less and he needs defenses to be required to defend and worry about other players on the court. I think Haywards 3 point shot is inconsistent because he rarely gets his legs under him. On a side note it is a miracle he has not been more injured the last three years.
He is asked to do more than Lebron, Durant and most the other star players even though he is not at their talent level.
Hayward is also getting physically beat up each game. He is always getting grabbed, pushed bumped and everything else.
Simply put it he is getting run ragged and beat down every game. Its no wonder he had no lift at the end of the season. Towards the end most of the time in the paint he was shooting flat footed. In end game situations he looks tired. This team is using and leaning on him more than most if not any team in the NBA does on 1 player. Hayward needs help and he needs to play less and he needs defenses to be required to defend and worry about other players on the court. I think Haywards 3 point shot is inconsistent because he rarely gets his legs under him. On a side note it is a miracle he has not been more injured the last three years.
He is asked to do more than Lebron, Durant and most the other star players even though he is not at their talent level.
Lakers_Slapper
Well-Known Member
Lets leave the mothers out of this.