Horse-****. Show me one.
2011 NBA Free Agent List
- Thread starter Beantown
- Start date
It's not just about passing, it's that he is behind the play and reacting slow constantly, and he takes up an acre inside, so the offense stops half the time. The argument that Jefferson will suddenly learn how to play in an offense and pass well is an even worse one than that Jimmer will suddenly play defense well on his first attempt in the NBA.
Anyway, we don't agree on Jefferson, and there is nothing you can say to change my mind and there's nothing I can say to change yours. All I will say to tail this discussion is that Favors has a lot of room to grow and needs opportunities, and Gasol is playing 3rd fiddle in Memphis as a very young player as well. I don't think you can argue that Jefferson is an ideal partner to help Favors grow, but that's just an opinion I guess and I don't want to derail anymore.
Let's talk about free agents
Let's talk about free agents
billyshelby
Well-Known Member
This is kind of my point. The offense didn't stop when Al had the ball in his hands, it never ran. I'd be on your team if I could remember lots of times Al missed open cutters while he focused on his shot. But that rarely happened.
Last year, we ran the O for 14 seconds. When the cuts didn't work (the most telling reason Bell is a horrible fit in our offense), the ball went to Deron or Al (on the starting unit) and they made something happen. Al's supposed inability to pass really isn't the issue because the other working parts didn't work.
Favors Flave
Well-Known Member
BillyShelby- Don't waste your time with Numberica, he HATES BIG AL
Nah, since something that goes into a black hole is never coming back,it references when you give a player the ball and he is not going to pass it back to anyone.
You are aware that Marc Gasol is the same age as Al Jefferson? Or maybe you meant young in terms of experience.
Experience. And FWIW, he hasn't played as a first or second option in the NBA yet, in addition to never having had a significant injury. In addition to being bigger. In addition to being a more complete basketball player.
Well, I guess if someone was a Jefferson homer, you could spin that argument the other way and say Jefferson has only had 1 year of experience where he wasn't the complete focal point of the offense (besides his early years in Boston). Maybe getting more experience on a team that plays more like a team will help him grow into a more complete player.
Or, he's spent too much time disregarding the importance of team and is an old dog attempting to learn new tricks (and in the scheme of things, Al is not that young. Seven years in the league and however many minutes is seven years in the league and that amount of minutes. Passing is as much or more about timing and precision as it is the pure decision to pass. Al is not old, but for a guy still learning the basics of the game, he's ancient).
Gasol might not ever score 20 PPG, but I'd take that bet over Al learning how to play basketball outside of one-on-one in the post, shooting from 15 feet, or rebound without showing any kind of fundamental skill.
I wonder if people are more sick of reading this or if I'm more sick of talking about it.
Gasol might not ever score 20 PPG, but I'd take that bet over Al learning how to play basketball outside of one-on-one in the post, shooting from 15 feet, or rebound without showing any kind of fundamental skill.
I wonder if people are more sick of reading this or if I'm more sick of talking about it.
Gyp Rosetti
Banned
Sorry, I don't buy it. Jefferson had just 1.8 assists per game last year and that's in 35.9 minutes per game. Hell, he has averaged just 1.3 for his career in 29.8 minutes per contest. Dude's a black hole of monumental proportions. At least Boozer has averaged 2.5 per game for his career and in his seasons with Utah where he was most injury-free, he averaged 3.2, 3.0 and 2.9 per game, far better than anything Jefferson's shown.
The first 40 games this year are make or break for me with Al. He needs to appear in noticeably better shape, get up and down the court better, jump out to something like 10+ rebounds a game and 2+ assists per game over that span, AND show a better commitment to team defense for me to have any faith in him. If he's done that, he's shown me a commitment to himself and the team. If not, he's the same old guy he's always been. A black hole who doesn't show the work ethic and aptitude for team ball that is necessary to win in this league.
I guess it depends on if you are glass half full, or a glass half empty kind of guy. Or, in your case, if you just really hate Jefferson. Ha
billyshelby
Well-Known Member
Everyone agrees KLove is a great passer. Yet on Minnesota, he averaged 2.5 last year. That's much better than Al's 1.8. My argument would be Love should be leading the league in assists at the 4. But Minnesota was 25th in assists last year. 24th the year before, 17th before that, and 26th the year before that. They don't get a lot of assisted baskets on that team.
I don't expect Al to ever become a great passer. But I don't care if he isn't so long as he's a willing passer who can play in a system. For what it's worth, I would point out that in February, Al averaged 24, 11.5, and 2.2 assists shooting 53. He tailed off during the swan song of March, but averaged 3.6 assists in that span of 7 games. If Al was the type of guy trying to beef his numbers in a lost season, I would not expect him to suddenly juice his assist totals.
What gets lost in all this is his skill as a post player. Marc Gasol will never average 23 and 11 for 2 months of any season he ever plays in. He doesn't have Al's skill, and 99% of NBA 4's don't. Al has a killer pump fake, he can go left on the up and under, he can go right with the push shot, and his 14-16 foot jumper is more than respectable. I don't worry about his passing, I worry that the Jazz don't make his setting up lower on the block a priority. If Al is catching the ball 10 feet or in, he can be a flat out machine in the league.
I think this is a critical year for Al. He is obviously going to be our #1 option next year, or 1a. option. I think he really needs to show the Jazz staff he can play winning basketball, because the roster has the talent to surprise people and make a low playoff seed.
billyshelby
Well-Known Member
Kool Aid or not, I think Al is an all star this year. I think he turns into a leader and becomes borderline unstoppable in the post. He's the biggest reason why I believe we'll be in the playoffs next year.
Al was making an effort to pass at the beginning of the year. However, towards the end of the year, there was no one else who really wanted the ball. I'm too lazy to look up his assist numbers for the first 25 games of the season.